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Old 08-10-2015, 04:53 AM
 
Location: cleveland
2,365 posts, read 4,376,944 times
Reputation: 1645

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that's your opinion Fitzgerald was a better candidate than kasich. And if you think the democrats are less corrupt than republicans.. They are the same .. I wonder why you ignored my fact that the poorest cities with the highest crime rates (Cleveland, Detroit,Chicago,Baltimore,etc.) have been run by democrats for decades.?. Or is that the republicans fault also?? Sorry but I am not interested in a liberal progressive agenda that pushes a socialist economy instead of capitalism.. Political correctness, white guilt/privilege , etc. Come from liberal progressives. No thank you.
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Old 08-10-2015, 04:57 AM
 
Location: cleveland
2,365 posts, read 4,376,944 times
Reputation: 1645
And of course most uneducated voting people will vote for Democrats because they live off of the government handouts. same reason why Democrats want amnesty for millions of illegal aliens, they look at it as a way to gain votes for themselves. the Democrats don't care about you and me otherwise they wouldn't flood this country with illegals leeching off our health, education, and welfare system.
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Old 08-10-2015, 04:58 AM
 
8,924 posts, read 5,630,750 times
Reputation: 12560
He's ok. More so than any of the other Republicans running. I won't vote for any Republican myself. We've got the Supreme Court to think about. We don't need another Scalia or Thomas.
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Old 08-10-2015, 05:59 AM
 
11,610 posts, read 10,446,525 times
Reputation: 7217
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1watertiger View Post
that's your opinion Fitzgerald was a better candidate than kasich. And if you think the democrats are less corrupt than republicans.. They are the same .. I wonder why you ignored my fact that the poorest cities with the highest crime rates (Cleveland, Detroit,Chicago,Baltimore,etc.) have been run by democrats for decades.?. Or is that the republicans fault also?? Sorry but I am not interested in a liberal progressive agenda that pushes a socialist economy instead of capitalism.. Political correctness, white guilt/privilege , etc. Come from liberal progressives. No thank you.
You're correct that the urban poor vote for Democrats because they want decent public services including schools, housing, food, healthcare, etc., as well as the right to cast meaningful votes. My belief is that both the Republicans and Democrats have squashed in recent decades the poor in the U.S. by allowing a flood of unskilled workers through ridiculous immigration laws and lax enforcement, and due to horrific federal tax policies. George W. Bush promised to deal aggressively with illegal immigration, a big reason that I voted for him. He lied. Why should the urban poor vote for Kasich-like politicians? Why don't the Republicans in Congress cut funds used to police the world, and vote to enforce immigration laws and stamp out gangs and illegal drugs, and establish tougher testing and punishments for consumers of illegal drugs, especially politicians and government employees? Why do high school athletes face tougher drug testing than members of Congress? Why do we have any loopholes in our gun laws that allow easy acquisition of weapons by criminals and those with mental issues?

In other posts, I've described how manufacturing has been drained from this country due to our failure to have a value-added tax, allowing for a flood of imports and punishing our exports of manufactured goods.

Yet here we go, as the real Watertiger emerges -- he would support a Kasich over his opponent despite all of the Kasich policies that I documented were detrimental in the extreme to all of Ohio, and particularly northern Ohio and Cleveland. Again these include the injection of radioactive fracking waste water under much of Ohio while squashing public hearings, poor stewardship of Ohio rivers and Lake Erie enabling agriculture run-off to feed toxic algal blooms, the leveraging of the Ohio Turnpike paid for by ever increasing tolls, a disgusting gerrymandering of Ohio, and much more.

Do you like all of these policies? You haven't defended one of them. You don't know what Fitzgerald would have said or done about these policies because Kasich refused to debate Fitzgerald and because Ohio's media, including especially the Plain Dealer and NEOMG, decided instead that the two most important issues in the race were the manufactured "car incident," and Fitzgerald's failure to have a driver's license for several years.

The Plain Dealer and Ohio media ignored Fitzgerald's exceptional and revolutionary transformation of Cuyahoga County government.

The Plain Dealer and other Ohio newspapers never cared that the information about Fitzgerald's license was illegally obtained, thereby enabling "Nixon enemy list" like attacks on all Ohioans by all of those in political power. Yet you claimed that the Plain Dealer was a liberal, Democratic paper. Sickening.

I think the car incident was disgusting and a lasting indictment of the Plain Dealer and the NEOMG. If we truly had a liberal, Democratic media outlet in Cleveland, or anywhere in Ohio, they would have eviscerated the Plain Dealer and the NEOMG over this contrived political smear. Any truly objective media outlets would have explored in depth and held Kasich responsible for his policies.

What do you care about -- "political correctness, white/guilt privilege, etc." What are these specifically? So in opposition to these you'll gut the economy, the environment and the middle class?

I've never defended the Democrats as a party. They often have been corrupt, such as in Cuyahoga County. My point is that this corruptness pales against the long-term harm caused by Republican corruptness, as I've repeatedly documented in Ohio. Ignoring overwhelming scientific consensus and ignoring the mounting catastrophe that is climate change, mostly IMO to curry the political support of the Koch brothers and other vested fossil fuel interests, we are perhaps witnessing the most corrupt and disastrous political policy in American history, even surpassing slavery.

Don't you think there are overtly corrupt Republicans? Don't you know about former IL governor George Ryan? What about Chris Christie and Bridgegate?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_L...losure_scandal

I personally find the Ohio Turnpike and JobsOhio Republican policies to be very corrupt; don't you? The latter violated the Ohio Constitution, even in the eyes of Libertarians, and was made possible only by a majority of Ohio's Republican political Supreme Court justices who refused to hear the case because the plaintiffs lacked "standing," because they "merely" were Ohio taxpayers outraged by the transfer of public funds to a secretive private entity in violation of express provisions of the Ohio Constitution. Isn't JobsOhio corrupt in your mind? Are the likely 5-7 percent underwriting fees paid to investment banks to underwrite Ohio Turnpike leveraging debt and JobsOhio debt in no way corrupt? Why have none of the "liberal Democratic" Ohio media quantified these underwriting fees (answer: because there is no liberal, Democratic mainstream media in Ohio to my knowledge)?

Your response is to throw out a "progressive liberal" label, and think that you've proved your point. You've been well trained by Fox News and the Donald Trumps of our political system.

Candidly, if persons can't talk policies, I have no use for their political beliefs. Label politics are the refuge of the ignorant and the lazy. So tell us what your position is on just the Ohio Turnpike and Lake Erie pollution and whether you support Kasich on these issues. Then go on to fracking waste water injection and JobsOhio.

Those who engage in label politics brand themselves, and nobody else.

Let's talk issues. I could label you and others, but it accomplishes nothing. Labels are the mainstay not only of the ignorant, but also of the easily manipulated IMO. I have to look no further than Russia today, or even Nazi Germany, to see what happens when label politics takes precedence over robust policy debate, especially when objective news media are outlawed or otherwise become scarce commodities.

If those who live and die by "label" politics continue to drink the Kool-Aid and ignore the policy issues, they will deserve the inevitably disastrous results. Ohio today, with a suffering middle class and a lake of green sludge and the ticking time bomb of radioactive fracking waste water, is an obvious example of this reality.

Last edited by WRnative; 08-10-2015 at 06:36 AM..
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Old 08-10-2015, 06:05 AM
 
Location: Cleveland and Columbus OH
11,063 posts, read 12,460,703 times
Reputation: 10390
Kasich actually came off as he most reasonable at the debate. Won't be voting for anyone though. Bunch a clowns.
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Old 08-10-2015, 06:32 AM
 
11,610 posts, read 10,446,525 times
Reputation: 7217
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1watertiger View Post
And of course most uneducated voting people will vote for Democrats because they live off of the government handouts. same reason why Democrats want amnesty for millions of illegal aliens, they look at it as a way to gain votes for themselves. the Democrats don't care about you and me otherwise they wouldn't flood this country with illegals leeching off our health, education, and welfare system.
Another wrongful statement. The Democrats supported the bipartisan Senate bill immigration bill that, IMO, was highly deficient but still a massive improvement over current law. The House Republicans have done nothing, not even passing their own immigration bill. The large majority of Republicans, even among the Presidential candidates support some form of amnesty.

I want to see a Republican immigration bill. Where is it?

Again, your policy analysis seems highly biased and inaccurate.
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Old 08-10-2015, 07:42 AM
 
Location: cleveland
2,365 posts, read 4,376,944 times
Reputation: 1645
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
You're correct that the urban poor vote for Democrats because they want decent public services including schools, housing, food, healthcare, etc., as well as the right to cast meaningful votes. My belief is that both the Republicans and Democrats have squashed in recent decades the poor in the U.S. by allowing a flood of unskilled workers through ridiculous immigration laws and lax enforcement, and due to horrific federal tax policies. George W. Bush promised to deal aggressively with illegal immigration, a big reason that I voted for him. He lied. Why should the urban poor vote for Kasich-like politicians? Why don't the Republicans in Congress cut funds used to police the world, and vote to enforce immigration laws and stamp out gangs and illegal drugs, and establish tougher testing and punishments for consumers of illegal drugs, especially politicians and government employees? Why do high school athletes face tougher drug testing than members of Congress? Why do we have any loopholes in our gun laws that allow easy acquisition of weapons by criminals and those with mental issues?

In other posts, I've described how manufacturing has been drained from this country due to our failure to have a value-added tax, allowing for a flood of imports and punishing our exports of manufactured goods.

Yet here we go, as the real Watertiger emerges -- he would support a Kasich over his opponent despite all of the Kasich policies that I documented were detrimental in the extreme to all of Ohio, and particularly northern Ohio and Cleveland. Again these include the injection of radioactive fracking waste water under much of Ohio while squashing public hearings, poor stewardship of Ohio rivers and Lake Erie enabling agriculture run-off to feed toxic algal blooms, the leveraging of the Ohio Turnpike paid for by ever increasing tolls, a disgusting gerrymandering of Ohio, and much more.

Do you like all of these policies? You haven't defended one of them. You don't know what Fitzgerald would have said or done about these policies because Kasich refused to debate Fitzgerald and because Ohio's media, including especially the Plain Dealer and NEOMG, decided instead that the two most important issues in the race were the manufactured "car incident," and Fitzgerald's failure to have a driver's license for several years.

The Plain Dealer and Ohio media ignored Fitzgerald's exceptional and revolutionary transformation of Cuyahoga County government.

The Plain Dealer and other Ohio newspapers never cared that the information about Fitzgerald's license was illegally obtained, thereby enabling "Nixon enemy list" like attacks on all Ohioans by all of those in political power. Yet you claimed that the Plain Dealer was a liberal, Democratic paper. Sickening.

I think the car incident was disgusting and a lasting indictment of the Plain Dealer and the NEOMG. If we truly had a liberal, Democratic media outlet in Cleveland, or anywhere in Ohio, they would have eviscerated the Plain Dealer and the NEOMG over this contrived political smear. Any truly objective media outlets would have explored in depth and held Kasich responsible for his policies.

What do you care about -- "political correctness, white/guilt privilege, etc." What are these specifically? So in opposition to these you'll gut the economy, the environment and the middle class?

I've never defended the Democrats as a party. They often have been corrupt, such as in Cuyahoga County. My point is that this corruptness pales against the long-term harm caused by Republican corruptness, as I've repeatedly documented in Ohio. Ignoring overwhelming scientific consensus and ignoring the mounting catastrophe that is climate change, mostly IMO to curry the political support of the Koch brothers and other vested fossil fuel interests, we are perhaps witnessing the most corrupt and disastrous political policy in American history, even surpassing slavery.

Don't you think there are overtly corrupt Republicans? Don't you know about former IL governor George Ryan? What about Chris Christie and Bridgegate?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_L...losure_scandal

I personally find the Ohio Turnpike and JobsOhio Republican policies to be very corrupt; don't you? The latter violated the Ohio Constitution, even in the eyes of Libertarians, and was made possible only by a majority of Ohio's Republican political Supreme Court justices who refused to hear the case because the plaintiffs lacked "standing," because they "merely" were Ohio taxpayers outraged by the transfer of public funds to a secretive private entity in violation of express provisions of the Ohio Constitution. Isn't JobsOhio corrupt in your mind? Are the likely 5-7 percent underwriting fees paid to investment banks to underwrite Ohio Turnpike leveraging debt and JobsOhio debt in no way corrupt? Why have none of the "liberal Democratic" Ohio media quantified these underwriting fees (answer: because there is no liberal, Democratic mainstream media in Ohio to my knowledge)?

Your response is to throw out a "progressive liberal" label, and think that you've proved your point. You've been well trained by Fox News and the Donald Trumps of our political system.

Candidly, if persons can't talk policies, I have no use for their political beliefs. Label politics are the refuge of the ignorant and the lazy. So tell us what your position is on just the Ohio Turnpike and Lake Erie pollution and whether you support Kasich on these issues. Then go on to fracking waste water injection and JobsOhio.

Those who engage in label politics brand themselves, and nobody else.

Let's talk issues. I could label you and others, but it accomplishes nothing. Labels are the mainstay not only of the ignorant, but also of the easily manipulated IMO. I have to look no further than Russia today, or even Nazi Germany, to see what happens when label politics takes precedence over robust policy debate, especially when objective news media are outlawed or otherwise become scarce commodities.

If those who live and die by "label" politics continue to drink the Kool-Aid and ignore the policy issues, they will deserve the inevitably disastrous results. Ohio today, with a suffering middle class and a lake of green sludge and the ticking time bomb of radioactive fracking waste water, is an obvious example of this reality.
I agree with most of your post. I don't like what is happening with the turnpike or the stewardship of lake Erie.. I don't believe we need new immigration laws, we have them already, they need to be enforced.
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Old 08-10-2015, 09:38 AM
 
11,610 posts, read 10,446,525 times
Reputation: 7217
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1watertiger View Post
I agree with most of your post. I don't like what is happening with the turnpike or the stewardship of lake Erie.. I don't believe we need new immigration laws, we have them already, they need to be enforced.
So you like birth right citizenship and dual citizenship? I think both are abominations. We should require everybody to pick a country when they turn age 21, just like Japan and likely some other countries.

Legislation is needed unless your goal is to extradite all illegal immigrants in the country. Most of the Republicans don't support this, but I haven't seen anything in writing about what they do support. They've gone an entire election cycle without dealing with one of the most important issues facing the country, but they all pontificate about it and attack Obama. Disgusting.
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Old 08-10-2015, 10:26 AM
 
Location: cleveland
2,365 posts, read 4,376,944 times
Reputation: 1645
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
So you like birth right citizenship and dual citizenship? I think both are abominations. We should require everybody to pick a country when they turn age 21, just like Japan and likely some other countries.

Legislation is needed unless your goal is to extradite all illegal immigrants in the country. Most of the Republicans don't support this, but I haven't seen anything in writing about what they do support. They've gone an entire election cycle without dealing with one of the most important issues facing the country, but they all pontificate about it and attack Obama. Disgusting.
Unfortunately we don't have the resources to ship back millions of illegals already here... Many countries already make people choose the country they want and also incorporate lotteries for the lucky ones. Hungary is an example of this... I like new legal immigrants , but they need to follow our laws, learn the language ,work and pledge allegiance to america... No other country will allow you to enter their country illegally and demand health care, free school and not pay taxes.... IMO this is just crazy... Try sneaking into another country and you will be deported, jailed or shot.
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Old 08-10-2015, 10:48 AM
 
16,345 posts, read 18,071,077 times
Reputation: 7879
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1watertiger View Post
when I see people joking laughing and haggling over the price of body parts, that is a crime.obviously if it was edited, it wasn't edited enough to cover up buying and selling conversation of baby body parts for money. that was pretty clear. don't try to change that to fit your agenda. constrictive political correctness in this country is a good example of far left liberal progressiveness.
How do you really know what the context of what was filmed really was if you acknowledge it was edited by an extremely biased organization? You don't, but you choose to believe it to factually present a completely accurate depiction of PP's entire basis for existence anyway, which is so completely illogical that it's hard to believe you could be that naïve.

PC gets thrown around a lot these days, and the accusation is almost universally used when someone being a bigot, racist, misogynist, etc. is called out for being such. It's almost comical. There are times when it goes to far, but most people seem to have no idea what being "too PC" actually means.
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