Should WMATA extend its service to Baltimore to connect with the MTA? (Germantown: live in, cost)

[bufflove]

The problem is BWI is still 20+ miles away from Greenbelt and there's almost no density for worthwhile stations anywhere in between. Heavy rail costs $250m+ per mile (and that's assuming we're talking about above-ground lines the whole way) so a cost of about 5 billion (with a "b") dollars, plus operating expenses in order to effectively double the length of the green line. It makes no sense and would be cheaper to provide everyone in DC a free taxi ride and masseuse anytime they want to go to or from BWI.

Not to mention you don't need to transfer between metro and MARC, like you claim, as MARC picks up right at Union Station. Of course some might choose to continue on to other parts of the DC area via other metro lines found in downtown DC, but of course that's true in your scenario as well, with some choosing to transfer to/from the Green line in downtown DC.

[PurpleHaze1100]

Originally Posted by bufflove

The problem is BWI is still 20+ miles away from Greenbelt and there's almost no density for worthwhile stations anywhere in between. Heavy rail costs $250m+ per mile (and that's assuming we're talking about above-ground lines the whole way) so a cost of about 5 billion (with a "b") dollars, plus operating expenses in order to effectively double the length of the green line. It makes no sense and would be cheaper to provide everyone in DC a free taxi ride and masseuse anytime they want to go to or from BWI.

Not to mention you don't need to transfer between metro and MARC, like you claim, as MARC picks up right at Union Station. Of course some might choose to continue on to other parts of the DC area via other metro lines found in downtown DC, but of course that's true in your scenario as well, with some choosing to transfer to/from the Green line in downtown DC.

Once again this thread isn't to bash or criticize its simply an idea. Its not like our tax dollars are actually going to go into this. I never said transferring from metro to marc was the only way to BWI, I said the idea would be targeted by DC area commuters who didn't want to use or transfer to marc to get to BWI. I also said the marc service to BWI is not frequent enough. There's plenty of density north of Greenbelt. South Laurel, Maryland City, Annapolis Junction, Fort Meade, Arundel Mills, ETC. All the places I just listed can be future stations for the green line if it were ever extended to BWI.

[diablo234]

Originally Posted by bmoreboy25

The point would be to give a direct connection from DC's metro rail system to BWI without DC area residents having to transfer trains just to get to the airport that serve the DC region. I am well aware that MARC serves BWI but the service is not frequent, and serves stations with low ridership. I mean Baltimore's Light Rail connects to BWI and Marc as well and they have just as many riders on both lines. This isn't to criticize or bash. Its just an idea. Maybe extending Green Line from Greenbelt to BWI, maybe not all the way into Baltimore but at least BWI with stations being added to Howard County and BWI area. Definitely would increase ridership.

I would not say that MARC has low ridership especially given the fact that several stations such as Odenton and Halethorpe have their parking lots filled to capacity during the week. Besides for the same cost as building a Green Line extension or for even less added expense you could have also increased the frequency of the MARC trains to run every half hour similar to NJT or the LIRR which would be much more cost effective as opposed to extending the Green Line which would just run through low density areas anyway.

Besides the existing Metro system is having enough capacity issues as it is and the first priority should be giving the Blue Line it's own right of way as opposed to sharing right of way with the Orange and future Silver Line which would cause capacity and congestion issues.

[bufflove]

Originally Posted by bmoreboy25

Once again this thread isn't to bash or criticize its simply an idea. Its not like our tax dollars are actually going to go into this. I never said transferring from metro to marc was the only way to BWI, I said the idea would be targeted by DC area commuters who didn't want to use or transfer to marc to get to BWI. I also said the marc service to BWI is not frequent enough. There's plenty of density north of Greenbelt. South Laurel, Maryland City, Annapolis Junction, Fort Meade, Arundel Mills, ETC. All the places I just listed can be future stations for the green line if it were ever extended to BWI.

I'm not trying to bash or criticize; I'm trying to explain why the idea doesn't make sense. It appears I've failed.

P.S. I've lived in MD for 30 years and had never heard of Maryland City until just now, so thanks for that, at least.

[MacSmooth]

Originally Posted by bufflove

P.S. I've lived in MD for 30 years and had never heard of Maryland City until just now, so thanks for that, at least.

Maryland City is the community along the Anne Arundel County part of 198 between the BW Parkway and Laurel Racetrack. Most just called it the Anne Arundel County part of Laurel (Maryland City falls under Laurel zip codes). It's the area that has the Walmart, Target and all of the lower end hotels/motels.

[MacSmooth]

Originally Posted by bmoreboy25

Once again this thread isn't to bash or criticize its simply an idea. Its not like our tax dollars are actually going to go into this. I never said transferring from metro to marc was the only way to BWI, I said the idea would be targeted by DC area commuters who didn't want to use or transfer to marc to get to BWI. I also said the marc service to BWI is not frequent enough. There's plenty of density north of Greenbelt. South Laurel, Maryland City, Annapolis Junction, Fort Meade, Arundel Mills, ETC. All the places I just listed can be future stations for the green line if it were ever extended to BWI.

How frequently are you trying to run trains to BWI? Marc's Penn Line has 26 trains that run from Union Station in DC to BWI Airport every day. It runs two trains per hour during the morning rush (6:30-9:30), a train every hour during the middle of the day (9:30-3:30), two trains per hour during the evening rush (3:30-7:30) and then three more late trains with the last one arriving at BWI right after 11:00 pm.

The areas that you mention for possible Green Line stations are dense areas, here are the issues that I see with each one:

South Laurel - already served by MARC in three places. South Laurel is less than 5 miles away from Bowie State MARC Station (Penn Line), Muirkirk MARC Station (Camden Line) and Laurel MARC Station (Camden Line).

Maryland City - already served by MARC in two places. Laurel MARC Station (Camden Line) is less than three miles away and Savage MARC Station (Camden Line) is less than four miles away.

Annapolis Junction - already served by MARC in two places. Savage MARC Station (Camden Line) is one mile away (that's a 10-15 minute walk) and Jessup MARC Station (Camden Line) is less than three miles away

Fort Meade - already served by MARC in two places. Savage MARC Station (Camden Line) is less than four miles away and Odenton MARC Station (Penn Line) is like than five miles away. Also this area is dense, but you have to keep in mind, the majority of people in this area either live on base or live in the suburbs adjacent to the base (Laurel, Savage, Jessup, Severn, Odenton and Hanover). So there wouldn't be a demand or desire for a Metro Station. Plus given the agencies in the area and on base (National Security Agency, US Cyber Command, Defense Information Systems Agency, etc), I'm sure Metro would be very limited in where they could locate a potential station.

Arundel Mills - This would be the only station that I could partly agree with you on because of the Maryland Live! Casino and Arundel Mills. But once again this area is served in two places by MARC. The Dorsey MARC Station (Camden Line) is less than 4 miles away and the BWI Airport MARC Station (Penn Line) is 5 miles away.

[soug]

Ignoring everything else about the density along the lines, etc, a quick google search shows that DC to Dulles is 27 miles, 34 minutes, while DC to BWI is 32 miles, 46 minutes. Interesting to note that BWI isn't that much farther from DC than Dulles is. I suppose it's more a critique of building the Silver Line all the way to Dulles than an endorsement of extending the Green Line to BWI.

Marc needs a ton of work before it's up to par for what a commuter train should be. Having legit stations at every stop would be a good first step.

[diablo234]

Originally Posted by soug

Marc needs a ton of work before it's up to par for what a commuter train should be. Having legit stations at every stop would be a good first step.

MARC has been rebuilding several stations in addition to expanding parking and encouraging transit orientated development around various stations such as Odenton and Savage. In fact they have recently rebuilt the Halethorpe station and are currently rebuilding the BWI Airport, West Baltimore, Germantown, and Savage MARC stations in addition to starting weekend service on the Penn Line.

http://mta.maryland.gov/sites/defaul...lan%20full.pdf

[Joke Insurance]

This fantasy Green Line map via Google Maps was made about 5 years ago. What do you all think?

http://goo.gl/maps/mrHBh

[VintageChristmas]

OR if you live in Baltimore, and work in DC, you can skip all the nonsense and get in your car and drive one hour to work everyday as I have for the past 5 years because the current system would take over 3 hours including transfers. Enough said!!!! WMATA Metrorail needs to expand to downtown Baltimore ---- to DC