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I do speak for myself - and just as I don't care what the religious right think...I am also unconcerned by your pushing. We see things differently. I can't see how polls or opinions effect me in any way. I just don't feel it. But if you feel injured or worried then by all means: push.
No problems. Soldier on.
It's fine to say that you don't care what the religious think of you. That sounds real noble. I don't care either. But there is a sizable group in America that at best is willing to tolerate the presence of atheists in 'their' country as long as they know their place, and at worst would make it a de facto crime to not believe in their flavor of deity. And these people are not just spouting in their churches to their fellows, they are trying to make it happen via the ballot box and the school board and in the courtroom. They want to remake America of and for their superstitions and there won't be any room for a dissenting opinion or a voice of reason. My free psychoanalysis of you, b. frank, is that you a comfortable accommodationist.
It's fine to say that you don't care what the religious think of you. That sounds real noble. I don't care either. But there is a sizable group in America that at best is willing to tolerate the presence of atheists in 'their' country as long as they know their place, and at worst would make it a de facto crime to not believe in their flavor of deity. And these people are not just spouting in their churches to their fellows, they are trying to make it happen via the ballot box and the school board and in the courtroom. They want to remake America of and for their superstitions and there won't be any room for a dissenting opinion or a voice of reason. My free psychoanalysis of you, b. frank, is that you a comfortable accommodationist.
I agree with you. I think the awareness of the discrimination reflects the evolution of the Atheist movement. Last year many Atheists on this site did not recognize the discrimination, now I think most see it and many are speaking out. We have had a few big helpers on the religious right side with G. H. W. Bush telling the press Atheist should not be Citizens, and Elizabeth Dole making a visit to an Atheist group a political issue. As Atheist recognize the discrimination and see they are not alone (We need more signs) in their view, the “Closet Atheist” will step up and demand their equal rights. With the polls showing at least 16% of the country is non-religious we sure make a powerful political swing group.
I agree with you. I think the awareness of the discrimination reflects the evolution of the Atheist movement. Last year many Atheists on this site did not recognize the discrimination, now I think most see it and many are speaking out. We have had a few big helpers on the religious right side with G. W. Bush telling the press Atheist should not be Citizens, and Elizabeth Dole making a visit to an Atheist group a political issue. As Atheist recognize the discrimination and see they are not alone (We need more signs) in their view, the “Closet Atheist” will step up and demand their equal rights. With the polls showing at least 16% of the country is non-religious we sure make a powerful political swing group.
I love to hear from other atheists and how they are (sometimes beginning) to see things this way. I was beginning to feel like maybe there was something wrong with me for feeling some outrage at the religious privilege I see. Time for this lackadaisical attitude among atheists to end. You are right on when you cite Bush (I think it was W's dad who said that though) and Dole walking all over atheists gaining points with their followers and barely getting a squeak from atheists. Time to get vocal.
That's who George Herbert Walker Bush is, the daddy Bush, the one who would like to have us shipped out.... or more to the point, if we could hear his inner thoughts, lined up against a stone wall and shot for not believing in the Christian fairy tales.
I don't really know a lot of religious people, I grew up in an agnostic/spiritual family.. Although one thing did happen to me which was pretty disgusting. I was with a friend who herself was not religious just spiritual, we had gone to her house to pick something up. While I was waiting for her, her mother was home and we got to talking, was telling me how she wouldn't let her son watch The Golden Compass or Harry Potter because one was directed or written by an atheist and the other was ungodly or whatever word she used. The Catholic private school actually sent out letters to the Parents damning them as ungodly and should be banned. I honestly couldn't believe it.
I am not one who is passive about sharing what I feel about a situation, so I asked her how in the heck could she could believe The Golden Compass was anti-religious just because an Atheist created it. She went on to call Atheists abominations, yes she said abominations. Long story short I told her that was very rude as I was Agnostic and had family members and friends who are Atheist.
I guess since I was a friend of her daughter she literally tried to convert me and told me I could still find God.
I've never met someone like this before, I HOPE there isn't that many of this type.. I hope her mom never finds out that she's agnostic until she moves out at least, that would be constant bombardment of conversion attempts lol. needless to say that's the amount I've gotten I suppose.
Well I guess we have seen that thet are not going to be discriminated against by Obama!! "....and NONBELIEVERS" That was one cool innauguration speech!
Well I guess we have seen that thet are not going to be discriminated against by Obama!! "....and NONBELIEVERS" That was one cool innauguration speech!
I head it and smiled. It is sure a change from the Bush Clan, hope it a sigh of change in this country.
I have had a number of discussions with Forum members dealing with forms of, and at times out right discrimination related to non religious people in American culture, government, and from the religious segment of that culture in general.
I think it would be of interest to see how many non religious see and feel that discrimination, and could list issues which they see as bias.
In a word, yes, atheists are discriminated against.
Atheists Are Distrusted | American Sociological Association (http://www.asanet.org/cs/root/topnav/press/atheists_are_distrusted - broken link)
Well I guess we have seen that thet are not going to be discriminated against by Obama!! "....and NONBELIEVERS" That was one cool innauguration speech!
The feedback from Obama’s speech from has already hit the net. "The Center for Inquiry and the Council for Secular Humanism” expressed my view.
Here is their quote:
“The Center for Inquiry and the Council for Secular Humanism based in Amherst, N.Y., called recognition in the inaugural address "truly historic and remarkable."
Quote from Obama’s speech:
"A nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus, and nonbelievers."
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