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Why are the RW pundits the ones so desperately trying to deflect and say "it's not my fault". The LW pundits don't seem to be saying that. The fact is, both sides do it, only the left seems to be acknowledging that and apologize for it. As an aside, O'Reilly, the "Oracle of Tides", last night ended his show with a letter from an Elementary School kid saying how smart he is. Maybe he is smarter than a 5th grader, seems to me I knew about the moon and tides in the 5th grade, but perhaps my memory is getting foggy.
You do realize the mainstream media immediately attacked conservative media as causing the problem? If MSNBC and the NY Times were accused the same way Rush was you can be assured they would react.
I've never been a fan of violent rhetoric. Personally, I think Sharon Angle's comments on 2nd amendment solutions were horrible, always did. I guess I haven't been watching the right shows to see the right media pundits resisting this. I personally thought, when listening, that they agreed but felt some of the rhetoric that is being tagged as "violent" by the left is not actually violent.
The infamous Palin map, for example, actually used quite common political language, when saying that districts were targeted. It has been used by many candidates, left and right, for a number of years. Is it unfortunate that one of those districts was indeed Rep Giffords? Yes, absolutely. All of the gun metaphors used by Palin are a bit overdone and I think that was her "schtick". I saw other candidates using this same bit as well but I do believe she was the most public to use the gun metaphors.
On any of the shows that you do watch, has anyone ever expressed any acknowledgment of there own contribution to violent rhetoric? I watch FOX a lot, actually hoping to hear anyone do that. I just watched Beck on FOX, blast the violent speak from anybody, anywhere. But, did I hear him say anything about his own statements? No! I presume he, like many, don't hear what they say.
What a person thinks is their own matter. Once a person says something they do have some responsibility for the effects. If I state on this forum that all the RW should have something dreadful happen to them and it does, I bear some responsibility for that thing. Calling for physical harm is, to me, an incitement to riot and an assault. IMHO the inciter has some responsibility for what happens. I am a firm believer in free speech. I also believe a person is responsible for the damage that results from their speech.
I do not have the details of this incident but there were a lot of folks calling for "elimination" of "Liberals" in Congress including this congresswoman. I am not surprised that a weak minded individual thought he would be doing the right thing by shooting this person. I do not mean that this man should be relieved of any responsibility for killing and wounding all these people because he read or heard they were evil. He should be tried and if found guilty, hanged. I do not consider him insane just murderous.
In a similar manner I think all gun laws should be eliminated as the decision about what weapons a person owns is theirs and not the rest of us through the government. I also believe that the user of a weapon is responsible for the damage done by the weapon considering the circumstances involved with the incident. Defense of yourself, your family, your property and even strangers from violent assault is a legitimate use of weapons. Deliberate shooting of anyone not posing a direct physical threat is not.
Can anyone prove to me how rhetoric contributed to this event?
Pollitical rhetoric has been going on for so long it is really intellectually dishonest for us to try and blame it for this latest mass murder. I guess people have to try and find a place to put the blame.
I remember when Clinton was in office the rhetoric was at a fever pitch as with President G.W. Bush. I don't even know if it has increased with Obama but just remained at a steady state.
What gets me is the finger pointing at each other. But since the left controls the media it is heavily directed at anything right of center.
No surprise there. But you would think when it is proven he has no affiliation with republicans that an apology would be forthcoming. No?
What a person thinks is their own matter. Once a person says something they do have some responsibility for the effects. If I state on this forum that all the RW should have something dreadful happen to them and it does, I bear some responsibility for that thing. Calling for physical harm is, to me, an incitement to riot and an assault. IMHO the inciter has some responsibility for what happens. I am a firm believer in free speech. I also believe a person is responsible for the damage that results from their speech.
I do not have the details of this incident but there were a lot of folks calling for "elimination" of "Liberals" in Congress including this congresswoman. I am not surprised that a weak minded individual thought he would be doing the right thing by shooting this person. I do not mean that this man should be relieved of any responsibility for killing and wounding all these people because he read or heard they were evil. He should be tried and if found guilty, hanged. I do not consider him insane just murderous.
In a similar manner I think all gun laws should be eliminated as the decision about what weapons a person owns is theirs and not the rest of us through the government. I also believe that the user of a weapon is responsible for the damage done by the weapon considering the circumstances involved with the incident. Defense of yourself, your family, your property and even strangers from violent assault is a legitimate use of weapons. Deliberate shooting of anyone not posing a direct physical threat is not.
No that's not true. No one is responsible for anothers mental instability.
Pollitical rhetoric has been going on for so long it is really intellectually dishonest for us to try and blame it for this latest mass murder. I guess people have to try and find a place to put the blame.
I remember when Clinton was in office the rhetoric was at a fever pitch as with President G.W. Bush. I don't even know if it has increased with Obama but just remained at a steady state.
What gets me is the finger pointing at each other. But since the left controls the media it is heavily directed at anything right of center.
No surprise there. But you would think when it is proven he has no affiliation with republicans that an apology would be forthcoming. No?
Of course you are right. It really is an attempt to control speech. Which unfortunately is a hallmark of the left.
On any of the shows that you do watch, has anyone ever expressed any acknowledgment of there own contribution to violent rhetoric? I watch FOX a lot, actually hoping to hear anyone do that. I just watched Beck on FOX, blast the violent speak from anybody, anywhere. But, did I hear him say anything about his own statements? No! I presume he, like many, don't hear what they say.
First, I believe the conversation was about civility in discussing political points of view and yes, I heard that several times. However, I think it hinges on what one would define as violent rhetoric. I believe Sharon Angle's comments qualified. That was not only in poor taste but was just plain wrong according to my own moral compass. I think using metaphors that suggest a fight, not so much (Obama's comments included). It's just a metaphor. I have always had an issue with Olbermann's worst person in the world segment because it's just tasteless. I think the closest counterpart to him on Fox would be Hannity? He has had his tasteless moments as well. I don't really watch him so I can't recall exact quotes.
I have watched Bill O quite a bit before and while I think he interrupts a bit much, I have seen him treat his guests and the issues fairly. In my opinion, I believe there is very little really violent rhetoric and plenty in poor taste. I am guessing we'll have fundamental differences on that point, but that's okay. I think disagreement can be healthy.
Can anyone prove to me how rhetoric contributed to this event?
That will be a little difficult but commons sense should dictate that the rhetoric on both sides has really gone to extremes.
Giffords made the following statement:
“The way she has it depicted is that she has the crosshairs of a gunsight over our district,” Giffords said. “When people do that they’ve got to realize there’s consequences to that action.”I don't blame Palin for the murders or shootings but all need to take a step back and look at the way they handle themselves.
The public meetings held by individual congress members leading up to the health vote is a good example, people no longer want to discuss just scream. Giffords office was ransacked back in March probably over constituents dissapointment over her opinions.
Instead of introspective consideration of the way they behave the airwaves have been filled with more divisive hatred, time for all to take a step back towards reasonable discussion.
That will be a little difficult but commons sense should dictate that the rhetoric on both sides has really gone to extremes.
Giffords made the following statement:
“The way she has it depicted is that she has the crosshairs of a gunsight over our district,” Giffords said. “When people do that they’ve got to realize there’s consequences to that action.”I don't blame Palin for the murders or shootings but all need to take a step back and look at the way they handle themselves.
The public meetings held by individual congress members leading up to the health vote is a good example, people no longer want to discuss just scream. Giffords office was ransacked back in March probably over constituents dissapointment over her opinions.
Instead of introspective consideration of the way they behave the airwaves have been filled with more divisive hatred, time for all to take a step back towards reasonable discussion.
Excellent post and hopefully at least a few will grow up and tune the rhetoric down a notch. But, as you can also see from the replies on this and other threads there are some that claim there is nothing wrong with what they are doing. They scream "freedom of speech" if anyone even suggests that they just may be part of the problem and not the solution and then go right back to posting thier rhetoric. Welcome to America in the 21st Century, I have doubts we will see a 22nd.
Casper
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