Do you think Arizona will go red in the 2008 election? (closing, income)

[miamiman]

I think Arizona will go blue in the next election. With all of the Californians and people from the East Coast and Midwest moving in, it will likely go blue.

I hope the state goes blue solely for the sake of the childern of this state. It is deplorable how little this state spends per child in educational costs. It is also deplorable that this state has a system where students in 12th grade are taught things they should've learned in 9th grade.

I know it's so much easier for a lot of people in this state to just blame illegal immigrants for the poor educational system then to actually be proactive and improving it for all.

[bobinverted]

Originally Posted by miamiman

I think Arizona will go blue in the next election. With all of the Californians and people from the East Coast and Midwest moving in, it will likely go blue.

Just because someone moves from a "Blue State" doesn't mean that they are automatically a Democrat. Remember there are Republicans in California, the East Coast and the Midwest. Unfortunate, but true.

[Ponderosa]

Depends on what "blue" means. If it means voting democrat in the presidential election - it may happen unless Clinton is the nominee. If it means state legislature going democratic - no way. If it means congressional delegation going democrat - no way.

Az is a Goldwater conservative state where tight fiscal policy and limited government are admired but social conservative causes are not. The state legislature is dominated by extremes and does not represent the people much like the US legislature. If you look to referenda, you see the pattern; people vote for smoking bans and reject punitive measures for non-married couples, but do vote in the nation's toughest anti-immigration measures and support limiting taxes.

So going "blue" in a presidential election does not mean any sea change in philosophy. I don't think this is going to change. The people coming from California and the midwest are basically the same politically - fiscally conservative libertarian-light voters. The social conservatives of the south and the eastern liberals move here in far fewer numbers. The successful candidate here is the one perceived as middle-of-road.

[MotleyCrew]

Originally Posted by bobinverted

What's the difference between social security and welfare?

Will the 16 and 17 year old kids working their first jobs today ever see a dime of their payments to social security when they are 65?

Who should have more of a say in the future of their country? A kid who has 67 more years to live in this country or a 67 year old RV enthusiat living off of your taxes?

Why do people keep voting republican when it does them no good?

We have paid into SS for a long time now. Granted that some of the first to receive SS did not pay into the system nearly what they took out, but we have paid over $100K into this system. I would be grateful if the gov would simply give us our money back. How does voting for either party make life better for you? I think they both are found wanting. The Democrats will just raise your taxes until you can pay no more, the Republicans will not hold their feet to the fiscal fire, so what are we left with? Besides, those 67 year old RV guys have paved the way for you kids to live a good life with all the IPODS your hearts desire. Give them a break.

[dwallphx]

Originally Posted by JasonS

So that means everyone that has paid in to social security will be on welfare at some point in their lives? At 65 you should lose your voting right?

Many people believe you shouldn't get your right to vote until you turn 65.

Winston Churchill said, "If you're 20 and not a Liberal, you have no heart. But if you're 40 and still a Liberal, you have no brain."

[sheena]

Originally Posted by miamiman

I think Arizona will go blue in the next election. With all of the Californians and people from the East Coast and Midwest moving in, it will likely go blue.

I hope the state goes blue solely for the sake of the childern of this state. It is deplorable how little this state spends per child in educational costs. It is also deplorable that this state has a system where students in 12th grade are taught things they should've learned in 9th grade.

I know it's so much easier for a lot of people in this state to just blame illegal immigrants for the poor educational system then to actually be proactive and improving it for all.

That was funny.........now seriously what do you think the problem is and what will the dems do to fix it? Open the flood gates wide and pick everyone's pockets?

[ArizonaBear]

Originally Posted by Ponderosa

Depends on what "blue" means. If it means voting democrat in the presidential election - it may happen unless Clinton is the nominee. If it means state legislature going democratic - no way. If it means congressional delegation going democrat - no way.

Az is a Goldwater conservative state where tight fiscal policy and limited government are admired but social conservative causes are not. The state legislature is dominated by extremes and does not represent the people much like the US legislature. If you look to referenda, you see the pattern; people vote for smoking bans and reject punitive measures for non-married couples, but do vote in the nation's toughest anti-immigration measures and support limiting taxes.

So going "blue" in a presidential election does not mean any sea change in philosophy. I don't think this is going to change. The people coming from California and the midwest are basically the same politically - fiscally conservative libertarian-light voters. The social conservatives of the south and the eastern liberals move here in far fewer numbers. The successful candidate here is the one perceived as middle-of-road.

Dayum; Ponderosa-------you and may 'lock horns' over a few issues but your above post hit the proverbial nail on the head!

And; too, what you just described in your 'mini' treatise pretty much explains why I did not do all that well in California, it has gone too 'Lib' even for me......hindsight being 20/20

[ArizonaBear]

Originally Posted by miamiman

I think Arizona will go blue in the next election. With all of the Californians and people from the East Coast and Midwest moving in, it will likely go blue.

I hope the state goes blue solely for the sake of the childern of this state. It is deplorable how little this state spends per child in educational costs. It is also deplorable that this state has a system where students in 12th grade are taught things they should've learned in 9th grade.

I know it's so much easier for a lot of people in this state to just blame illegal immigrants for the poor educational system then to actually be proactive and improving it for all.

I have to disagree there:

Using Mexican-American and Japanese-American students in California prior to WW II as a proxy; the latter did much, much better in school despite sitting side by side in the same classrooms.

Racism or different cultural standards at home? You decide.

[sheena]

Originally Posted by dwallphx

Many people believe you shouldn't get your right to vote until you turn 65.

Winston Churchill said, "If you're 20 and not a Liberal, you have no heart. But if you're 40 and still a Liberal, you have no brain."

I love that saying, it reminds me of myself.

[wit-nit]

Vegas odds are it comes down to Hillary vs Guillani at election time. Hillary wins!!!