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Well, for starters the KKK didn't exactly run around waving Bonnie Blue's. Plus, many flags of the Confederacy were simply older version of state flags. South Carolina still uses the flag it adopted in 1861, shortly after secession. Also, the square version of the "Confederate flag", the true battle flag, is rarely flown, it was also the flag of the Army of Tennessee.
The rectangular version that people usually identify as the Confederate flag is a slightly modified naval jack. It was invented by the KKK during their second rising in the early 20th century, as square flags were awkward to handle, especially when used with regular, and rectangular, US flags (another KKK favorite).
So, in essence it does matter considerably which flag you are talking about.
It obviously wasn't yours that we stole to make makeshift toilet paper out of then!
Obviously not so, I also have a 3x5 Confederate Naval Jack with inverted colors (the Flag of the Confederate Trans-Mississippi Department), a small rendition of the Confederate First National with the 7 stars that represent the core Deep South states (that I got from the Sons of Confederate Veterans: Pvt. Nathan Terry Wanslee Camp), and a miniture Battle Flag that I got at Vicksburg National Battlefield.
But I should mention, your use is disrepectful, and that speaks for ALL flags.
It matters plenty, many couldn't tell you what most CSA flags outside of the battle flag even look like.
But in my case, it is Southern Pride, and remembering my ancestors from Virginia/Tennessee, and I have a big 3x5 Confederate Naval Jack next to a portrait of Robert E. Lee and P.G.T. Beauregard on my wall.
Desert kid !!! ... On The Money !!!
Some of these CDF bloody muppets don't know owt about the C.S.A., Southern Pride or the beautiful CONFEDERATE Flag! Even the good blokes in London have a basic understanding of "Southern Pride" and the fantastic history associated with the Civil War South !!!
Keep up the good work Desert kid ! Ta / Old Sgt. Lamar
C.S.A. History and Heritage ... A Source Of Great Pride in 2011 !
It means that you enjoy freedoms throughout this whole country that the south wanted to eliminate.
You have the right to show that flag in spite of the hatreds generally associated with it.
Just understand that many people see it and think that the owner might be able to count all the way to 6.... if they take their shoes off.
And should we be proud as we fly the American flag? or should we associate the Murders, forced marching and imprisonment of the Native Indians with our beloved flag?
The flag most people think of as the 'Confederate' flag, two blue crosses on a red background was a battle flag.
In the first battle of Bull Run (1st Manassas) both the USA and CSA had similar flags. They had black powder those days, it was hard to see. There was a lot of confusion and many troops were killed by their own forces. The battle flag was made so each side could see their own flag.
The southern flag evolved many times during the conflict.
And should we be proud as we fly the American flag? or should we associate the Murders, forced marching and imprisonment of the Native Indians with our beloved flag?
That same flag flew from every U.S.A. ship bringing over the slaves. All those ships were owned by the North.
It's a symbol of a people who fought for and lost the right of States to maintain the legal right of enslavement of human beings.
It's a symbol of people trying to create their own dignity out of a failure to support a most heinous institution.
And it's a big F.U. to anyone who disagrees with them.
You act like the only reasons for the Confederacy's founding was slavery, which of course did play a big part and sure as anything wasn't the only reason.
In our modern eyes, yes, slavery was horrid and terrible. But in the 1860's, it was seen as anything from necissary to good.
You act like the only reasons for the Confederacy's founding was slavery, which of course did play a big part and sure as anything wasn't the only reason.
In our modern eyes, yes, slavery was horrid and terrible. But in the 1860's, it was seen as anything from necissary to good.
What other reasons were there?
How does the Civil War happen if slavery never was established in North America?
It's a symbol of a people who fought for and lost the right of States to maintain the legal right of enslavement of human beings.
I am black, this is what I feel it means.
And on this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979
For some of us it is a visual representation of states having the right to make their own decisions, the blood shed by people fighting against government tyranny, and the ever present reality that the federal government can come to your house and take your legally bought property (under their laws mind you), and take it with no recompense to you whatsoever.
For others, it stands for people fighting for slavery, the right to keep people against their will, and to continue that practice.
From the history most of us were taught, you'd think that the latter answer was right.
However, this is not the case for anyone who has truly studied the civil war.
Lets say, for instance, that before the war had started that the Northern states said "Ok, we don't like slavery anymore, its immoral, and wrong. So we will outlaw the sale, buying, and ownership of new slaves from this point on. Everyone who currently has slaves are not breaking the law for keeping them, and we are not going to come and take your legally held slaves under the US constitution with which you bought them. However, we are going to offer you a 3 month period at which to sell your slaves to the federal government, in which we will compensate you with tax payer money to right the wrong that THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT has perpetuated for all these many years"
Then, if the south still left the union, the latter answer would have been correct.
But this is not the reality of history.
The history is that the federal government, urged by northern business interests who sought to seize southern land because most of those in the south would have been bankrupt if they had suddenly given up their slaves without payment for them, decided to say this.
"We are going to seize your slaves, not pay you for them, and there isn't a darned thing you can do about it, except leave the union". Secession was legal mind you, so said the chief justice of the supreme court at the time.
That is not what anyone said at all. Lincoln was not about to take anyone's slaves away. Most white people, even lots of abolitionist, due to the leading science of the day (eugenics) thought that black people were inferior and wanted to send them back to Africa versus keeping them in the country. They morally opposed slavery but didn't want blacks in America.
The southern states overreacted because they were upset that Lincoln, who was not a vocal supporter of slavery, was elected as president so they were afraid that the above bolded portion was going to happen. There is no guarantee that it would have happened and most historical scholars don't believe that it would have. Lincoln wanted to halt the expansion of slavery into the West and into new territories or states that were admitted to the USA, not forceably take away the slaves of southern plantation slave owners. Due to their fear, the south seceeded, then eventually lost a war and romanticized their pre-war lifestyle, leading to an adoration in some of their descendents regarding the stars and bars, which like a PP noted was not actually the flag of the Confederacy.
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How Bout Dat Beautiful Confederate Flag !!!
