How would YOU resolve LA's homeless problem? (Orland: home, calculation)

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by Gunluvver2

How difficult would it be to buy a few thousand acres of desert land east of LA and put up Concertina Wire around a compound that has individual shelters with a community shower, restrooms and kitchen? The residents could make their own shelters out of Straw, concrete or whatever. Of course that would require the ability to get along with others and WORK. However the main gate would not be locked and anyone could leave at any time. A shuttle bus could transport homeless FROM LA but no return service.

unless they volunteered to go there, your plan is unconstitutional.

[Count David]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

unless they volunteered to go there, your plan is unconstitutional.

And simple in its execution.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by CaliforniaGal

Homeless situation is very complex... You have drug addicts, Alcoholics, people who have lost jobs, the Mentally Ill.

The drug addicts (especially on meth) usually are the ones committing the crimes - burglaries etc. Sweep them up-throw them into rehab? Same with alcoholics....Give the people who have lost their jobs/homes and put them into housing and help them find work. The mentally ill assess them and see what they are dealing with such as Schizophrenia or just depression.

Sadly we know the people suffering from Schizophrenia will not take their meds and I believe these folks need to be under 24/7 care. They need to be in a facility. The severe mentally ill, the ones with outbursts need to go into a facility as well. You cannot put these people out on their own as they cannot function.

Politicians just do not get it...They think outpatient clinics will do the trick or housing yet many will not stay put and will simply go back out into the streets. Again, it is VERY complex.

We here in Wiseburn, Del Aire, HollyGlen are experiencing a lot of homeless people. There seems to be camps near the exits of the freeways and this is of course where they live. They have bikes and often come into our neighborhoods and steal from us. If anything in your frontyard is not chained - they will take it. They have been known to creep into your backyards as well. It's just unsafe. The drug addicts will break into the homes...it's a problem!

How do you know that "people suffering from Schizophrenia will not take their meds"? There are approximately 70 million schizophrenics in the world. Ten's of millions of them take their meds willingly and with motivation to do so. Ten's of millions are functional around us unbeknownst as schizophrenics to us.

That said, I was a full time caretaker for a severe schizophrenic (a military vet) for a number of years, who needed to be guided to take his medications, always. Couldn't ever remember. Had virtually no concept of time. And, at times over the course of his afflicted years, did refuse to take some of the changing array of meds because of the side effects.

I mention this as a preface to what I will expand on in a separate post:
The foundational requirement to "resolve homelessness" in L.A., like anywhere else, is:
factual knowledge and understanding of the problem.

And, so far in this thread, I see next to none of that. One exception: 2sleepy. A few honorable mentions to others for intelligent observations and thinking (Ceece, Aguilar, highlanderfil, couple more maybe).

[CaliforniaGal]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

How do you know that "people suffering from Schizophrenia will not take their meds"? There are approximately 70 million schizophrenics in the world. Ten's of millions of them take their meds willingly and with motivation to do so. Ten's of millions are functional around us unbeknownst as schizophrenics to us.

That said, I was a full time caretaker for a severe schizophrenic (a military vet) for a number of years, who needed to be guided to take his medications, always. Couldn't ever remember. Had virtually no concept of time. And, at times over the course of his afflicted years, did refuse to take some of the changing array of meds because of the side effects.

I mention this as a preface to what I will expand on in a separate post:
The foundational requirement to "resolve homelessness" in L.A., like anywhere else, is:
factual knowledge and understanding of the problem.

And, so far in this thread, I see next to none of that. One exception: 2sleepy. A few honorable mentions to others for intelligent observations and thinking (Ceece, Aguilar, highlanderfil, couple more maybe).

It's been well documented that many out on the streets are schizophrenics and I have read up on this. NOT ALL do not take their meds but many do not. They leave home and end up out on the streets. My cousin was a Schizophrenic (nothing to be ashamed of) and he ended up in board and care and eventually out on the streets. He died in 2004. He was a lost soul and just refused to take his medication.

I will venture to say a lot of the older folks out on the streets are people with either Schizophrenia or Bi-Polar

[seain dublin]

Originally Posted by orcadrvr

1. Ban encampments, as suggested above.

2. Institutionalize, for increasingly longer periods of time, those who are drunk or stoned in public. Not jail, but "drunk farms" or mental health institutions as needed.

3. Institutionalize in mental facilities those who have chronic mental health issues. Give them the required medications, for free, which will enable them to live a normal life. If they refuse to take them, institutionalize them for increasingly longer periods of time (up to several years at a time in extreme cases).

4. Deport any illegals who are living on the street.

5. Arrest any homeless with outstanding warrants.

Really? That's how it started in Germany in the 30s.

You think you can just round people up and hold them for an undetermined amount of time?

The US is already turning into a police state(but you have to be paying attention to see this), you want to "speed it up a little"?

What do you define as a chronic mental issue? Someone who is Biploar? Someone who has is in a depression due to the loss of a loved one.

As far as illegals go, I'm more concerned with the ones who are driving around with no license and no car insurance, than those pushing a shopping cart.

[CaliforniaGal]

It's just a fact that the severely mentally ill out on the streets - you will NEVER get them off the streets and into housing to function on their own. I see too many real bad ones in our area - and it will take a miracle to get them off the streets and under some type of care. They've probably been out on streets for years. Sad I know but again it's just too complex.

Just my humble opinion and what I have seen. I also have a dear friend whose a Psychologist and we have had talks about the homeless. I also read a lot about it and of course my dear sweet cousin (we were close as kids) ended up on the streets of Long Beach.

[CaliforniaGal]

My husband and I would have NO problem in our taxes going to help fund a facility for the severe mentally ill. Yes, there is an issue about their rights but do we just let them continue to live on the streets - and then it becomes a huge health issue. You tell me...

[CaliforniaGal]

According to the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, 20 to 25% of the homeless population in the United States suffers from some form of severe mental illness. In comparison, only 6% of Americans are severely mentally ill (National Institute of Mental Health, 2009).

Where are the People with Schizophrenia?

Approximately:

6% are homeless or live in shelters
6% live in jails or prisons
5% to 6% live in Hospitals
10% live in Nursing homes
25% live with a family member
28% are living independently
20% live in Supervised Housing (group homes, etc.)
(Source: Surviving Schizophrenia)

Homelessness and Schizophrenia

Approximately 200,000 individuals with schizophrenia or manic-depressive illness are homeless, constituting one-third of the approximately 600,000 homeless population (total homeless population statistic based on data from Department of Health and Human Services). These 200,000 individuals comprise more than the entire population of many U.S. cities, such as Hartford, Connecticut; Charleston, South Carolina; Reno, Nevada; Boise, Idaho; Scottsdale, Arizona; Orlando, Florida; Winston Salem, North Carolina; Ann Arbor, Michigan; Abilene, Texas or Topeka, Kansas.

At any given time, there are more people with untreated severe psychiatric illnesses living on America’s streets than are receiving care in hospitals. Approximately 90,000 individuals with schizophrenia or manic-depressive illness are in hospitals receiving treatment for their disease.
Source: Treatment Advocacy Center

http://www.schizophrenia.com/szfacts.htm

[V8 Vega]

Maybe increased taxes are no problem for the likes of you but it's a big problem for me. I don't want my hard earned money squandered down the rat hole of goverment.

[Tulemutt]

adr3naline, your motivation for this thread is clearly well intentioned. Your own comments so far well balanced. But I'm not clear why you think such a complex issue can be well addressed, let alone "resolved" on an open internet forum populated by people who operate intellectually on myths and ideologies that have little to no basis in reality.

The number of CD threads on homelessness is staggering. Always featuring near total ignorance. While there are great volumes of scholarly research, studies, statistics, and documentation of experiments that work as well as those that fail - the majority of participants in these "discussions" refuse to become educated by these resources. Without hard, factual knowledge and understanding, all that is really accomplished is exacerbation of harmful, destructive stereotyping and mythologies.

A glaring repetitive example: how many people continue to believe - insist even - that the homeless migrate heavily to areas of good weather and where there are bountiful resources offered as "freebies". I have provided multiple academic and other professionally executed studies and surveys that concur this is a myth. On average, only about 10% of the nation's homeless population have migrated outside of the state where they became homeless. In San Diego and San Francisco, for example, see the stats in a chart and links here:

San Francisco’s Homeless Crisis is Homegrown and a Catch-22 February 10, 2016
As a plugged-in reader points out, the vast majority (71 percent) of the nearly 7,000 homeless now living on the streets or in the shelters of San Francisco once had a permanent residence in the city.
Nearly half (49 percent) those who once had a permanent residence in the city had maintained it for at least ten years.
And of the minority of homeless who have migrated here from other parts of the state or country (29 percent), a greater percentage of those have done so in search of work (25 percent) than to partake in the so-called liberal social services the City provides (22 percent).

Reports | Regional Task Force on the Homeless San Diego
in which survey you can find a download for
Homelessness Summary Fact Sheet

One regular poster contributing here claims this reporting is conspiratorial. Won't explain what advantage he thinks the reporting agencies would gain by false or skewed reporting. And when I contribute links from academic studies outside any agency influences, he simply denies them as well. Doesn't fit his ideological narrative.

You've got people talking about deterring the homeless from being homeless by using guns. Others want to round them up and corral them in the desert. Involuntary commitment. Seizure of their meager possessions and shelters. Bussing them away to be the same problem somewhere else (ignoring that where the vast majority of homeless want to be is where they are already familiar and have connections and histories). All ignoring the obvious unconstitutional realities and that controlling 10,000 + homeless requires an entire police force and associated resources by itself. Speaking of expense.

Also all the while ignoring proven solutions. Mostly refusing these solutions because of blind ignorance and refusal to become educated. If you refuse to educate yourselves and you want to help? Just shut up, for starters.

By the way, everybody, homelessness isn't new in history. It's always existed outside of primitive hunter-gatherer clan societies where everyone cares for each other by necessity. In fact, even in primitive clan - troupe societies, homo sapiens are proven, scientifically, to be evolved as highly socialized but nomadic hunter-gatherers capable of only living cooperatively in groups fewer in number than about 150 individuals. -- You know, like living free in tents and caves (like culverts) and cobbled together temporary structures. It's only in very recent history that mankind has transitioned to long-tern, sophisticated home ownership. This is a VERY complex and demanding lifestyle that we are opting for. Yet you all treat those who can't keep up as if they are alien to our species. They're not.