City of Charlotte considering purchasing the Eastland Mall (Gastonia, Kings Mountain: for sale, apartments)

[Charlotte485]

So the Money is coming from voter approved bonds from 2008 for Eastland mall?

[Third Strike]

Originally Posted by Charlotte485

So the Money is coming from voter approved bonds from 2008 for Eastland mall?

That's correct. The city council is voting on it this Monday.

[crestliner]

I think the city should turn it into a jail complex.We all know that it is just a matter of time before the taxpayers will get the bill for building some fancy new jail for 100s of millions of bucks. I say save money and plan for the future and build the jail now..Crime is up and so is the number of gangs with new members of MS13 coming in...We need to make it a JAIL

[frewroad]

Originally Posted by southbound_295

You're a day late & a dollar short.

The plan - Buy the mall. Develop it into a studio with sound stages.

The reason - There is an actual need.

The result/goal - jobs that pay good wages

Originally Posted by southbound_295

Please feel free to repost the Film Commision link that I posted earlier. It backs you up. Actually, if the city owns the facility, it will facilitate working with the state agency.

Why don't you give us the exact link to the page on that link that details the plan? Your link is to the home page of that commission. I entered Eastland on their site and nothing comes up. This sounds more like assumptions than anything having to do with a published plan. I notice that you have not done this in this topic.

It's easy enough to prove your point. Post the link.


Spending Bond money means the city will borrow the funds to pay for Eastland. They will also have to pay interest on this money. The repayment will be made with future tax collections.

[frewroad]

Originally Posted by Native_Son

A true market capitalist would then argue that if the film industry wanted the parcel they could work directly with the agent that offered the deal to the City. And that it would only be a valid transaction if that transfer took place without any meddling by the City and any other arrangement would be government assistance. Then I would say yes, good point! But I think the City, motivated by a desire for better quality of life for ALL of its citizens and not driven solely by a bottom line, could accept a lower profit margin in exchange for hastening the revitalization of this section of town and reaping the benefits as the economic engine sputters back to life. And this could go and on.

But it probably won't, because everyone wants to peek over their trench line and hurl generalizations and mistruths since it's so much easier than critical thought. And that is certainly their choice to make.

All I asked for is a PLAN that shows how buying Eastland will accomplish what you claim in first part of your post that I placed in bold. Without this plan, people who say such things are guilty of what you said in the 2nd part that is in bold.

In other words, and to be nicer about it, it has become a logical fallacy. i.e. The city MUST buy Eastland Mall and turn it into a film studio, else revitalization of East Charlotte is doomed. Any plan would also list the opportunity cost and alternatives to buying Eastland, IF revitalization was truly the goal. Where is this "critical thought" that you mention?

This is why the Capitalist always beats the Socialist as the capitalist is always required to justify their spending. Socialists never do since it's not their money they spend.

[Native_Son]

Originally Posted by frewroad

1. All I asked for is a PLAN that shows how buying Eastland will accomplish what you claim in first part of your post that I placed in bold.

2. Without this plan, people who say such things are guilty of what you said in the 2nd part that is in bold. In other words, and to be nicer about it, it has become a logical fallacy. i.e. The city MUST buy Eastland Mall and turn it into a film studio, else revitalization of East Charlotte is doomed.

3. Any plan would also list the opportunity cost and alternatives to buying Eastland, IF revitalization was truly the goal.

4. Where is this "critical thought" that you mention?

5. This is why the Capitalist always beats the Socialist as the capitalist is always required to justify their spending. Socialists never do since it's not their money they spend.

1. You're moving the goalposts. You never asked for the plan, frewroad... except in the post directly above. In any account, the plan as emailed to me is copied at the bottom of this post.

2. People who say "such things"?!? What "such things"?!? I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt here, but I'm having a hard time understanding what point you are trying to make. Are you saying that anyone has said the City "MUST" buy Eastland? Are you saying that anyone has said if the city doesn't buy eastland that the "revitalization of East Charlotte is doomed"? Because I haven't seen that. It's evident that you're relying on exaggerations and hyperbole because the only way the argument you make sounds valid is if it is bolstered by artificial drama.

3. Do you mean you don't like any plan that doesn't list the opportunity costs and alternatives? Are you inferring that revitalization is not the goal?

4. It's not in your posts, that's for sure. I'm a patient man though.

5. Classic frewroad post. A nearly coherent, if somewhat fluffy, post followed by an overly dramatic emotional appeal in a (weak) attempt to link the opposition to some undesirable philosophy or trait. There is no argument, support or conclusion that supports your assertion. Not in your post anyway. The real logical fallacy between our posts is the never ending presence of Ignorantio Elenchi in your posts. Red herrings for breakfast, lunch, and dinner...

Anyway... as promised, outline of the plan as I've seen it.
Here is some info on Eastland Mall from John Autry.

From: John Autry

Hello all,

I have some news to share about the Eastland property. This coming Monday the city will consider the purchase of Eastland. The sell price is 13.1 million. The price in 2009 was 24 million and did not include the Firestone store and Hollywood Video. Roughly 80 acres. The station at Central and Sharon-Amity will remain in Faison's hands and the Harris Teeter is being retained by Boxer.
Why Now?

- Control of the Eastland site allows the City to consider broad policy objectives for neighborhood stabilization and economic development through a master planned mixed-use redevelopment.
- The City was approached by a broker, FMW Real Estate, who has secured purchase contracts with seven property owners and is willing to assign the contracts to the City.
- The negotiated price is unlikely to go much lower
- Voters approved $47M in 2008 Neighborhood Improvement General Obligation bonds which included $16M for Eastland
- The City has received inquiries from the film and television production industry regarding interest in the construction of a film studio and sound stages and related development at Eastland.
- The film industry is one of Charlotte’s targeted sectors for growth.
Goals
- Goals for the property remain consistent with the 2003 Area Plan.
o Supports broad policy goals of neighborhood improvement and business corridor revitalization efforts which focus on developing public and private collaborative strategies and investments to eliminate blight and create strong local economies.
o Removes 1.2 million feet of vacant retail space, strengthening adjacent Albermarle and Central Avenue commercial districts.
- Supports the City Council’s Economic Development Focus Area Plan initiative to focus on job growth and increasing the tax base in the priority corridors including Eastland.
Staff Process
Sept. – Nov.
- Work with the Planning Department to research film industry projects to develop a Request for Qualifications/Request for Proposal (RFQ/RFP).
- Develop a communications and engagement plan for stakeholders.
Dec.
- Issue an RFQ/RFP for interested developers for a film studio/sound stage.
March-May
- Receive and review proposals
- Make recommendation to City Council for consideration.

If RFP for film industry does not yield an acceptable public – private partnership, the City will propose an interim strategy until the real estate markets improve.

Monday there will be two items for approval by council on the agenda.
1. Accept the purchase contracts from FMW
2. Purchase the property

I hope everyone can support this effort and participate in determining how the land, not consumed by a studio operation, will be used to enhance the community.

Thanks
JA

[southbound_295]

Originally Posted by frewroad

All I asked for is a PLAN that shows how buying Eastland will accomplish what you claim in first part of your post that I placed in bold. Without this plan, people who say such things are guilty of what you said in the 2nd part that is in bold.

In other words, and to be nicer about it, it has become a logical fallacy. i.e. The city MUST buy Eastland Mall and turn it into a film studio, else revitalization of East Charlotte is doomed. Any plan would also list the opportunity cost and alternatives to buying Eastland, IF revitalization was truly the goal. Where is this "critical thought" that you mention?

This is why the Capitalist always beats the Socialist as the capitalist is always required to justify their spending. Socialists never do since it's not their money they spend.

No you didn't. You've been steadfast in the same line of complaints since before the studio concept entered the thread.

When did I ever post the term "critical thought"?

Having worked in broadcast TV for over 20 years, I think that it's safe to say that I know that business better than you. While different, TV & film are incestuously related. Both industries would use the facility as well as ad agencies and marketing firms. Did you notice that the Film Commision also includes TV, or were you too busy looking for Commies under every rock?

If the city owns the facility it makes it easier for the regional Film Commision to refer people to it. If it was privately owned, people. just like you, would call it corrupt.

The Film Commision link is for the regional office of a state entity. Why would the mall sale be listed there if the city is buying it? Please explain your logic there. I see no logic.

If the city owns the facility, they would have a few critcal employees connected to it (very few). The facility would be rented out & the entity that rents it would hire & pay for the people who they need for their purposes. There is nothing socialistic about that. That's how those industries work.

In my opinion, you are starting to sound like Joe McCarthy by throwing around all of your socialist charges.

[frewroad]

That isn't a plan. That is a sales pitch from a member of the Film Commission which,as far as I know, is unelected. She is making a bunch of claims and assumptions that have not had any due diligence against them. Furthermore it also clearly states that have yet to contact anyone in the film industry with any proposal.

A proper plan would first set a goal(s) and then and only THEN would a set of options be examined for spending money to achieve that goal. Proper due diligence also asks, what happens if the $13M isn't not spent and what else could this money be used for that would stand a better chance of achieving the goal. There is none of that there.

[Native_Son]

Originally Posted by frewroad

That isn't a plan.

1. That is a sales pitch from a member of the Film Commission which,as far as I know, is unelected.
2. She
3. is making a bunch of claims and assumptions that have not had any due diligence against them.
4. Furthermore it also clearly states that have yet to contact anyone in the film industry with any proposal.

5. A proper plan would first set a goal(s) and then and only THEN would a set of options be examined for spending money to achieve that goal.
6. Proper due diligence also asks, what happens if the $13M isn't not spent and what else could this money be used for that would stand a better chance of achieving the goal. There is none of that there.

1. that is an email from Councilman John Autry, who represents the district Eastland is in. He is elected. It is not a sales pitch from a member of the Film Commission.
2. He
3. Have not had any due diligence against them? I don't think those words mean what you think they mean.
4. False (again). Direct quote: The City has received inquiries from the film and television production industry regarding interest in the construction of a film studio and sound stages and related development at Eastland.

Furthermore: how can you simultaneously assert that it is a pitch from the Film Commission AND that they have yet to contact anyone in the film industry? You even contradict yourself!
5. Did you even read the plan? Direct quote: The film industry is one of Charlotte’s targeted sectors for growth.
Goals
- Goals for the property remain consistent with the 2003 Area Plan.
o Supports broad policy goals of neighborhood improvement and business corridor revitalization efforts which focus on developing public and private collaborative strategies and investments to eliminate blight and create strong local economies.
o Removes 1.2 million feet of vacant retail space, strengthening adjacent Albermarle and Central Avenue commercial districts.
- Supports the City Council’s Economic Development Focus Area Plan initiative to focus on job growth and increasing the tax base in the priority corridors including Eastland.
6. If the 13MM "isn't not" spent it is spent. But evidently you would rather Council spend time and money on more studies, despite the fact that the plan apparently meets a multitude of goals as already set forth and agreed upon. At a certain point you have to start analyzing and start acting. For 13MM (chump change for the city which I believe has an annual budget exceeding one billion dollars) I'd stand behind Council showing some gumption and pulling the trigger. They've already shot down a very sensible CIP and budget because S. Charlotte can't pull their heads out of their asses long enough to think about anyone other than themselves, this is a good opportunity to right one of a long list of wrongs.

It's obvious you are anti, and that's fine. Go ahead and post your rants, but I won't be responding any longer unless you can put together a cogent argument and address some of the other comments.

And good luck with your anarchy. Hope your septic system doesn't clog...

[southbound_295]

Originally Posted by frewroad

That isn't a plan. That is a sales pitch from a member of the Film Commission which,as far as I know, is unelected. She is making a bunch of claims and assumptions that have not had any due diligence against them. Furthermore it also clearly states that have yet to contact anyone in the film industry with any proposal.

A proper plan would first set a goal(s) and then and only THEN would a set of options be examined for spending money to achieve that goal. Proper due diligence also asks, what happens if the $13M isn't not spent and what else could this money be used for that would stand a better chance of achieving the goal. There is none of that there.

This isn't even coherent. An email from a male councilman from that district was posted.

I posted, earlier, that I was told by someone that there had been inqueries to the regional office of the Film Commision. This information was surely passed on to the city's officials. There's nothing wrong with that. Not passing the information on would be negligent.

Ad agencies would have some use for the facility. Marketing firms would also have a use for it. Video production houses would also have limited use of it. The film & TV industries are 2 of the most capitalistic industries on the face of the earth.

In the unlikely event that the city did not find a good enough reason to build this facility, having it all bundled together would make it easier to sell. If it does get built, small supporting businesses would spring up around it. I realize that you don't care because you are on a hunt for commies. Since you know nothing about these industries, go ahead & keep up your rants. I'm not going to respond to nonsense again.