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View Poll Results: Do you support giving Ukraine F-16s
Yes 198 39.52%
No 254 50.70%
Unsure 49 9.78%
Voters: 501. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-18-2023, 05:06 AM
 
2,388 posts, read 1,107,129 times
Reputation: 3491

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice_Major View Post
Exactly, yet people keeping thinking that if we just give Ukraine X then they will win. At the end of the day it's going to take boots on the ground to get the Russians out. To us this is just another proxy war (which we have a bad record with by the way). To the Russians this is a threat to their survival. They are always going to be more motivated. With the ongoing conflict in the Middle East, and politicians being elected that aren't so "pro-Ukraine" war, time is running out.
Wrong.

Ukrainians are the ones who are "motivated"....

And that is Putin's big problem....he can't mobilize every able bodied person in Russia...
if he tries to do that ....he will be in big trouble at home....then it is bye bye Putin.
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Old 10-18-2023, 05:18 AM
 
Location: Durham NC
5,252 posts, read 3,834,264 times
Reputation: 3778
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTB365 View Post
Wrong.

Ukrainians are the ones who are "motivated"....

And that is Putin's big problem....he can't mobilize every able bodied person in Russia...
if he tries to do that ....he will be in big trouble at home....then it is bye bye Putin.



You couldn't be any more wrong on anything you have just said. It's frightening how misinformed you and about a half dozen others who have posted in this thread really are. $hit goes on around you and you can't seem to process it.
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Old 10-18-2023, 05:35 AM
 
5,222 posts, read 3,046,681 times
Reputation: 7022
Quote:
Originally Posted by lancers View Post
You couldn't be any more wrong on anything you have just said. It's frightening how misinformed you and about a half dozen others who have posted in this thread really are. $hit goes on around you and you can't seem to process it.
Wrong how?
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Old 10-18-2023, 09:20 AM
 
8,187 posts, read 3,744,968 times
Reputation: 2760
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
That's what they say. And they certainly used to have them!
But not everyone is convinced they still have dependable nuclear weapons. Most of the other Russian technology has proven to be poorly maintained, faulty, or outright mythical.
Hypersonic missiles, nukes, torpedoes with range of hundreds of miles..... I dunno. I'm skeptical. They haven't tested a nuke since 1987.

"The Soviet Union’s last nuclear test took place on 24 October 1990; the United Kingdom’s on 26 November 1991 and the United States’ on 23 September 1992. France and China conducted their last tests in January and July 1996 respectively, before signing the Comprehensive Nuclear-Test-Ban Treaty"



So Soviet union - 1990, the US - 1992, essentially, no difference. Next.
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Old 10-18-2023, 09:31 AM
 
8,187 posts, read 3,744,968 times
Reputation: 2760
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTB365 View Post
Wrong.

Ukrainians are the ones who are "motivated"....

And that is Putin's big problem....he can't mobilize every able bodied person in Russia...
if he tries to do that ....he will be in big trouble at home....then it is bye bye Putin.
Quotation marks above seem appropriate

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...d-conscription
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Old 10-18-2023, 09:44 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
7,825 posts, read 2,752,135 times
Reputation: 3388
Quote:
Originally Posted by serger View Post
Quotation marks above seem appropriate

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...d-conscription
Oh please. What are the proportions of the society they are speaking of. One group has 30,000 members. What is Ukraine's population?? Every war that has ever been fought has this dynamic. Russia has a far far bigger problem with this.
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Old 10-18-2023, 10:21 AM
 
8,187 posts, read 3,744,968 times
Reputation: 2760
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoy64 View Post
Oh please. What are the proportions of the society they are speaking of. One group has 30,000 members. What is Ukraine's population?? Every war that has ever been fought has this dynamic. Russia has a far far bigger problem with this.
Millions have left the country since the start of the war. Do you truly believe that it was all women and children? The point is Ukraine is under general mobilization , 18-60 are not allowed to leave. There were even calls for extradition from the EU, preemptively rebuked by some of the members. So just by looking at the facts I don't really any support for your last sentence. Unless by bigger problem, you mean that a full mobilization would be widely politically unpopular in Russia.

https://asiatimes.com/2023/09/ukrain...ation-problem/
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Old 10-18-2023, 10:57 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
7,825 posts, read 2,752,135 times
Reputation: 3388
Quote:
Originally Posted by serger View Post
Millions have left the country since the start of the war. Do you truly believe that it was all women and children? The point is Ukraine is under general mobilization , 18-60 are not allowed to leave. There were even calls for extradition from the EU, preemptively rebuked by some of the members. So just by looking at the facts I don't really any support for your last sentence. Unless by bigger problem, you mean that a full mobilization would be widely politically unpopular in Russia.

https://asiatimes.com/2023/09/ukrain...ation-problem/
Of course millions have left the country it's a war for crying out loud. Are you saying the abled bodied men of Ukraine are leading the charge?? Facts are facts, Ukraine loses, they cease to exist. Are you saying Ukrainians are Okay with that??
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Old 10-18-2023, 11:08 AM
 
8,187 posts, read 3,744,968 times
Reputation: 2760
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoy64 View Post
Of course millions have left the country it's a war for crying out loud. Are you saying the abled bodied men of Ukraine are leading the charge?? Facts are facts, Ukraine loses, they cease to exist. Are you saying Ukrainians are Okay with that??
No, I never said that. I just disagreed with you on who has more serious manpower problems.
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Old 10-18-2023, 11:12 AM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,701 posts, read 17,471,207 times
Reputation: 37511
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoy64 View Post
Of course millions have left the country it's a war for crying out loud. Are you saying the abled bodied men of Ukraine are leading the charge?? Facts are facts, Ukraine loses, they cease to exist. Are you saying Ukrainians are Okay with that??
Millions have left Ukraine. Millions have left Russia.
The difference is, after the war Ukraine's population will return.
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