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Old 03-02-2011, 09:22 AM
 
3,842 posts, read 10,510,271 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FinsterRufus View Post
This^^^ - I know people's intentions are good, when they passionately promote breastfeeding. But if you are unable to do it, when you are aware of all of the good reasons, and you agonize over it - it takes an emotional toll. At a time when, especially if you're a new parent, you're extremely vulnerable to criticism.

I think it's odd, too, that people who are promoting bonding and good emotional health with their babies think nothing of stomping all over the feelings of other mothers who are basically being told that they are raising an inferior product, and that it's all their fault. As if there weren't enough anxiety already.

How about the implications of a highly stressed new parent and the effect that has on the bond with the baby? Less guilt and more compassion would go a long way toward helping any mother with the process, no matter what their decision.
Is this post STILL being beat into the ground?

REALLY?

In 10-20 years, if breastfeeding or bottle is the BIGGEST issue I've faced w/ my kids & get so hot in the panties about, goodness, am I darn lucky.

But, oh, it is not, & I know that even w/ toddlers. So, I find the debate pointless & ridiculous.

Parenting is hard. The hardest thing we will ever do. Great that some want to make it even harder
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Old 03-02-2011, 09:44 AM
 
466 posts, read 815,673 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 121804 View Post
Is this post STILL being beat into the ground?

REALLY?

In 10-20 years, if breastfeeding or bottle is the BIGGEST issue I've faced w/ my kids & get so hot in the panties about, goodness, am I darn lucky.

But, oh, it is not, & I know that even w/ toddlers. So, I find the debate pointless & ridiculous.

Parenting is hard. The hardest thing we will ever do. Great that some want to make it even harder
I agree. By the time your kid is in 1st grade, no one cares. Heck, my son is just 15 months old, and it's a complete non-issue for me.
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Old 03-02-2011, 09:55 AM
 
Location: Denver 'burbs
24,012 posts, read 28,450,731 times
Reputation: 41122
Quote:
And, as many mothers as there are who have tried their best to breastfeed and failed, there are just as many I think who have not tried very much at all. Who have made that decision based on the premise that it really doesn't matter what you feed the baby, as long as the baby gets fed, and I believe that is the position of the author of the article in the OP. They may believe that "breast is best" in that breast is optimal, special, extra, above and beyond. But formula is normal and they see no reason to try to breastfeed. I think it's like how they may see organic food. They may think, yah, organic food is probably better, but whatever, it costs more, and it's not worth it, and everyone else I know eats this regular food and they seem just fine, so why should I pay more for organic. If it happens to be available to me for no extra effort, then sure, I'll try it, but I'm not going to put a lot of thought and effort into it.

And this is at the crux of why people get irritated. Why do you need to think about someone else's choices at all? Your claim that those mothers who "can't" (based on YOUR standards about how hard they might try) have nothing to feel guilty about infers that those who don't try hard enough (by your standards) should feel guilty. Who are you that you get to decide who is trying hard enough or who should feel guilty or shouldn't? You have no idea what others circumstances are, how healthy their kids are or how well that have or haven't bonded.
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Old 03-02-2011, 10:11 AM
 
4,471 posts, read 9,833,778 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom View Post
And this is at the crux of why people get irritated. Why do you need to think about someone else's choices at all? Your claim that those mothers who "can't" (based on YOUR standards about how hard they might try) have nothing to feel guilty about infers that those who don't try hard enough (by your standards) should feel guilty. Who are you that you get to decide who is trying hard enough or who should feel guilty or shouldn't? You have no idea what others circumstances are, how healthy their kids are or how well that have or haven't bonded.
I'm not sure why someone should feel guilty. My mom never even entertained the thought of breast feeding. And she has never lost a moment's sleep over it. My mother and I are still super close. I also slept in my own crib (drop side crib, the horror), on my stomach, walked late, talked late, dug for worms, and countless other things and still managed to grow up to be a well adjusted adult.
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Old 03-02-2011, 10:24 AM
 
13,413 posts, read 9,947,270 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ADVentive View Post
And, as many mothers as there are who have tried their best to breastfeed and failed, there are just as many I think who have not tried very much at all. Who have made that decision based on the premise that it really doesn't matter what you feed the baby, as long as the baby gets fed, and I believe that is the position of the author of the article in the OP. They may believe that "breast is best" in that breast is optimal, special, extra, above and beyond. But formula is normal and they see no reason to try to breastfeed. I think it's like how they may see organic food. They may think, yah, organic food is probably better, but whatever, it costs more, and it's not worth it, and everyone else I know eats this regular food and they seem just fine, so why should I pay more for organic. If it happens to be available to me for no extra effort, then sure, I'll try it, but I'm not going to put a lot of thought and effort into it.


Well, I don't want to tell them that it's all the same and it doesn't matter, no. I guess I'd tell them that you do what you have to do, but do it with your eyes open. Really, I don't tell them anything though, once they have already made the decision. Now, if someone asks me my opinion when they are considering quitting, then yes, I will tell them.
Man, I just don't think you get it at all. I and other women who "tried and failed" do not need you or anybody else to keep harping on about the benefits of breastfeeding which are obvious to anyone who can read and which formula will never equal. The point is, for whatever reason, it doesn't work for everybody. That's it. No amount of continuously brow beating mothers is going to make it work.

I think the crux of the matter is that, underneath it all, people who have had no difficulty breastfeeding cannot fathom that for some people it is not possible. You really really think that the mother did not try hard enough. And that's where the guilting of other mothers comes into play. Because no matter how you put it, the thing you most convey to them is "you could have done it if you'd just tried harder, and now because of you your baby is going to suffer."

Have you ever tried making a newborn do something he/she does not want to do? Perhaps you're talking to the wrong half of the partnership.
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Old 03-02-2011, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Hillsborough
2,825 posts, read 6,924,677 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom View Post
And this is at the crux of why people get irritated. Why do you need to think about someone else's choices at all? Your claim that those mothers who "can't" (based on YOUR standards about how hard they might try) have nothing to feel guilty about infers that those who don't try hard enough (by your standards) should feel guilty. Who are you that you get to decide who is trying hard enough or who should feel guilty or shouldn't? You have no idea what others circumstances are, how healthy their kids are or how well that have or haven't bonded.
I bring it up because people were saying that mothers who try their best to breastfeed and then don't succeed shouldn't be made to feel guilty. I am saying that 1) why would they feel guilty if they tried their best?, and 2) many don't try very much, and why not? I am not interested in making people feel guilty. But I am also not interested in perpetuating what I consider to be misinformation in the interest of saving them from potential guilty feelings.
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Old 03-02-2011, 10:26 AM
 
1,302 posts, read 1,806,284 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohiogirl22 View Post
I'm not sure why someone should feel guilty. My mom never even entertained the thought of breast feeding. And she has never lost a moment's sleep over it. My mother and I are still super close. I also slept in my own crib (drop side crib, the horror), on my stomach, walked late, talked late, dug for worms, and countless other things and still managed to grow up to be a well adjusted adult.
I never lost any sleep either. I was adopted so I was bottle fed so I was well aware that a lot of the "breast is best crusade" is perpetuated nonsense.

My sons were circumcised, bottle fed, given cereal at 3 weeks old, drop side crib, belly sleepers, public schooled, raised by a single mom, were not allowed to argue or say no and a million other "awful" things that I should carry boatloads of angst over.

Through every stage of their life I have been complimented on them. They are gorgeous, outgoing, hard-working, driven, successful, kind hearted, respectful and respected, wonderful people. They call Mom every day and their faces still light up when they see me. Every once in a while one of them will still make me a homemade card or a macaroni necklace. Yeah, I'm okay with every choice I made and would not do one iota different.
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Old 03-02-2011, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Denver 'burbs
24,012 posts, read 28,450,731 times
Reputation: 41122
Quote:
I am saying that 1) why would they feel guilty if they tried their best?,
Because you follow it by saying there are those who "you feel" don't try "hard enough". What is hard enough? And why is it up to you to decide that? And why, if persons children are healthy and happy and thriving does it need to matter to YOU?
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Old 03-02-2011, 10:48 AM
 
13,413 posts, read 9,947,270 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ADVentive View Post
I bring it up because people were saying that mothers who try their best to breastfeed and then don't succeed shouldn't be made to feel guilty. I am saying that 1) why would they feel guilty if they tried their best?,
Let me spell it out for you. They feel guilty because - and please actually try and see it from somebody else's POV -

They don't understand why it's so difficult for them when it's not for others, and that it must be their fault in some way, even if it isn't...

AND

Because they are constantly told how much more beneficial it would be for their babies if they would only TRY HARDER.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADVentive View Post
and 2) many don't try very much, and why not?
By who's standard? And by the way, see above.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADVentive View Post
I am not interested in making people feel guilty. But I am also not interested in perpetuating what I consider to be misinformation in the interest of saving them from potential guilty feelings.
Interested in it or not, that's what you're doing. Intentionally or not. I really don't think in this day and age people are misinformed. To the contrary.

In fact, I just saw a report on the news this morning that women are feeling so pressured to breastfeed at all costs that those that cannot are turning to the internet to buy unscreened and unregulated breastmilk that has the potential to actually harm the baby. It's gotten so out of hand that women would rather put their babies at risk than admit to not breastfeeding.

So all of this fervor, albeit well intentioned, is driving some mothers to expose their infants to potentially toxic milk. Which is what happens when you guilt mothers into doing what you want them to do regardless of whether it's actually in the child's best interest.
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Old 03-02-2011, 10:49 AM
 
2,725 posts, read 5,188,995 times
Reputation: 1963
Quote:
Originally Posted by ADVentive View Post
I bring it up because people were saying that mothers who try their best to breastfeed and then don't succeed shouldn't be made to feel guilty. I am saying that 1) why would they feel guilty if they tried their best?, and 2) many don't try very much, and why not? I am not interested in making people feel guilty. But I am also not interested in perpetuating what I consider to be misinformation in the interest of saving them from potential guilty feelings.
The thing is that people do the best they can which is what they believe to be in the best interest of their baby.

If they feel guilty, it is something out of your control but that you are trying to control. Putting the correct information out there is only going to help so much. The mother at some point has to learn to stand on her own, ask the right questions if she is in doubt and know what steps she needs to take in order to get to her goal. Telling the mother she could have made a better choice if only she knew this and that is like telling her that it is everybody else's fault for not telling her everything she needed to know.

Last edited by crisan; 03-02-2011 at 11:12 AM..
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