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So from your link, 'The golden rule is an important philosophical principle, which has been formulated in various ways by many different groups throughout history', yet you just called it fake.
Also true for hate, pain, fear, hunger. Our nature is not these, our nature is to survive so we can pass on our genes, and these attributes (including love) is how we achieve that goal.
Then all those people who decide to not have children, who cannot have children, do not like children, who abuse children, are all what - do not achieve the goal to survive? Their lives are meaningless?
So if our nature is not joy, empathy, and kindness and other humane qualities, where do you get them from? Most others would point to their religion.
I find atheists have this deep attachment to the Golden Rule. They seem to come out in numbers to protect it every time this comes up, I have noticed. It seems not just a guiding principle but their very doctrine. Am I right?
Yes, Golden Rule is all about Me, Me, Me. Do is addressed to ME.
I am done with this simplistic selfish statement that has no depth. No more response from me about this. Move on.
It is what it says. It places the ME front and center. The darker side of the not-golden rule is revenge, tit for tat. Revenge may be the thing in some religions, but others consider revenge as resulting in suffering for all, as soul destroying. Jesus obviously meant something more that quid pro quo.
Respect for ME is what accrues based on actions, it is earned. It cannot be bought as quid pro quo.
It takes a full and complete brain and the use of it to understand why the golden rule is not what it seems. It is fake. Just because it has been often repeated unthinkingly it does not have the value attributed to it unthinkingly.
Then all those people who decide to not have children, who cannot have children, do not like children, who abuse children, are all what - do not achieve the goal to survive? Their lives are meaningless?
So if our nature is not joy, empathy, and kindness and other humane qualities, where do you get them from? Most others would point to their religion.
I find atheists have this deep attachment to the Golden Rule. They seem to come out in numbers to protect it every time this comes up, I have noticed. It seems not just a guiding principle but their very doctrine. Am I right?
Yes, Golden Rule is all about Me, Me, Me. Do is addressed to ME.
I am done with this simplistic selfish statement that has no depth. No more response from me about this. Move on.
Actually, in my real life, I have almost exclusively heard the Golden Rule discussed by christians.
One of the things that you should consider is that a wide variety of posters here -- religious and atheist -- say that you don't get it. Perhaps you should actually think about that...and I do mean THINK about that, rather than being so stubbornly attached to your own view.
I came across someone in another area of the forum that seemed to believe that "The Golden Rule" was unique to Christianity, or maybe just a statement in the Bible in general. I didn't bother attempting to educate this member, as it didn't seem worthwhile or that it would go anywhere.
I learned some time ago, that many religions have that "rule", and although worded not exactly, it amounts to the exact same thing. The "rule" has a very interesting history. I chose this article(has a list of 17), although there are many others:
"Mentioned as early as 3,000 BC".................I do think, not mentioned enough anymore. Whether one has any religious beliefs or not, it is a worthwhile endeavor as a member of the human race. Golden Rule
We find the Bible's Golden Rule at Leviticus 19:18.
But remember Jesus gave a unique New Commandment found at John 13:34-35.
To have the same un-selfish self-sacrificing love for others as Jesus has.
In other words, we are now to love neighbor MORE than self. More than the Golden Rule.
We find the Bible's Golden Rule at Leviticus 19:18.
But remember Jesus gave a unique New Commandment found at John 13:34-35.
To have the same un-selfish self-sacrificing love for others as Jesus has.
In other words, we are now to love neighbor MORE than self. More than the Golden Rule.
Too bad you don't seem to realize that the term neighbor is generic and means ANY other human being, NOT just your special select people who are like you!
it can just as easily be said that the view above is tainted by the idea of an uncaring universe, and you are imposing your wishes onto it that humans are weak communal apes.
No, because 1) we have no evidence the universe has human feelings, 2) we have no known mechanism for how a universe can have human feelings, 3) bugs, bacteria and beasts that must kill others to survive is not the sign of a caring universe, 4) we know if you were to go anywhere else than on the surface of the earth without protective clothing, you will die, and 5) most of us know we are 5a) weak, 5b) communal, and 5c) apes.
Perhaps if you think about what you are posting instead of just blindly saying the opposite, people would take you more seriously.
Why, so you can once again just ignore it instead of admitting you made an error? OK, just for you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
It is what it says. It places the ME front and center. The darker side of the not-golden rule is revenge, tit for tat. Revenge may be the thing in some religions, but others consider revenge as resulting in suffering for all, as soul destroying. Jesus obviously meant something more that quid pro quo.
Respect for ME is what accrues based on actions, it is earned. It cannot be bought as quid pro quo.
It takes a full and complete brain and the use of it to understand why the golden rule is not what it seems.It is fake. Just because it has been often repeated unthinkingly it does not have the value attributed to it unthinkingly.
Then all those people who decide to not have children, who cannot have children, do not like children, who abuse children, are all what - do not achieve the goal to survive? Their lives are meaningless?
Yet those people who can not have children are still driven to have sex. Why is that? The same for the others on your list, they still want to have sex. Because this desire is innate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
So if our nature is not joy, empathy, and kindness and other humane qualities, where do you get them from?
Again you misrepresent me. I never said joy, empathy, and kindness and other humane qualities were not part of human nature. I implicitly included them when I said the negatives were also part of our nature.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
Most others would point to their religion.
Can you be consistent for once? First they are innate, now one gets them from religion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
I find atheists have this deep attachment to the Golden Rule. They seem to come out in numbers to protect it every time this comes up, I have noticed. It seems not just a guiding principle but their very doctrine. Am I right?
Apart from the hyperbole, yes, you are correct. Most religious people also have a deep attachment. Only you appear to have a problem with it. If only most religious people were as wise as you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
Yes, Golden Rule is all about Me, Me, Me. Do is addressed to ME.
No, it is about how to 'do unto others'. That it's ultimate goal is self protection does not negate that it is about how to treat others.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
I am done with this simplistic selfish statement that has no depth. No more response from me about this. Move on.
Her army destroyed, General CB crawls away, dying of her wounds, and with a last defiant croak, cries "I ... cough, cough, I won, the war is over".
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Why is that? The same for the others on your list, they still want to have sex. Because this desire is innate.
