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Wouldn't the logical reason for this be the curriculum at SPSU is more rigorous than those of its liberal arts counterparts, KSU, GSU, AAU, et.al?
Yes. I do agree here 100%. SPSU>all those schools. Definitely. I have seen the work students do there and compared it to my own and other schools. I know their curriculum is more rigorous than GSU, KSU, AAU, GA Southern etc. It's when you started comparing SPSU with Georgia Tech is when I started laughing. SPSU is more rigorous than those liberal art programs AND STEM programs. They're probably better too.
This fact, along with a higher workload in the sciences and engineering, explains why it takes longer to graduate from SPSU.
No. The SAT of SPSU is an indication of the fact that EVERYONE used it as a backup to Tech and end up transferring which skews that grad rate. Engineering or not, the graduation rate and retention rate is awful and very low. The coursework is definitely difficult and more difficult on average than all the schools you named, but SPSU is still in hot waters and should be merged. It is not an efficient school and it is not anyone's first choice. Consolidating the programs will give SPSU growth to blossem into a stronger program.
In addition, SPSU has a considerable night school offering. Why would a student's age be part of your argument? SPSU has a large number of working part time students. Also, the school attracts a large number of veterans, who also tend to be older.
That was in response to you artificially putting SPSU over KSU/GSU who both have a high post-bacc and commuter population. Again, I agree that SPSU is academically more rigorous than both these schools when comparing same programs. Why? Because it is a fact..not an exaggerated opinion(cough)
Again, if you don't have direct experience in engineering or with SPSU in some way, you would be well served to research what you are talking about.
I don't have anything against SPSU. I say things like it is just as I do about Georgia State. I still did my own research, as demonstrated by all the citations I gave in my previous post..compared to nothing from you. But thanks. Do I get my full ride to SPSU now?
Wouldn't the logical reason for this be the curriculum at SPSU is more rigorous than those of its liberal arts counterparts, KSU, GSU, AAU, et.al?
Yes. I do agree here 100%. SPSU>all those schools. Definitely. I have seen the work students do there and compared it to my own and other schools. I know their curriculum is more rigorous than GSU, KSU, AAU, GA Southern etc. It's when you started comparing SPSU with Georgia Tech is when I started laughing. SPSU is more rigorous than those liberal art programs AND STEM programs. They're probably better too.
This fact, along with a higher workload in the sciences and engineering, explains why it takes longer to graduate from SPSU.
No. The SAT of SPSU is an indication of the fact that EVERYONE used it as a backup to Tech and end up transferring which skews that grad rate. Engineering or not, the graduation rate and retention rate is awful and very low. The coursework is definitely difficult and more difficult on average than all the schools you named, but SPSU is still in hot waters and should be merged. It is not an efficient school and it is not anyone's first choice. Consolidating the programs will give SPSU growth to blossem into a stronger program.
In addition, SPSU has a considerable night school offering. Why would a student's age be part of your argument? SPSU has a large number of working part time students. Also, the school attracts a large number of veterans, who also tend to be older.
That was in response to you artificially putting SPSU over KSU/GSU who both have a high post-bacc and commuter population. Again, I agree that SPSU is academically more rigorous than both these schools when comparing same programs. Why? Because it is a fact..not an exaggerated opinion(cough)
Again, if you don't have direct experience in engineering or with SPSU in some way, you would be well served to research what you are talking about.
I don't have anything against SPSU. I say things like it is just as I do about Georgia State. I still did my own research, as demonstrated by all the citations I gave in my previous post..compared to nothing from you. But thanks. Do I get my full ride to SPSU now?
Chef,
At last, some enlightment. Thank you. SPSU is better than GT in this respect. For practical, applied engineering SPSU gets the nod. For theory, research, PhD's, GT is as good as it gets anywhere. I work in a practical world fulfilling practical needs. SPSU fulfills that need better than GT. Simple as that.
Look at it this way. GT instilled it's level of excellence into SPSU when SPSU was part of GT. As I said, GT is the toughest school to get into in Georgia and to graduate from. No contest.
Oh man. We were finally getting some progress. You've regressed.
The flagship of Georgia is the University of Georgia. SPSU is a joke compared to Georgia Tech.
Get your facts straight. You just displayed that you know nothing about this topic. Take your own advice and do research. so that YOU can be enlightened. Go on SPSU's campus and talk about this babble and every student would be laughing. Everyone. Faculty included. SPSU does it's job just perfectly. It serves as a 4-year version of community college for GT transfers.
Oh man. We were finally getting some progress. You've regressed.
The flagship of Georgia is the University of Georgia. SPSU is a joke compared to Georgia Tech.
Get your facts straight. You just displayed that you know nothing about this topic. Take your own advice and do research. so that YOU can be enlightened. Go on SPSU's campus and talk about this babble and every student would be laughing. Everyone. Faculty included. SPSU does it's job just perfectly. It serves as a 4-year version of community college for GT transfers.
I wonder how this will change recruitment between GSU, KSU and GA Southern?
Chef,
Since SPSU is so bad from a quality standpoint, where does that leave KSU, GSU, UWG, AAU, and the rest of the USG schools? Where does that leave the liberal arts college you attended or now attend?
It's fairly obvious you probably still are in college, or should be. Get an engineering degree, work for ten years in engineering, then let me know what you think about this subject. It's painfully little at this point.
I'm not saying SPSU is BAD. It's just not ANYWHERE NEAR where you think it is. If consolidated, the school's assets would be better utilized and GROWN(instead of depleted..like now). I'm saying things like it is. They say journalism is writing things nobody wants you to know. Consider my posts journalism. I don't go to an amazing school at all. I go to Georgia State...but I did have the stats to go to much better schools(accepted to UGA and GT). You have a diluted viewpoint about SPSU. That's why you come back with a "no you" approach. I'm not trying to be a jerk here. I'm not talking about engineering either, so stop with the "I have worked in engineering for some odd years." If you were to try to get a job these days things would be different. I don't want to be an engineer. I tutor engineers...you guys are annoying.
Also, I'm talking about the USG and SPSU, two topics you know nothing about. I'm talking from a student's perspective. Do research. You need to do research.
Read this article for start. You need to understand the KSU-SPSU merger origin. Then you can read this old thread I have also linked. It is mainly about GSU, but it also involves KSU(and possible KSU-SPSU merging). After that you can go on collegeboard and take a look at where SPSU stands as an academic institution. Look at some rankings while you're at it. Then, consult SPSU's fact-book and enrollment, selectivity, budget, research, endowment, graduation and curriculum trends. After that, I suggest you start reading more about how public colleges work in Georgia. Read up on the USG. After that, consult the opinions of top engineering academics as well as undergrad and grad students in STEM and non-STEM fields in Georgia and in the regional South. You will need that to fluff down your opinion of SPSU.
Come back, and then you shall be ready. Let's debate on how to improve SPSU.
I'm not saying SPSU is BAD. It's just not ANYWHERE NEAR where you think it is. If consolidated, the school's assets would be better utilized and GROWN(instead of depleted..like now). I'm saying things like it is. They say journalism is writing things nobody wants you to know. Consider my posts journalism. I don't go to an amazing school at all. I go to Georgia State...but I did have the stats to go to much better schools(accepted to UGA and GT). You have a diluted viewpoint about SPSU. That's why you come back with a "no you" approach. I'm not trying to be a jerk here. I'm not talking about engineering either, so stop with the "I have worked in engineering for some odd years." If you were to try to get a job these days things would be different. I don't want to be an engineer. I tutor engineers...you guys are annoying.
Also, I'm talking about the USG and SPSU, two topics you know nothing about. I'm talking from a student's perspective. Do research. You need to do research.
Read this article for start. You need to understand the KSU-SPSU merger origin. Then you can read this old thread I have also linked. It is mainly about GSU, but it also involves KSU(and possible KSU-SPSU merging). After that you can go on collegeboard and take a look at where SPSU stands as an academic institution. Look at some rankings while you're at it. Then, consult SPSU's fact-book and enrollment, selectivity, budget, research, endowment, graduation and curriculum trends. After that, I suggest you start reading more about how public colleges work in Georgia. Read up on the USG. After that, consult the opinions of top engineering academics as well as undergrad and grad students in STEM and non-STEM fields in Georgia and in the regional South. You will need that to fluff down your opinion of SPSU.
Come back, and then you shall be ready. Let's debate on how to improve SPSU.
Chef,
It's begining to be clear where you are coming from. Your tenacity is admired. You might even make a good engineer. Nothing against jouralsim, except journalists tend to be uber liberal. I have read the above two articles. The merger article in the MDJ is old news and what the paper said was a possibility for KSU/SPSU did not come to pass. The combination of GT/SPSU didn't work and neither would a KSU merger.
As to KSU's new science building, if size matters, SPSU recently opened a 130,000 sq. ft. engineering-technology center that cost $32M.
I make more money more quickly from an SPSU grad than I do from a GT grad. It's that simple. And it's money, profit, it's called making a living for all concerned. I can measure dollars. GPA's and the origin of a sheepskin are way behind that commodity to me. That's my metric.
Chef,
It's begining to be clear where you are coming from. Your tenacity is admired. You might even make a good engineer. Nothing against jouralsim, except journalists tend to be uber liberal. I have read the above two articles. The merger article in the MDJ is old news and what the paper said was a possibility for KSU/SPSU did not come to pass. The combination of GT/SPSU didn't work and neither would a KSU merger.
As to KSU's new science building, if size matters, SPSU recently opened a 130,000 sq. ft. engineering-technology center that cost $32M.
I make more money more quickly from an SPSU grad than I do from a GT grad. It's that simple. And it's money, profit, it's called making a living for all concerned. I can measure dollars. GPA's and the origin of a sheepskin are way behind that commodity to me. That's my metric.
Engineering Technology Center was built in 2008 for 33 million. That construction will be best used when SPSU merges with KSU.
I feel like you're just yanking my chain now. Stop using IPEDS to artificially boost SPSU's score. You have already posted that link. We already went over this twice. The only reason SPSU's score is where it is because the school is filled with GT rejects who end up transferring. The school had a 79% acceptance rate in 2012. Nobody wants to go to SPSU. They use it as a backup. The campus is a joke, the professors suck, the reputation is poor, the graduation rates are poor, no tradition or sports, no prominent alumni or high instances of gift giving(low endowment). The school needs to be merged so that all the good of SPSU can be used. Right now it is nothing more than a glorified community college jumper school. Hence the Georgia Tech transfer partnership. If merged with KSU, the USG would save a ton of dollars. It would also give KSU the chance to really serve that region of Georgia. Sort of like what GA Southern is doing. The new KSU could jump to regional university status. They could start doing outreach and maybe even some real research. Now that KSU has football, they have a possibility of increasing funding, endowment and donations. As the first post said, they reached a record with their first ever capital campaign.
Engineering Technology Center was built in 2008 for 33 million. That construction will be best used when SPSU merges with KSU.
I feel like you're just yanking my chain now. Stop using IPEDS to artificially boost SPSU's score. You have already posted that link. We already went over this twice. The only reason SPSU's score is where it is because the school is filled with GT rejects who end up transferring. The school had a 79% acceptance rate in 2012. Nobody wants to go to SPSU. They use it as a backup. The campus is a joke, the professors suck, the reputation is poor, the graduation rates are poor, no tradition or sports, no prominent alumni or high instances of gift giving(low endowment). The school needs to be merged so that all the good of SPSU can be used. Right now it is nothing more than a glorified community college jumper school. Hence the Georgia Tech transfer partnership. If merged with KSU, the USG would save a ton of dollars. It would also give KSU the chance to really serve that region of Georgia. Sort of like what GA Southern is doing. The new KSU could jump to regional university status. They could start doing outreach and maybe even some real research. Now that KSU has football, they have a possibility of increasing funding, endowment and donations. As the first post said, they reached a record with their first ever capital campaign.
Why so much hostility for SPSU? It is a good school that can stand on its own and has produced good engineers for a long time. What do they gain from merging with KSU? KSU gains a regionally prestigious program and SPSU merges with a glorified community college that is trying to grow into a real school.
So what if the school is full of "GT rejects." Do you think being associated with a thoroughly mediocre KSU is somehow going to keep them from transferring to GT?
^ I have to admit, if merged, the prospect of being a KSU grad over a SPSU grad probably won't do a better job of holding students in SPSU's programs.
Although, if merged, I wonder if the new school would need a new name? Kennesaw State wouldn't fit anymore. I also heard some talk that Georgia Highlands might be merged with KSU too.
I'm just worried about all of USG's schools wanting higher status'. They all ultimately want to be research universities. We'll probably have to create new categories of Super Research University and Super-Duper Research University to help distinguish UGA and GT from the rest of them.
Engineering Technology Center was built in 2008 for 33 million. That construction will be best used when SPSU merges with KSU.
I feel like you're just yanking my chain now. Stop using IPEDS to artificially boost SPSU's score. You have already posted that link. We already went over this twice. The only reason SPSU's score is where it is because the school is filled with GT rejects who end up transferring. The school had a 79% acceptance rate in 2012. Nobody wants to go to SPSU. They use it as a backup. The campus is a joke, the professors suck, the reputation is poor, the graduation rates are poor, no tradition or sports, no prominent alumni or high instances of gift giving(low endowment). The school needs to be merged so that all the good of SPSU can be used. Right now it is nothing more than a glorified community college jumper school. Hence the Georgia Tech transfer partnership. If merged with KSU, the USG would save a ton of dollars. It would also give KSU the chance to really serve that region of Georgia. Sort of like what GA Southern is doing. The new KSU could jump to regional university status. They could start doing outreach and maybe even some real research. Now that KSU has football, they have a possibility of increasing funding, endowment and donations. As the first post said, they reached a record with their first ever capital campaign.
Chef,
Your tirade is still amusing. Those SAT scores are for first-time, entering freshmen, not transfers.
SPSU was not included in the recent USG mergers. KSU probably would have welcomed SPSU into their fold. For them, it would have meant higher SAT scores, engineering, architecture, and a source for additional student fees to pay for their football program. SPSU students, alumni, and faculty fought to separate from GT and won. They can fight to stay out of a merger with KSU. It won't happen. That subject now is history.
If SPSU's programs are so bad, why does GT readily accept transfer students from SPSU? By your own admission.
As to no productive graduates coming out of SPSU, just look around. It's understood that Lockheed has more engineers from SPSU than any other school. Have you looked at the SPSU alumni directory to find out where graduates are employed? You just might be enlightened.
Most of your statements are based upon hearsay and emotion. Do some research and get some facts. Good thing you aren’t in law school.
As a fledgling journalist, you should know the facts. Who, what, when, where, why, and how, the journalist's credo. Obviously, you need to know considerably more than you do to engage in a dialog.
Chef, just stop and smell the roses. They are found at 1100 South Marietta Parkway.
Last edited by consultingengineer; 02-16-2013 at 04:50 PM..
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Spsu
