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The fiance died March 11, as you know. In June, I went up to the lake house to retrieve my all-weather tires from his garage, since I was still driving on snows. I stayed for a few days.
The first day, I walked to the edge of the water, which was swarming with dragonflies. He always liked them, considered them a totem of sorts, since they are creatures attached to the water but don't live in it. One of them landed on my shoulder and just sat there. My instinct was to brush it off, but I stopped myself and just looked at it and I actually said out loud, feeling silly, "Hey, F, is that you?" It stayed for a minute or two, then took off. I felt as if I'd had a pleasant moment, then went on and forgot about it.
In August, my best friend treated me to a visit with a psychic she likes for my birthday. I had one bizarrely shocking experience with a psychic once who knew something from my childhood most of my friends don't even know and was weirdly specific, and I have had the usual ho-hum readings ("you are in a period of transition" - yeah, aren't we all.) But I was up for it.
I wasn't looking for any messages. In fact, I wasn't even going to mention the death except that when she asked me what questions I had, I told her of the loss not only of him but of my plans to move from my home and live there, which was a huge change in environment and lifestyle for me. So, the question was, more or less, what do I do now? The answer was close the door on that part of life and move forward, which really doesn't take a psychic, but I was pulling cards, and she was fitting them in and it was all quite a good conversation. I recorded to relisten, especially as she has a heavy Italian accent and I knew I was missing some words.
I got up to leave, thanked her and walked toward the door. She said, "Wait." I stopped. "I hear tings." I waited some more. She said, "He wants me to tell you. You were near the water--a beach or a river or a lake--and he came to you there. He came as a-a-a-(like she was trying to remember the word) a dragonfly. He told me to tell you that."
That was not the only "message". There was another, much later, a little weirder, in fact, humorous, from a different practioner of woo.
I don't know what the answer to this is, but yes, I do believe something goes on past our body's death.
Thank you MQ. I did have a good hunt around on the pagan forum but couldn't find your posts so I'm glad you shared this here. I mean this is so specific like mine. I have no idea what the explanation is.
Thank you MQ. I did have a good hunt around on the pagan forum but couldn't find your posts so I'm glad you shared this here. I mean this is so specific like mine. I have no idea what the explanation is.
There's a viral video making the rounds right now of Liam Neeson portraying some guy applying for the job of Santa at the Mall. The camera is rolling and he starts to recite the "better be good, you better not pout ..." lyrics but with his signature ominous voice. "I'm making a list and checking it ... TWICE ... (pause for emphasis)" ... the interviewer says, can you lighten it up a little? And he says no I don't think that's right, Santa is this Eye of Swift Retribution in the sky that sees all ... the interviewer says, "yeah but he brings toys to boys and girls". And Neeson looks deadpan into the camera, pauses just the right length of time, and shakes his head: "Not the naughty ones".
So it seems to be with a lot of believers. God rewarded me, so if he didn't reward you, you have sin to repent of. Simples.
Oh well.
I was thinking more about the indication that god favors those who are desperate.
Wow again! Still more comments containing at least one thought or another and/or story I am inspired to adress, but again too many to keep up with given the time I have available, and this doesn't include the many that apparently have been deleted! Always hard to know which comments have been deleted or why, but I'm glad to see mine haven't been deleted for any reasons having to do with insults or the likes.
Many Christian's come and go thinking this was such a pro Atheist forum that they couldn't deal with it.
You have one of the most responsible roles in this forum, I dont think you have a choice, I think you chose and God gave you what you wanted and now you cause so many others to study that it makes me envious.
Reminds me of Gary Oldman in the fith element.
I kept wondering about this comment after I signed off yesterday. Not sure what it means. The part about having "one of the most responsible roles in this forum."
Glad you started this thread, LM! Like you, I'm looking forward to reading about others experiences.
My first experience happened in May 1984. I was 26, a brand new mother, and had absolutely nothing to do with the RCC or any other religion back then. Yes, I believed God existed, but that's about it.
Anyway, I had been working for a company for about a year. One day, our entire hierarchy changed. People were quitting left and right because of new upper management. In fact, we had six department heads quit on the same day. My new boss called me in to the conference room and told me she was going to give me my annual review...which I already had the previous month. At first, I was confused. But when I read the review form, I was p*ssed! It was ALL untrue! But of course, with my upbringing, I wasn't 'allowed' to show my anger. So, I proceeded to go back to my office...and have a full-blown panic attack. I went to my new manager struggling to hide my tears/anger and told her that I had to leave because I wasn't feeling well (understatement). I drove home which thankfully, was only a few blocks away.
I got in the house and crawled on the bed into the fetal position. I felt certain I was going to die. But that's not what scared me. What scared me was the possibility of me dying...and going to hell. I felt small and insignificant to God. Through my tears, I humbly asked Him, "Do you love me? Was I even allowed to ask that question of God?
I suddenly sat up, still sniffling...and felt this amazing 'warmth'. But it wasn't a physical warmth. It was as if this 'wave' of something was washing over me. I had this tremendous sense of peace...and joy...and pure LOVE. Or should I say, PURE Love. It wasn't the kind of love that's familiar to us, like romantic love or love of a child or family and friends. This was something different. It was a THOUSAND times better than any other kind of love I felt before. But that's not what got me. What got me was that there was NO FEAR. No fear of dying...no fear of losing my job, or not being able to pay my bills...It was an experience of overwhelming joy and happiness.
That 'feeling' stayed with me for four days. Of course, I went right back to my 'old' life. Oh, I DID get fired from that company a week later. They fought me on unemployment...and I WON.
Like I mentioned, it was my FIRST experience, almost 40 years ago.
But certainly wasn't the last...
Hello again Mink, and again thank you for your ongoing contributions here...
From where I'm sitting as I read this interesting comment of yours, I find it interesting if not telling that you explain "Yes, I believed God existed, but that's about it." For me, that's quite a bit. Quite the starting point. You also explain you were not a follower of a religion, which I'm sure is true, but there's something there when you explain this rather significant fear of "going to hell." Hell is a place that only exists according to a few religions.
All that aside, that's one rough work-place story you have shared here. I wonder as an EC how I would have counseled you to work through it. The story also reminds me of a time my wife was suffering from serious anxiety attacks (and a toxic work environment). I can't know if I have also experienced the same level of "warmth" that washed over you, but I can say I have felt that sense of shifting "mental gears" such that I was feeling much better. A great sense of relief.
Wouldn't it be interesting if we could somehow plug into a machine and see the degree to which these emotions are shared among us? The same or different and from where they come?
I wish if this is how it always worked but sorry, this is not how it works.
There may be some 0.000000000001% such cases but there are 8 Billion people - and God does not show up like up like a David Copperfield to pull a "miracle" on you as a sign.
The signs have already been provided by God - It's now our job to use our intelligence, logic and research by using our brain to inspect these signs, and see what talks to our hearts?
Always remember, the brain does the investigation part but the call to faith comes from the heart.
IMO, it starts with a very simple step.
Get up in the middle of a night, take a shower, clean yourself up and get on your knees to pray to God by simply saying,
"Oh God, if you are really out there, GUIDE me to you."
btw, did you watch this one yet?
This is NOT a proselytizing attempt, but just to let you know how the "signs" work for any faith you intend to investigate.
Again I always have to refrain when anyone suggests people like me have gone about recognizing the existence of a god in the wrong way. As if they know the first thing about my efforts along those lines over the course of my 65+ years now. Especially when it's suggested that we must use our "intelligence, logic and research" to be successful. At the same time religious people are always insulted when it's suggested they believe what they do because of a lack of intelligence, logic and research (among other things).
That is interesting. A have a number of friends and acquaintances who aren't theists and certainly aren't Christians but who report anomalous experiences that make my own seem paltry in comparison. When someone says "NOTHING like that has EVER happened to me," I am dumbfounded. I have to believe they are either sleepwalking through life or are willfully blind to such experiences.
In similar fashion, these kinds of comments tend to "rub me the wrong way." Perhaps there is a more reasonable explanation rather than assuming anyone like me is "either sleepwalking through life or are willfully blind to such experiences." You might be similarly "dumbfounded" to better understand those alternative possibilities. Please...
What do *I* make of it? Kind of like any other relationship. I mean, if someone USED to call me, and I USED to call them...and one day they decided not to call me anymore, SHOULD I continue to call them?
I know that some can say, "Well, if God LOVED you...." but it's not ALL about whether God loves US. WE have a part in this whole 'love' thing, too.
And I know that some say that God is supposed to love us unconditionally. So, even if we DON'T call Him, he SHOULD still call us. To me, that sounds a bit arrogant. Like an ex girlfriend who says, "Don't call me anymore!" and then out of respect, he doesn't call...
...and then she gets miffed because he doesn't call!
To me, God don't play those games...
I find this comparison a little difficult to accept as altogether representative of the relationship we're talking about here. It's not a someone who used to call me, and it was never anyone I could see or knew exactly how to reach by phone or otherwise. I thought prayer was the way and believed all our prayers are answered. Or at least heard. This about being a "bit arrogant" tends to suggest a fair degree of misunderstanding as well.
I was never like the "girlfriend who says 'Don't call me anymore!" Never. In fact the opposite. More like my door is always open if you care to pay a visit. Day or night, and/or in any way you prefer. You are welcomed here.
I think this is a wonderful thread.
I've been hoping someone would start a thread like this.
I have a request to make though of the moderators if they happen to be passing.
I wondered if there's any way a note could be added to your opening post requesting that everyone is respectful of each other in this thread, and respectful all of the stories being shared here from both theists and atheists alike.
Honestly I'd like to share my stories but a lot of them are pretty painful memories and I don't want to see them crapped all over. Neither do I like seeing ANYBODY's personal stories being crapped all over whether people believe they are true or not.
Sometimes things can seem exaggerated or outlandish but let's just accept them for what they are and disrespect is rarely helpful to discussion.
I don't think my stories are signs from god obviously. That's not to say I don't believe in intuition and I've had some pretty incredible coincidences such as other describe, so perhaps they may be useful to the thread.
As usual I'm supposed to be getting on with other things so I'll come back later.
I am always glad when you are in the mix Cruithne. Glad you appreciate this thread too...
I don't know to what extent your request can be met, and I hope that all you are concerned about is not a result of any of my comments. I have the same hopes as you I think. To maintain a respect for everyone posting in this thread, but also not to prevent anyone from expressing their sincere thoughts. Whether they are necessarily what others want to read or not.
Also when it comes to your concerns related to sharing what you would like, I always like to suggest people have a "thicker skin," because the mods can't keep everyone from feeling insulted for all the reasons people can feel insulted or "crapped upon." Somewhat "goes with the territory" I think. I don't let anything I read in this forum affect me all that much other than whatever inspiration to express my opinion(s) comes as a result.
I would like to trust in you to let me know if you think I have "crossed the line" of respect while I continue with this thread as long as it may last. I respect your opinion (although your skin might be a little thinner than mine), and if you think I have misstepped, by all means let me know and I will duly note.
Sincerely,
LM
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Like you, I'm looking forward to reading about others experiences.