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Some responses clearly show that people don't get it. It's fine, I am not going to reformulate or allegorize again and again.
If so inclined, re-read my posts #1 and #30, this time c.a.r.e.f.u.l.l.y
Then re-read the post of kettlepot #31 who gets it. Their German/Austrian grandparent lived in USA during Hitler's atrocities... Meeting another German, in USA, ruddy from beer and sausages, happily exclaiming something like "Happy Oktoberfest!", dancing Bavarian dances.... wouldn't sit well neither with their grandmother, nor probably with the rest of Americans who were busy producing ammunition for the war. Would she say to him "Have a good holiday!" ?
--- just think, please, before thinking that you could help. You do have some gray matter.
Always get a chuckle out of rants that don't really want responses under the guise of wanting help with something. When anyone has the audacity to offer their insights or opinions the OP starts getting defensive, turns around and insults them (the gray matter comment was uncalled for!). What did you expect when you expose your troubles on a social media platform in the first place? No replies at all? Why not say that right up front? Somehow, I suspect you'd be just if not more upset if people followed your instructions.
FWIW, this is more than simply not wanting to discuss Russian topics. You seem to have a burr under your saddle no one but you can remove. You're already primed to be offended and ready to rumble with anyone who doesn't act as an echo chamber for your thoughts. You want validation, not discussion. What an exhausting way to go through life. Maybe your prickly attitude is part of the reason this colleague's relatively innocuous conversation irritates you so much. IMHO this makes the problem more of your doing, not his. Whatever. Enough's enough. Inform this colleague you prefer not to discuss topics related to Russia. Be civil and professional. Then go out and have a better life. Good luck OP. You'll probably need it.
Last edited by Parnassia; 01-01-2023 at 04:47 PM..
You never arrived! But you will not be able to slip on a new persona. You will always be an immigrant; a Russian immigrant.
Creating drama over the fact that someone has close ties to his roots and keeps some traditions and the language and whose political views may not be yours is your decision.
Keeping your native language, traditions and family from your children will come to haunt you. What the father tried to forget the grandson tries to remember.
Hate takes a lot of your soul. If you cannot deal with a remote coworker get a new job.
She's not asking for advice on how to raise her children.
Some responses clearly show that people don't get it. It's fine, I am not going to reformulate or allegorize again and again.
If so inclined, re-read my posts #1 and #30, this time c.a.r.e.f.u.l.l.y
Then re-read the post of kettlepot #31 who gets it. Their German/Austrian grandparent lived in USA during Hitler's atrocities... Meeting another German, in USA, ruddy from beer and sausages, happily exclaiming something like "Happy Oktoberfest!", dancing Bavarian dances.... wouldn't sit well neither with their grandmother, nor probably with the rest of Americans who were busy producing ammunition for the war. Would she say to him "Have a good holiday!" ?
--- just think, please, before thinking that you could help. You do have some gray matter.
sarcasm and condescension are also not something i bring to the workplace
My comments and input on this thread have been succinct, helpful, and on topic.
if a co-worker annoys you with intrusive comments, there are ways to respond that are courteous, respectful, and professional.
in the workplace, interacting with co-workers, it is absolutely irrelevant what a person's religion is, what their immigration status is, what their birthplace is, what their family history is, what their grandparents experiences are, what holidays they or do not celebrate, or what languages they speak. in the workplace, all a person has to know how to do, is behave like a professional. That means don't discuss any of the following: politics, religion, sex, current events, or any personal information. Or it leads to problems. which is exactly what the OP is experiencing.
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 01-01-2023 at 05:20 PM..
Canada celebrates multi-culturalism. No one takes exception to others celebrating "Happy Hanukkah, Happy Dwivali, Happy Easter, Happy Nowruz, Happy Muharram, Happy Ramadan, Hapy Seollal, ... ."
Evil men do grow old. That will not affect me on how I view and treat my fellow human beings, with mutual respect and tolerance.
I have a lot of doubts about this thread and its intent. I don't think the OP is actually in Canada and he doesn't understand what it means to be an assimilated immigrant Canadian.
Any immigrant who's already spent 25 years of assimilation in Canada knows that Canada is a multi-multi-cultural country and Canadians don't take exception to anyone else celebrating and sharing other cultures and their holiday traditions with other people of different cultures. Additionally, some of the very first skills that assimilating immigrant Canadians learn is the importance in Canada of being diplomatic, respectful and polite to others if they expect to get any respect and credit in return. That doesn't appear to have been learned in this case here so I think it's somebody somewhere else with some agenda other than what was stated.
I have a lot of doubts about this thread and its intent. I don't think the OP is actually in Canada and he doesn't understand what it means to be an assimilated immigrant Canadian.
Any immigrant who's already spent 25 years of assimilation in Canada knows that Canada is a multi-multi-cultural country and Canadians don't take exception to anyone else celebrating and sharing other cultures and their holiday traditions with other people of different cultures. Additionally, some of the very first skills that assimilating immigrant Canadians learn is the importance in Canada of being diplomatic, respectful and polite to others if they expect to get any respect and credit in return. That doesn't appear to have been learned in this case here so I think it's somebody somewhere else with some agenda other than what was stated.
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i believe you are on to something. it is someone who has only posted to start this one thread. Which is often a red flag of , well, something else going on. good catch Zois
I immigrated more than 25 years ago. I have rarely met Russian-speaking people here, I have not been seeking out Russian communities. I married a Canadian man, my kids speak English and French (no Russian). I got assimilated, my interests are those of an ordinary Canadian. Daily, I read The Globe and Mail, CBC, then WaPo, NYT, WSJ, etc. I skim Russian media maybe twice a year, get astonished at the brainwashing going on in there, and close the websites. I work in IT. I had little interest of what was happening in that part of the world until February 24, 2022. The holidays they celebrate over there slowly stopped being important to me over the first several years of my arrival, for example I don't care anymore of such dates as November 7, March 8, May 1, February 23, January 13 (some of them leftovers from the Communist era, some from the Gregorian calendar). These dates probably mean nothing to the majority of the people on here - well, they don't evoke anything in me, neither.
There was a single incident that made me feel the deep divide -- so many thousands of miles away! -- after Feb. 24: a masseuse with a Ukrainian name started cancelling my appointments. But that was a single hiccup. Otherwise, I live my simple Canadian life - well, because I feel that I am Canadian, ... unless, rarely, someone gets into my face with some insensitive question like "No, really, where are you from?"
All this is to say that I don't know how to handle this particular colleague. He was born in Luhansk during USSR, then moved to Moscow to get his higher education, and eventually to Canada, about the same time as I did. He and his wife are Russian-speaking people, that is, his English is still limping. He still travels to Russia every year (well, not in 2022).
I was erring on the side of caution trying not to be asking him directly which side he is on, since I have to keep working with him. From a very few remarks I gather that he is probably Putin sympathizer, or at least mentioned that "Ukry" (an insulting word for Ukrainians) bombed Donbass. OK, I just resolved to never bring this topic with him ever.
Anyway, he keeps bringing (on slack since we are remote) different Russian-related tidbits: for example, that a particular local Russian store started selling these particular gifts for these particular holidays. Remember, I don't care about them anymore, they are just random dates to me, -- and after Feb 24 my emotions shifted towards rather hatred of everything Russian. I'd just answer with generic "oh ok thanks" and such. However, I did get tired last week from avoiding the direct speak... so I said that since I had once met a pro-Putin store owner, I stopped cold and have no intentions of visiting Ruzzian stores.
He had to get it, right????
I now watch Ukrainian journalists interviewing Russian POWs and it is like peering into a collective Ruzzian brain with a toxic mixture of propaganda...
My Christmas is the holiday my children celebrate, that is, 25th of December. It's gone, we exchanged gifts, we cooked Christmas dinner and then had a brunch the next day... Today is New Years eve and that's it, the holidays - for me - will be over.
He appears today online and heartily congratulates me in the Russian manner: "Happy New Year and Happy approaching Christmas!" - because, again, their Christmas is on January 13. I must admit it makes me angry and exasperated. I had told him before that I was Canadian. I don't think he gets what I mean. He hears my Russian and immediately assumes that I am pro- all his holidays and that I am happy to celebrate them.
I googled "If someone wishes me happy holidays for a holiday that I don't celebrate, how should I tell them that I don't celebrate it without being rude?" - and the answers are sensible, like:
"If you don't celebrate Christmas and someone wishes you a Merry Christmas, look at it this way. There is a day on the calendar marked Christmas. On that day, they wish you have a merry day. Whether you do anything special on that day, it should not be considered offensive for anyone to wish you well on a specific day. By the same token, as a Christian, if someone wishes me a Happy Hanukkah or Kwanza I apply the same idea. Stop looking for reasons to divide us. Just appreciate it as a well wish and leave it at that.
- I would say the same if someone congratulated me with Kwanzaa - but I have no emotions attached to Kwanzaa.
But, in my case, I have this twist of HATING what Ruzzians have turned out to be, and hating their stupid holidays. And the second twist is, that I have to continue to keep working with this man.
I get what the issue is, when you immigrated, you were embracing your new life, and at some point, stopped celebrating Russian holidays, etc and that especially now, with what Putin is doing in Russia that you wish to not have anything to do with Russian anything...
Both of my parents immigrated to the US from Hungary in 57, one of my mother in laws immigrated from Germany in the 40's after being in a displaced person's camp where she starved if not for an American soldier who would marry her, bringing her to the US.
MIL would not speak about her life in Germany, my father did not speak of his life in Hungary. He never returned as he was afraid he would be locked up, never allowed to return to the US while my mother did go back.
I think you need to inform this coworker that you do not want to discuss topics such as Russia, that you consider it to be similar to discussing politics and religion. It's very possible you will have to tell them point blank that while you were born there, when you immigrated to Canada, that you were embracing Canadian life. Let him know that you will not be discussing anything Russian from now on.
It sounds like he still loves Russia, may support Putin; that he is looking for someone Russian that feels the same.
Quote:
Originally Posted by skieer
Some responses clearly show that people don't get it. It's fine, I am not going to reformulate or allegorize again and again.
If so inclined, re-read my posts #1 and #30, this time c.a.r.e.f.u.l.l.y
Then re-read the post of kettlepot #31 who gets it. Their German/Austrian grandparent lived in USA during Hitler's atrocities... Meeting another German, in USA, ruddy from beer and sausages, happily exclaiming something like "Happy Oktoberfest!", dancing Bavarian dances.... wouldn't sit well neither with their grandmother, nor probably with the rest of Americans who were busy producing ammunition for the war. Would she say to him "Have a good holiday!" ?
--- just think, please, before thinking that you could help. You do have some gray matter.
I have not read many replies where "people do not get it." You need to read replies in a neutral tone which you may not be able to do because you're disgusted about this situation at work.
OP, I am Ukrainian-Canadian (2nd gen Canadian). In the old country, my cousins are living in basements with no power, heat or water, but I don't hate the common Russians for it. It's all on Putin, the terrorist.
Russian people are beautiful in their own way and incredibly resourceful. Along with Ukraine, they need to be liberated from Putin too and live the good lives they have long been denied.
Kindly don't divide your kids from their heritage. It's sad that you are so upset because you are Russian. My mother used to hide the fact she was Ukrainian and that's in Canada in the mid 20th century.They were thought of as less than the Indians in the very early settler days in the Canadian Prairies.
Try putting a Ukrainian flag patch on the shoulders of your coat. Maybe it will help you avoid conflict.
I'd say Ukraine signed Minsk treaties, and failure to obey their terms brought it on Ukrainian people. Sad story, but it's not Putin who is a terrorist.
I have a lot of doubts about this thread and its intent. I don't think the OP is actually in Canada and he doesn't understand what it means to be an assimilated immigrant Canadian.
Any immigrant who's already spent 25 years of assimilation in Canada knows that Canada is a multi-multi-cultural country and Canadians don't take exception to anyone else celebrating and sharing other cultures and their holiday traditions with other people of different cultures. Additionally, some of the very first skills that assimilating immigrant Canadians learn is the importance in Canada of being diplomatic, respectful and polite to others if they expect to get any respect and credit in return. That doesn't appear to have been learned in this case here so I think it's somebody somewhere else with some agenda other than what was stated.
I have a lot of doubts about this thread and its intent. I don't think the OP is actually in Canada and he doesn't understand what it means to be an assimilated immigrant Canadian.
Any immigrant who's already spent 25 years of assimilation in Canada knows that Canada is a multi-multi-cultural country and Canadians don't take exception to anyone else celebrating and sharing other cultures and their holiday traditions with other people of different cultures. Additionally, some of the very first skills that assimilating immigrant Canadians learn is the importance in Canada of being diplomatic, respectful and polite to others if they expect to get any respect and credit in return. That doesn't appear to have been learned in this case here so I think it's somebody somewhere else with some agenda other than what was stated.
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Well this made me chuckle. I've read the Canadian part of this forum for so many years... I remember when you first appeared on C-D asking about how to move to BC, or from BC (don't remember exactly). Your posts have become icier and icier in time, arriving lately at the point of "holier than thou". I liked the "earlier" you better.
Yes, Canada is multi-cultural and I belong to one of those cultures. I have the right to have feelings related to my culture. You, however, seem to deny my right to have these feelings and would rather I melange into a beige "nothing" of an abstract multi-cultural concept.
Anyway, I am flying over to Calgary in a few days to ski at Lake Louise. I can send you pictures from the ski hills.
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Maybe your prickly attitude is part of the reason this colleague's relatively innocuous conversation irritates you so much. IMHO this makes the problem more of your doing, not his. Whatever. Enough's enough. Inform this colleague you prefer not to discuss topics related to Russia. Be civil and professional. Then go out and have a better life. Good luck OP. You'll probably need it.
I don't think the OP is actually in Canada and he doesn't understand what it means to be an assimilated immigrant Canadian. 
