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Which one did she see? The one every kid born today has (the one with barely any information on it) or the one folks born in the 60's had?
Simple way to end the questions of those deemed "crazy" for not being sheep.
Show the one he was issued after he was born in Hawaii. Not the "modern version".
But...didn't it recently get "lost"? The BC that the info was pulled from to show his "modern" one? Has it been found?
And not for nothin' but what kind of a mother doesn't keep her child's birth certificate in a safe place? And ensure when he's older and needs it, he has multiple copies of it? Especially given the international travelers that they were?
Are there pictures of mom holding him in the hospital? Baby in his little hospital bassinet with the tag hanging in said bassinet with the large hospital logo on it that also tells mom's last name, baby's name, weight, length, time of birth? No hospital tags? No baby book? No nursery school friends? No neighbors who remember the newborn and his parents?
Easy little things.
I'd love to scan in my BC, issued in 1965, but I'm too lazy to do so. Suffice it to say, it has my name, my parents names, my sex, date of birth, place of birth (I think) and a stamped signature of the head of the PENNSYLVANIA dept. of health.
I never had a BC until then. Believe it or not, back then, you didn't need a BC to do everything under the sun. I think I got mine for my driver's license, but I clearly recall that baptism certificates and other forms of ID were acceptable as proof of age. His family never traveled out of the US until they went to Indonesia when O. was 6 years old.
There are no pictures of me in the hospital bassinette, either. I worked in three hospital nurseries, and I don't know what kind of hang tags you're talking about. When I had my kids (different hospital yet) there was a little index card with my last name, my room # and "Baby girl" written on it, that was tucked into a slot on the front of the bassinette. The current governor of Hawaii knew Obama as a child. Nursery school friends? Are you kidding? Most kids didn't even go to nursery school then, and my kids, who did, have no memories of any of those kids.
ANYONE who is nuts enough to believe that Stanley Ann Dunham traveled to Kenya at some undiscoverable date, with no passport (the first one issued for her was when they traveled to Indonesia), had a baby, then flew back home and indulged in some vast conspiracy to cover up his birth really needs their head examined.
I'd love to scan in my BC, issued in 1965, but I'm too lazy to do so. Suffice it to say, it has my name, my parents names, my sex, date of birth, place of birth (I think) and a stamped signature of the head of the PENNSYLVANIA dept. of health.
Your BC was issued in 1965, mine was issued not quite a decade after Obama was born and in the year I was born. Where did the dept. of health pull the info from in any case?
I never had a BC until then. Believe it or not, back then, you didn't need a BC to do everything under the sun. I think I got mine for my driver's license, but I clearly recall that baptism certificates and other forms of ID were acceptable as proof of age. His family never traveled out of the US until they went to Indonesia when O. was 6 years old.
What does he have previous to 6 years of age?
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There are no pictures of me in the hospital bassinette, either. I worked in three hospital nurseries, and I don't know what kind of hang tags you're talking about. When I had my kids (different hospital yet) there was a little index card with my last name, my room # and "Baby girl" written on it, that was tucked into a slot on the front of the bassinette. The current governor of Hawaii knew Obama as a child. Nursery school friends? Are you kidding? Most kids didn't even go to nursery school then, and my kids, who did, have no memories of any of those kids.
Yes, I'm talking about the plastic-ish bassinet's babies get carted around in with the "index cards" on them. Did you toss those is the garbage after your kids were born? Their wristlets? Yours? Do have medical records for them from birth (of the simplest kind...a vax record?)...any pictures of them as infants in the hospital or their "first day home"? Or the months after when you took baby out and caught a little background of the surroundings in the picture? Even my parents, born in the late 40's do.
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ANYONE who is nuts enough to believe that Stanley Ann Dunham traveled to Kenya at some undiscoverable date, with no passport (the first one issued for her was when they traveled to Indonesia), had a baby, then flew back home and indulged in some vast conspiracy to cover up his birth really needs their head examined.
What about passports for Stanley Ann Soetoro or Stanley Ann Dunham Soetoro?
Those records are magically missing too?
How much crazy can happen to one person making it so hard to prove anything? Even his SS number is in question. It belonged to a woman born in 1890, in Connecticut, wasn't legally re-issued, but by some clerical error, Obama ends up with it? And that error wasn't caught?
How much more unanswered questions can surround ONE person?
And it doesn't help, and you know this, that Obama has hired lawyers to seal his records.
Maybe he was born in Hawaii...I'm not saying he wasn't...but he's hiding something else.
No one thought Bush or Kerry deserved any "privacy" while demanding THEIR records released from colleges attended or military records. They could easily provide long-form birth certificates. Obama has spent how much sealing all of his records?
He's hiding something. You know he is. Otherwise it would be THAT easy for him to prove one of the many questions surrounding what his deal is.
Your BC was issued in 1965, mine was issued not quite a decade after Obama was born and in the year I was born. Where did the dept. of health pull the info from in any case?
and mine was issued in 1974 and the copy that was given to my parents was lost in the move we made to Florida and back to Hawaii.
People lose things.
Obama was born in Hawaii, his mother then divorced, then remarried to an Indonesian native. She then moved her and Obama to Indonesia when he was 5. Then, when he was 10, she sent him back to Hawaii to live with his grandparents, before she divorced Lolo Soetoro, and moved back later that same year.
In all that time, as a parent, she could have lost his original certified copy of the COLB. His father may have had it in the collection papers he had when he moved to attend Harvard and in the subsequent divorce.
who knows? And who really cares.
It's all a red herring anyway. The form issued by the State of Hawaii is a CERTIFIED, PRIM-FACIE evidence certificate, should anyone want to question it.
YOUR beef is with HAWAII. Not Obama. He no more can force the state to dig into their archives to pull his old COLB than I could.
And what he is doing is the CORRECT thing
Not placating to a bunch of BABY whiners, who believe everything under the sun about him, when there is contrary evidence to those claims.
All of the original birther claims have originated from racists. Andy Martin was the first racist to claim that Obama wasn't born in America, an Orly Tai(n)tz is another racist who claims that he wasn't born in America simply because she believes he's a muslim (and she has a huge hate on for muslims)
And why placate a bunch of racists, who have already stated that anything he produces will not satisfy them. They've already made up back up excuses should he force Hawaii to let the original out of archives to be shown.
So, the best thing to do? Ignore the ignorant nit-wits and get on with life. America has problems, and the BIRTHERS care nothing about the issues ahead.
and mine was issued in 1974 and the copy that was given to my parents was lost in the move we made to Florida and back to Hawaii.
People lose things.
Yeah. Ok. And when did you get a new one re-issued to you? Where do you think the info came from? The one issued to you in 1974.
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Obama was born in Hawaii, his mother then divorced, then remarried to an Indonesian native. She then moved her and Obama to Indonesia when he was 5. Then, when he was 10, she sent him back to Hawaii to live with his grandparents, before she divorced Lolo Soetoro, and moved back later that same year.
And?
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In all that time, as a parent, she could have lost his original certified copy of the COLB. His father may have had it in the collection papers he had when he moved to attend Harvard and in the subsequent divorce.
who knows? And who really cares.
Obama found his BC in his mother's "things". She had a recently issued "short form" for him? Why would she? Either she had a copy of the 1961 the long-form or he lied in his book.
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It's all a red herring anyway. The form issued by the State of Hawaii is a CERTIFIED, PRIM-FACIE evidence certificate, should anyone want to question it.
Not for someone born in 1961...and especially NOT when the 1961 BC has apparently been viewed by a special one or two folks. And then they lost it. Where did they get the info to issue the one they did?
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YOUR beef is with HAWAII. Not Obama. He no more can force the state to dig into their archives to pull his old COLB than I could.
No, it's with Obama. He's sealed all his records for a reason. Not for privacy. He's hiding SOMETHING. May not be his place of birth, but he's hiding something for a reason. Probably a HUGE reason.
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And what he is doing is the CORRECT thing
Not placating to a bunch of BABY whiners, who believe everything under the sun about him, when there is contrary evidence to those claims.
Yeah, that line of thought would have played out real well had Bush pulled it when it came to his records being demanded for public view.
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All of the original birther claims have originated from racists. Andy Martin was the first racist to claim that Obama wasn't born in America, an Orly Tai(n)tz is another racist who claims that he wasn't born in America simply because she believes he's a muslim (and she has a huge hate on for muslims)
Of course. Racism card. What's new? I could give a crap what color his skin is. Where are ANY of his early records? Why did he seal his records? What is he hiding? Is it "black pride" and "I don't need to prove anything to you, take my word?" Who gets away with that crap?
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And why placate a bunch of racists, who have already stated that anything he produces will not satisfy them. They've already made up back up excuses should he force Hawaii to let the original out of archives to be shown.
So, the best thing to do? Ignore the ignorant nit-wits and get on with life. America has problems, and the BIRTHERS care nothing about the issues ahead.
If Obama would stop hiding everything, there would be no questions.
It's not a racist issue. It's a common sense issue.
Rule #1: There are no coincidences.
Obama's excused based on coincidences. From his SS# being issued to someone born in 1890 (from CT) and not re-issued, then it became re-issued after THAT was found out, to his mommy losing his BC , to him never having a copy of his 1961 issued BC, to him finding his BC in "her things" and him losing THAT one too, to Hawaii losing his BC. How many times does something like that happen to ONE person?
Last edited by Informed Info; 03-20-2011 at 11:31 PM..
Yeah. Ok. And when did you get a new one re-issued to you? Where do you think the info came from?
We may be at the core of the issue. A birth certificate isn't The One Ring, it's just a form that certifies that an official record exists. The record can be a microfiche or a computer record or a ledger book, doesn't matter.
It makes little sense to talk about an "original" birth license, because you can ask the records to pull a dozen of the things, and they'll not only say the same - that there's a birth on record - they'll be equally valid and equally "original". Because everybody involved is expected to understand that the certificate is irrelevant, the official record is everything.
Incidentally, Obama didn't "seal his records", they're under the same privacy protections as those of everybody else.
At this point in time, I can damn well understand if anyone who knew Obama in youth and childhood will want to stay out of the spotlight. Because the birthers would call them liars and conspirators in a matter of days.
Interestingly, that's how a lot of people feel about Birtherism in general.
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