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Enlightenment is clearly a high goal worthy of time, focus, and effort.
I'd also put attitude - healthy attitude - along with that, as a key attribute as one navigates through all there is in life. Not hating others, not immediately shutting down possibilities in the universe, keeping an open mind, keeping receptive with all senses alert, staying positive, being helpful, etc. Also putting value in every day and every moment - being present - to avoid the mechanicalness of the masses and time.
I try not to stop and think I've reached any goal. I see it as continuous, and won't stop until the last breath.
After reading all the comments posted in this thread so far, many that resonate with me one way or another, I'll add to this one, because although this comment is not in complete alignment with my thinking, I very much appreciate and embrace what is written here about attitude...
Additionally, my wife has been a vegetarian most of the time we've been married, and I respect vegetarians and their love of animals. No one loves animals more than my wife does, and I'm a big fan of animals, nature too. So why do I eat meat sometimes?
I wonder if my approach to life as my life also "approaches its denouement" can be considered "enlightened" even though I am an atheist, and I too sometimes think these claims of enlightenment are somewhat less than modest. I don't find myself in search of "enlightenment" like some, or more in the way of understanding, the awareness I already enjoy. I look around at nature, what we can see and/or know about the universe, the animals, and I am at peace with being a part just like the animals are. Without needing or thinking there must be more. Is it not to be at peace that might be considered the ultimate goal? Along with living a life of being kind and considerate to others. To be at peace and to "live and let live?"
I look at nature for guidance in many respects, including that of eating meat. Look at nature and many an animal eats meat regardless the pain and suffering of the prey. In fact, many if not most of the animals slaughtered for purposes of providing meat to humans don't suffer anything like animals that are eaten by other animals, so what's right or wrong? Nature seems to say it's okay to eat meat. This is why in part I'm more inclined to promote "humane" treatment of animals than to become a vegetarian.
That said, we have unwelcomed critters who visit our property on occasion. Namely rats and mice, but I stopped killing them long ago. I made a catch-and-release trap so that I can catch them and rather than kill them, I can transport them to an open space not too far from where we live. I have often done so and immediately seen a hawk swoop down on the newcomer and almost make off with them for their next meal. Such is the way nature deems appropriate, and who am I to argue? Hawks need to eat too.
For whatever any of this is worth, and thanks Phinney for an interesting thread!
After reading all the comments posted in this thread so far, many that resonate with me one way or another, I'll add to this one, because although this comment is not in complete alignment with my thinking, I very much appreciate and embrace what is written here about attitude...
Additionally, my wife has been a vegetarian most of the time we've been married, and I respect vegetarians and their love of animals. No one loves animals more than my wife does, and I'm a big fan of animals, nature too. So why do I eat meat sometimes?
I wonder if my approach to life as my life also "approaches its denouement" can be considered "enlightened" even though I am an atheist, and I too sometimes think these claims of enlightenment are somewhat less than modest. I don't find myself in search of "enlightenment" like some, or more in the way of understanding, the awareness I already enjoy. I look around at nature, what we can see and/or know about the universe, the animals, and I am at peace with being a part just like the animals are. Without needing or thinking there must be more. Is it not to be at peace that might be considered the ultimate goal? Along with living a life of being kind and considerate to others. To be at peace and to "live and let live?"
I look at nature for guidance in many respects, including that of eating meat. Look at nature and many an animal eats meat regardless the pain and suffering of the prey. In fact, many if not most of the animals slaughtered for purposes of providing meat to humans don't suffer anything like animals that are eaten by other animals, so what's right or wrong? Nature seems to say it's okay to eat meat, and as a human I'm more inclined to promote "humane" treatment of animals than to become a vegetarian.
That said, we have unwelcomed critters who visit our property on occasion. Namely rats and mice, but I stopped killing them long ago. I made a catch-and-release trap so that I can catch them and rather than kill them, I can transport them to an open space not too far from where we live.
For whatever any of this is worth, and thanks Phinney for an interesting thread!
Sincerely -- LM
It is an erroneous belief that avoiding meat has anything to do with being an "animal lover" whatever that means
Vegetarian is a healthier diet. Eating a lot of meat is not. That is the simple answer. There are more complex ones.
Lions eat meat, yes. Cows and elephants don't. Rhinos don't. Not sure you are getting the right "guidance from Nature." Animals cannot farm and grow grain and what not. So they do with what nature guides them to do. Humans have more choices.
Be at peace.
That said, we have unwelcomed critters who visit our property on occasion. Namely rats and mice, but I stopped killing them long ago. I made a catch-and-release trap so that I can catch them and rather than kill them, I can transport them to an open space not too far from where we live. I have often done so and immediately seen a hawk swoop down on the newcomer and almost make off with them for their next meal. Such is the way nature deems appropriate, and who am I to argue? Hawks need to eat too.
...
Good for you. Thus far I have trapped and rehomed 7 rabbits which were destroying all sorts of plants around my house, including cactuses! I wouldn't think of poisoning them.
It is an erroneous belief that avoiding meat has anything to do with being an "animal lover" whatever that means
Vegetarian is a healthier diet. Eating a lot of meat is not. That is the simple answer. There are more complex ones.
Lions eat meat, yes. Cows and elephants don't. Rhinos don't. Not sure you are getting the right "guidance from Nature." Animals cannot farm and grow grain and what not. So they do with what nature guides them to do. Humans have more choices.
Be at peace.
Again you are stepping into it...
If you read and understood the OP, the reason for being a vegetarian is because of a love and/or concern for the animals. This is the reason my wife is a vegetarian as well, although you are at least partly correct that a healthy diet is another consideration. My wife is a big lover of animals and also a "health nut," but there is nothing "erroneous" about vegetarians being vegetarians out of concern for the well-being of animals.
Do yourself a favor and Google for this information if you want to learn a little something before going off half-cocked again.
Not to mention that the more interesting aspects about being "enlightened" in the OP's comment and mine seem to have missed your notice. Always in favor of being argumentative it would seem. What a thing.
If you read and understood the OP, the reason for being a vegetarian is because of a love and/or concern for the animals. This is the reason my wife is a vegetarian as well, although you are at least partly correct that a healthy diet is another consideration. My wife is a big lover of animals and also a "health nut," but there is nothing "erroneous" about vegetarians being vegetarians out of concern for the well-being of animals.
Do yourself a favor and Google for this information if you want to learn a little something before going off half-cocked again.
Not to mention that the more interesting aspects about being "enlightened" in the OP's comment and mine seem to have missed your notice. Always in favor of being argumentative it would seem. What a thing.
I agree. In Thai Buddhism, those who practice vegetarianism (which is NOT most monks) do so for the sake of the animals...it's a Precept not to harm living beings. My doctors strongly advised against vegetarianism for me, so I have reduced my meat eating to one meal per day. That's the best I can do.
Good for you. Thus far I have trapped and rehomed 7 rabbits which were destroying all sorts of plants around my house, including cactuses! I wouldn't think of poisoning them.
My wife and I estimate my count to be at about 20 now. We always enjoy having a look at these rather cute little creatures before relocating them. Rabbits would be a treat, though I suppose too many would be tough on any garden. We had one show up in our yard awhile ago, and it was the cutest little thing anyone could imagine. We named it "Bunches." How it got to our yard, we'll never know, but for about a year it would appear every afternoon to feed from a bowl of rabbit food I would put out for it. Then just like that it was gone and never to be seen here again. Never any other rabbits either.
We live in between two state parks easy walking distance from us. Sometimes when we walk through the one north of us, we'll see rabbits, and we're quite sure this must be where Bunches migrated from, but the distance and the many houses between us and the park make that migration damn near impossible. Still, we'd love to see another Bunches adopt our home as his own again.
My wife and I estimate my count to be at about 20 now. We always enjoy having a look at these rather cute little creatures before relocating them. Rabbits would be a treat, though I suppose too many would be tough on any garden. We had one show up in our yard awhile ago, and it was the cutest little thing anyone could imagine. We named it "Bunches." How it got to our yard, we'll never know, but for about a year it would appear every afternoon to feed from a bowl of rabbit food I would put out for it. Then just like that it was gone and never to be seen here again. Never any other rabbits either.
We live in between two state parks easy walking distance from us. Sometimes when we walk through the one north of us, we'll see rabbits, and we're quite sure this must be where Bunches migrated from, but the distance and the many houses between us and the park make that migration damn near impossible. Still, we'd love to see another Bunches adopt our home as his own again.
I have a threshold. Up to 2 rabbits is fine...not much damage...no need to do anything. When it gets above 2, then I trap and relocate to a slightly wilder environment just about a mile away.
My own enlightenment is found in TWO sayings. I don't recall WHO said them, but they are as follows:
1. The more I learn, the more I realize, how little I know...AND...
2. Everything (everyone!) has its beauty. Not everyone sees it.
If enlightenment has anything to do with truth, then I find truth for ALL in both quotes.
"A Great Challenge in Life: Knowing enough to think you are right, but not knowing enough to know you are wrong." - Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson
I agree, but let's also be sure to give some credit to knowing as much as we can about what matters. What we don't know should not keep us from making good use of what we do know. For me enlightenment has a great deal to do with truth, if enlightenment is the word of choice here. My sister is one to often say "life is beautiful," and that's a nice thought or way of looking at things, but I can't believe that's true for everyone. For some, life is a very painful ordeal that many of us are lucky never to know. I suppose this is why I'm not big on some of these blanket statements or generalities that we should all know may apply to some but not everyone.
"A Great Challenge in Life: Knowing enough to think you are right, but not knowing enough to know you are wrong." - Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson
Good quote from Tyson, but the bold seems the main stumbling block for most!!
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Good quote from Tyson, but the bold seems the main stumbling block for most!!
