Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:33 AM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,273,228 times
Reputation: 17209

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldhag1 View Post
You are over generalizing. There is a difference between believing that he deserved to die and thinking that but for his own actions this would not have happened to him.
It wouldn't have happened without the actions of Zimmerman either. This has been my position all along. Both were complicit in what happened. Zimmerman does bear partial responsibility for what happened, it wasn't murder but he does hold partial guilt here.

Quote:
He certainly did not deserve to die, he was just a child with his whole life before him. He appeared to be headed down a bad track but he never got the chance for us to see how his life worked out, so we'll never know. Just because people are not willing to call him a hero or an icon of everything racially wrong with this nation does not mean that they applaud his death. His death was tragic. And preventable. If either he, his parents, or George Zimmerman had made different choices that weekend none of us would be discussing this, and all it would have taken is one of the four people to have changed their actions. If his father had stayed home with him..... If his mother not sent him to his father because she couldn't handle him... If he had been grounded and stayed home watching TV.... If he hadn't done whatever got him suspended and sent to his father's in the first place.... If he had gone straight home.... If he hadn't taken a shortcut across others' property... If he hadn't confronted Zimmerman.... If Zimmerman wasn't trying to play big, bad neighborhood watchman... If Zimmerman hadn't kept following him... If Zimmerman had followed the dispatcher's advice.... If Zimmerman hadn't carried a gun... If Zimmerman was capable of "winning" the fist fight....
I understand what you are saying but for every bad thing that happens there are "what if's", even when it doesn't include things like listed above. "If I had only decided to not check out the sunset over the lake that evening, I wouldn't have been at that intersection the evening that guy decided to run the red light".

Thousands of families face many of the same choices as Trayvon's mom and most would recommend that she should do exactly what she did. Kids walk through yards on the way home millions of times a day.

In high school, I skipped classes. Smoked some pot, as did the vast majority of the people I knew.

Quote:
Oh, and let's not forget the idiot girl that told him it was probably a homosexual rapist following him. All I could think once I heard that was that he was a scared 17-year-old child who thought he had led a rapist to his home, where he would be the only one there.

It is all very, very tragic, but that doesn't mean they need to name a prom after him.
The prom idea is a stupid thing for the school to get involved with.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:40 AM
 
Location: Center of the universe
24,645 posts, read 38,678,186 times
Reputation: 11780
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
It wouldn't have happened without the actions of Zimmerman either. This has been my position all along. Both were complicit in what happened. Zimmerman does bear partial responsibility for what happened, it wasn't murder but he does hold partial guilt here.
Well, he is the one whose actions directly ended another person's life.


Quote:
I understand what you are saying but for every bad thing that happens there are "what if's", even when it doesn't include things like listed above. "If I had only decided to not check out the sunset over the lake that evening, I wouldn't have been at that intersection the evening that guy decided to run the red light".

Thousands of families face many of the same choices as Trayvon's mom and most would recommend that she should do exactly what she did. Kids walk through yards on the way home millions of times a day.

In high school, I skipped classes. Smoked some pot, as did the vast majority of the people I knew.
Hmm. Wonder if our racist moralist fringe here will start calling you a thug who deserved to die.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:43 AM
 
18,836 posts, read 37,392,821 times
Reputation: 26469
The real issue here, is that these students obviously identified with Trayvon Martin, and see him as a symbol of how they feel in society at large, threatened, insignificant, and marginalized.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:51 AM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,273,228 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucario View Post
Hmm. Wonder if our racist moralist fringe here will start calling you a thug who deserved to die.
The racist moralists here are taking more positions that just that. Racists calling racists a racist always make for bad arguments.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:52 AM
 
Location: Center of the universe
24,645 posts, read 38,678,186 times
Reputation: 11780
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper12 View Post
The real issue here, is that these students obviously identified with Trayvon Martin, and see him as a symbol of how they feel in society at large, threatened, insignificant, and marginalized.
I bring this up all the time..........but I just get accused of being a racist and having a "victim mentality."
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:53 AM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,273,228 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper12 View Post
The real issue here, is that these students obviously identified with Trayvon Martin, and see him as a symbol of how they feel in society at large, threatened, insignificant, and marginalized.
As teens have done forever. That boils down "Rebel Without a Cause" down to it's basics.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:54 AM
 
Location: Center of the universe
24,645 posts, read 38,678,186 times
Reputation: 11780
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
The racist moralists here are taking more positions that just that. Racists calling racists a racist always make for bad arguments.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:57 AM
 
78,535 posts, read 60,718,007 times
Reputation: 49843
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper12 View Post
The real issue here, is that these students obviously identified with Trayvon Martin, and see him as a symbol of how they feel in society at large, threatened, insignificant, and marginalized.
.....and it's always someone else that is to blame. A common theme regardless of socio-economics in our current feel-good everyone gets a trophy culture.

I look on their city data fact sheet and they are sending quite a few kids on to Penn State and other secondary edcuation. Smart money would be that those are kids with role models, involved parents etc. Why do we credit those parents but turn around and "blame society" for the others?

Heck TM's parents couldn't control him and keep him from making poor choices that lead to his school problems. How does society force someone to do what his parents couldn't do? We can't. It is after all, a free country and you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.

Media culture glorifying sex, drugs, violence and thug life are wayyyyy more to blame than the actions of a failed mall cop on one night in Florida.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:57 AM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,273,228 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucario View Post
Wasn't speaking about you if that is the question.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-09-2013, 06:59 AM
 
Location: Center of the universe
24,645 posts, read 38,678,186 times
Reputation: 11780
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Wasn't speaking about you if that is the question.
That was part of it. Thanks for the clarification.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top