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But the links have provided opinion from people living in the countryside 12 months a year as well as from focus groups and political representatives paid to reflect the concerns of the local community. Pretending that the accumulation of second homes in the countryside isn't an issue of concern that has severely affected community cohesion is bizarre. If you were to say it's an issue that has been blown out of proportion or were to provide a counter argument stating the case for second home buyers in the countryside then fair enough, but you haven't. You've just rebuffed anyone else's opinion and elevated your heresay to final word on the issue. Dismissing an argument is one thing but pretending an issue doesn't exist when it so clearly does? Very strange.
You want facts?
Statement by Dan Rogerson, North Cornwall MP "Vast numbers of good family homes are left empty throughout the weekdays and the winters". Whilst 20-50 per cent of the properties that lie empty the majority of the year are second homes. In the village of Gerrans, on the Roseland Peninsula the local
school is struggling to survive as pupil numbers are whittled down to a number of just 40. http://www.thisiscornwall.co.uk/news/MP-s-plea-law-limit-second-home-ownership/article-1950611-detail/article.html
Is Second Home Ownership Killing The Countryside? Well, there is a significant percentage of people who agree with your opinion that it is not. The trouble is they're in the minority of 26% according to this online Countryfile poll Is second home ownership killing rural communities? | Countryfile Magazine where an overwhelming majority of 74% agree that second home owners are having a detrimental effect on country life.
Look, I have no doubt you have a far superior knowledge than me when it comes to an understanding of country life in the UK. But the countryside is such a wide, expansive place that encompasses such a vast array of different regions that I struggle to see how one man's personal opinon that everything is fine and dandy trumps such a vociferous lobby of contention against the destruction of communities in countryside areas. But I'm sure you'll explain why it does. With plenty of 'hard facts' of course.
Last edited by Fear&Whiskey; 08-26-2010 at 02:55 PM..
There are hotspots where there are many second homes, as I already said.
Your assertion that the whole of the countyside is a ghost town is clearly an overstatement, as in your quote;
Alot of the unique and charismatic things about England have been neutralised somewhat by the unrepentant tide of gentrification and middle-of-the-road sterilisation of once beautiful places.The countryside is a virtual ghost town during the week now until such time as the transpants from the City of London feel they may want to 'get away' or 'view their investments' and it is becoming less and less common to find invidual character traits or the type of charismatic people that used to have a great sense of humour in the UK.
Given the amount of News Articles and complaints from long term residents I don't see that it was an overtatement at all. In fact, many people agree with that description and have gone alot further, stating that second homes are in fact 'killing the countryside'. Seventy-four per cent agree according to Countryfile so I don't see how anything I've said can possibly be construed as overstating the facts. During the week especially, this is increasingly the case.
Anyway, I think my point is made and I've provided links, facts and evidence to explain the point I was making. I don't see what more I can add. If you want to break everything down to the minutiae of tenuosity for tenuosity's sake be my guest. You can even hand over your case file and evidence log to Judge Judy or the Countryside Alliance for all I care. I'm done here.
Last edited by Fear&Whiskey; 08-26-2010 at 04:41 PM..
Since we were asked about English people, the other - very different - nations of the UK are not strictly relevant, but even within England there are huge differences, as some people have hinted. I don't want to get into stereotypes, but I think that - on the whole - people in the South East are pretty reserved in general, and, incidentally, don't seem to me to have much sense of humour either, or they wouldn't vote tory (but perhaps that is the famous English irony?). By and large it gets friendlier as you move North, but don't bet on it - communities differ as much as individuals, and Americans can find our accents everywhere difficult, for they vary, I think, much more widely than do American ones. If we are allowed to accept the American muddle for a moment, we in Cymru ('Whales' as so many Americans write), come in at least two types. Out in the country, particularly in the North, the people are pretty closed in, because they are swamped with hordes of bawling holidaymakers who speak a different language. The people in the South, on the other hand, are immensely friendly but also as nosey as people come: you'll be lucky if they ask you nothing worse than what you earn! But then, until the 'twenties, we had a higher (proportional) rate of immigration than the States themselves, so perhaps similar forces are at work.
Reading this thread sort of reminds me of all the comments on the U.S. forums about "rude" New Englanders, "stoic" Minnesotans, etc.
It seems if you're from the US South or Midwest, reservedness can bve mistaken for rudeness. Is that often the case I wonder?
I prefer open friendliness. I've also noticed that being in new places, it is a LOT easier for me to make new friends in the South and in smaller towns vs larger Northeast cities regardless of its a place full of transients or a long established community. I've been to London a long time ago (back in 1996 or 1997 I believe when I was still in middle school) and had a good time. I do remember in the European countries we visited, the Germans were the most stoic and for lack of a better word uptight though there were certainly exceptions!
London seemed friendly enough for a big city actually, I remember people were very patient with our unfamiliarity with the British pound and counting change very slowly and automatically offered to help us on the Underground when we looked very confused looking at a map! This would never happen in New York.
While I'm on this thread, there is something I've wondered about Britain. On the one hand, Britain is seen as a very cultured and civilzied society where conformity and protocol is very important, on the other hand British soccer fans are known for being some of the most drunk and violent and I've also heard that British people (and Irish too) tend to drink a lot more than people in America that that pub culture is more prevalent in England than in the U.S. How do people reconcile these contrasting images? Is soccer just a time to "let loose" a little over there?
While I'm on this thread, there is something I've wondered about Britain. On the one hand, Britain is seen as a very cultured and civilzied society where conformity and protocol is very important, on the other hand British soccer fans are known for being some of the most drunk and violent and I've also heard that British people (and Irish too) tend to drink a lot more than people in America that that pub culture is more prevalent in England than in the U.S. How do people reconcile these contrasting images? Is soccer just a time to "let loose" a little over there?
Different cultures. I think that Americans who drink drink more and stronger stuff. British people are reserved, so they get pissed out of their minds to stop being that thing, and then forget it next day. The football fans are being what they think of as 'working class', Thatcher and her janissaries having reduced decent people's grandchildren to this. It is extremely sad.
To ask a Brittish subject how much he/she earns a year is considered a rude question in the U.K and is considered a private matter.
I'm an American, and I find this question to be rude. It's none of anyone else business, and only to ultra insecure people would it really matter to you what your neighbors make.
That said, I also lived in the UK, and have a Scottish born and bred husband. As a rule, the culture is more reserved. I noticed it most about religion. They keep to themselves about their faith and we americans are quite gregarious. and really, in the world of WAY TOO MUCH INFORMATION (I mean really, I don't need to know via facebook, every place my friend has been in the last 24 hours or what color his or her bra/panties/boxers/briefs are) This reservation of my husbands is like a breath of fresh air.
However, in no way is he dull or pale. He's known as the guy to put everyone at ease and put a smile on anyone's face. HOWEVER, one thing about Scots, and Brits in general in my experience is they don't just loosen up around people they don't trust/like. I'd say that perhaps due to some what might be considered prying questions to them they are wary of you and don't feel comfortable enough to "loosen up" w/o a little booze.
I will also say that I am from the northwest, where we aren't all about block parties and housing associations. Half the time I don't know what the guy next door looks like much less his name. It's much different in various places of our own country as I've heard the south and mid-west of the states are VERY overly friendly, and open about everything.
While I'm on this thread, there is something I've wondered about Britain. On the one hand, Britain is seen as a very cultured and civilzied society where conformity and protocol is very important, on the other hand British soccer fans are known for being some of the most drunk and violent and I've also heard that British people (and Irish too) tend to drink a lot more than people in America that that pub culture is more prevalent in England than in the U.S. How do people reconcile these contrasting images? Is soccer just a time to "let loose" a little over there?
The difference really, is in Britain it's more about drinking outside of the house. In the US, beer is consumed in most every home that allows alcohol. And it's a part of family life you drink a beer as soon as you get home to relax, or in front of the tv, or NFL football game. You have a drink at dinner. It's not hard liquor but it invades everyday life like it's nothing.
In Britain where as a glass of wine at dinner or a dram of whiskey after dinner with the adults is considered normal for the most part it's more about going down to the pub for a pint and camaraderie than to get pissed. It's a event and rather than be drunk in front of your children they do it in the pub.
As for football fans in the UK, it's really more about hooliganism and for the most part really letting go. My husband born and raised in Glasgow saw a lot of this. And had to explain it to me as an American I just didn't get it. People will get drunk before the game, to go to the game ust to make trouble...and then there are those that aren't supporters of said team will go get drunk to cause trouble after/before the game outside to people who are supporters. Has a lot to do with not enough to occupy young hands...
Not to say ALL fans are like that...but it does happen..or at least it still did when my husband was a kid not THAT long ago.
They may be a little shy, as foreigners in the USA!
And no, the British don't tell people what they earn, and consider it very bad manners to ask - unless you were talking about a common interest; for example, if you both ran the same type of business.
The English are quite reserved but they are also very friendly. I really enjoyed living in the UK, and found it delightful to be able to walk to school, shops, the park - and meet friends and neighbors all along the way. There is always someone washing the car or mowing the lawn, always loads of kids playing in the park, people I know at the local shops to stop for a chat.
I miss that in the USA...people are very nice, but the over-use of the car and the lack of community is a little depressing. Maybe your English friends feel like that too...
Considered bad form indeed to enquire into what another persons earns.In fact i would not even ask what the other person did for a living,certainly not on meeting,unless of course it came up as a course of the conversation and then i would only give a reply like in banking or in health etc.Really no ones business....
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