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Part of the reason I don't live in a city. Who wants to deal with all that congestion on a daily basis? =P
You seem to have it backwards. Living in the city you don't have to deal with traffic congestion because you can walk, bike or take transit. There's many different ways to get around. Most who live in SF, NYC, HK don't even own a car. But in the suburbs you have no choice. Driving is the only way to get around, and everyone is constantly driving all the time which creates a lot of traffic congestion and gridlock. There's traffic congestion in the cities too but if you're not driving then you don't have to worry about it, do you? (Much of the car traffic in the cities is from tourist car rentals, taxis, people commuting from the suburbs, etc.)
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Originally Posted by doc1
You need to take a crash course in "Advertising".
What for? To learn how to be a sleazy car salesman? Nah I think I'll pass.
Living in the city you don't have to deal with traffic congestion because you can walk, bike or take transit. There's many different ways to get around. Most who live in SF, NYC, HK don't even own a car. But in the suburbs you have no choice.
I thought we'd covered this already ad nauseam: transit doesn't go everywhere people need to go, and you can bike, walk and take transit in the suburbs, too.
You seem to have it backwards. Living in the city you don't have to deal with traffic congestion because you can walk, bike or take transit. There's many different ways to get around. Most who live in SF, NYC, HK don't even own a car. But in the suburbs you have no choice. Driving is the only way to get around, and everyone is constantly driving all the time which creates a lot of traffic congestion and gridlock. There's traffic congestion in the cities too but if you're not driving then you don't have to worry about it, do you? (Much of the car traffic in the cities is from tourist car rentals, taxis, people commuting from the suburbs, etc.)
I lived in Arlington, VA for a few years, plenty of people have cars, the traffic is bad, and being jammed on a train, bus, and/or waiting for 40 minutes because the trian broke down AGAIN is no better than sitting in a car in traffic.
Also, as another poster stated, the mass transit system is limited, and it is much more efficient to drive many times. Using DC as an example; for four people, to go from Ballston, to the Fashion Center, then stop in Clarendon at Whole Foods, then back to Ballston; it would cost $30 just for this trip, for two people $15 dollars for this trip, ridiculous, and that is if they keep with those places; what if someone wants to stop by a small shop in Alexandria while they are out near it?
Seems a few people like you think that people should just be orderly robots, go to work, come home, and sit and/or only roam around their immediate area. You think all trips should be well planned in advance, and that it is odd for someone to want to go somewhere on the spur of the moment.
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Despite the traffic, I enjoy the trip to work and back which is more scenic than most commercials. We live on a wooded plateau, go down the hill and drive alongside a large lake with Bald Eagles often hanging out in the trees. When hitting the freeway we see the snow-capped Olympic Mountains in the background, then cross Lake Washington with Mt. Rainier on the left. On the way home, it's the reverse with Mt. Rainier on the right but also views of Mt. Baker off to the left.
I lived in Arlington, VA for a few years, plenty of people have cars, the traffic is bad, and being jammed on a train, bus, and/or waiting for 40 minutes because the trian broke down AGAIN is no better than sitting in a car in traffic.
Also, as another poster stated, the mass transit system is limited, and it is much more efficient to drive many times. Using DC as an example; for four people, to go from Ballston, to the Fashion Center, then stop in Clarendon at Whole Foods, then back to Ballston; it would cost $30 just for this trip, for two people $15 dollars for this trip, ridiculous, and that is if they keep with those places; what if someone wants to stop by a small shop in Alexandria while they are out near it?
Seems a few people like you think that people should just be orderly robots, go to work, come home, and sit and/or only roam around their immediate area. You think all trips should be well planned in advance, and that it is odd for someone to want to go somewhere on the spur of the moment.
Your last paragraph sums up my thoughts exactly. I always wondered about these people who think we should all live without cars- these people are happy being confined to their corner of their city, never needing to go anywhere that a bus or train can't take them. That works for them and that's great, but they need to stop trying to force us to live the same way! I know for a fact that there are no buses or trains going to the remote hiking trails up in the mountains that I go to on a regular basis, or out to the small coastal towns that I go to on some weekends, or to any of the many random places outside of my metro area to do photography.
So if we were forced to use public transit instead of our car, if the wife and I wanted to take the baby and go to the waterfront for a picnic and then stop at Babies R Us, Target, and then the grocery store on the way home it would be a huge ordeal to plan and make work at all considering the cost, trying to plan out the routes, and trying to figure out how to handle hauling home all the goods that we picked up at each of those places along with the stroller and picnic items we brought from home, what a mess it would be! This would cause us to just give up on doing many of these things that are so easily done using a car. How depressing and stifling it would be to have to live like that!!
2 or 3 o'clock in the morning? I guess that's one way to save your sanity. Daytime driving is very stressful. It's no wonder people are constantly shooting each other on the roads and freeways, or threatening to, getting into fights and shouting matches, etc. I once witnessed a truck driver getting out of his semi truck, approach the car in front of him that was stopped at a light on a freeway offramp and punched in the front driver side window, shattering it with his bare fist, while shouting obscenities at the driver. He was angry because he thought the car was going too slow. The cops came and arrested the truck driver. I later found out he broke every bone in his hand when he punched in the window but didn't feel it at the time because he was high on meth. One of the scariest things I ever saw, but sadly wasn't the first time I came across and witnessed a road rage incident.
What about all the people tripping balls in the buses and subways? I don't think truck drivers have a monopoly on travelling while on drugs.
I thought we'd covered this already ad nauseam: transit doesn't go everywhere people need to go, and you can bike, walk and take transit in the suburbs, too.
Yup.
I cover a nine-county area for work, which includes San Francisco county. Even within San Francisco, transit isn't always an option. Like say I want to get from SF General to Marina. That's 4.5 miles. Takes 20-40 minutes in a car depending on time of day (traffic) or an hour by transit. A fricking hour. Either way, car wins for that trip. Half to two thirds the time, done in the comfort of my own car, I enjoy driving the streets of San Francisco. Now, if it's SF General to the Financial District. Screw driving. It might be marginally faster than hoofing it to BART, but by the time you find the parking garage it's not like you're going to save any time.
That's one of the nine counties. The other nine, the transit isn't anywhere near so good. Take last Friday. Santa Rosa (downtown) is three hours by transit from San Francisco or an hour's drive. From there, I hopped over to Sacramento (downtown). That's five hours by transit or about a two hour drive (always hit some traffic on 37/80, even in the middle of the day). Considering I left Santa Rosa at noon and needed to be in Sacramento by 3... How's transit really going to work?
Given transit won't work and I'm going to be driving a lot anyway, why would I pay San Francisco's astronomical rents? It takes me 10 minutes to go 4.5 miles here rather than 30-40 during the day (or an hour if relying on transit). Sure, it's more spread out. Fresno is 40 miles farther than San Francisco, but there's no rushour. Even on 99, the world's stupidest highway, it takes an hour less time than to get into San Francisco during rush hour.
You seem to have it backwards. Living in the city you don't have to deal with traffic congestion because you can walk, bike or take transit.
Yeah, you can walk... and deal with congestion, both on the sidewalk and crossing the street. You can bike and deal with congestion. You can take transit, and deal with all sorts of things, including congestion. Any time you have more users than the infrastructure can comfortably support, you get congestion -- it's not restricted to any one mode of travel.
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Driving is the only way to get around, and everyone is constantly driving all the time which creates a lot of traffic congestion and gridlock.
No, everyone is not constantly driving all the time in the suburbs. And it's not constant gridlock, any more than it is in cities.
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What for? To learn how to be a sleazy car salesman? Nah I think I'll pass.
To learn how to be a sleazy advertiser. Advertising is different than sales.
That's not the point. Doesn't matter if you're commuting in rush hour, or just driving to Walmart on the weekend. Driving in the real world is rarely as picturesque and romantic as it is usually depicted in the car commercials.
Well duh! /thread
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