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Old 09-14-2022, 06:20 AM
 
Location: Northeastern US
20,077 posts, read 13,539,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
I'm not saying how and why, I'm just saying what I saw. And it was pitiful.

But I'm sorry, every unusual looking rock and every hole in the ground can't be worthy of 'spiritual preservation'. What do you think would happen if the nation's largest oil deposit was suddenly discovered on spiritual land on a reservation. You think they'd just let it sit there? I don't. Preservation of culture for many tribes has given way to building casinos.
I agree that anything valuable on native land will be extracted, and retained only at the expense of a huge fight.

I also agree that casinos are an expediency that is ultimately a loser for everyone, but I have to admit that the poor creatures blankly feeding quarters to the slots ARE a sort of poetic justice. The native americans have figured out how to beat us at our own game, lol.
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Old 09-14-2022, 08:55 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,960 posts, read 24,459,082 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
I agree that anything valuable on native land will be extracted, and retained only at the expense of a huge fight.

I also agree that casinos are an expediency that is ultimately a loser for everyone, but I have to admit that the poor creatures blankly feeding quarters to the slots ARE a sort of poetic justice. The native americans have figured out how to beat us at our own game, lol.
In a sense yet, but I think also at an awful cost.

I've forgotten which one now, but I went online to read more about one of the tribes out here in the West because I was planning a little trip, and was wondering if, perhaps, they had a museum or some sites to visit. The tribe's website had virtually nothing about their heritage; almost the whole website was about their casino and hotels, etc., with a little bit of supplementary information about the tribe's governing board.
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:09 AM
 
18,976 posts, read 7,056,709 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badlander View Post
I read but cannot link to a story where a US judge re moved a ban on drilling in a ten square mile section of northern Montana.

The piece of land is sacred to the Blackfeet and Blackfoot nations as it is supposedly the site of creation in their myth/religion. The Blackfeet have been trying to get the land declared a historical site.

Does the indigenous peoples religions deserve as much respect and protection as your own religion?
They drove out the people that were there before them. And they will benefit from living in this country.

No one is going to give the same courtesy to Christianity or any other religion, so why them?
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:23 AM
 
9,345 posts, read 4,337,982 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie View Post
They drove out the people that were there before them. And they will benefit from living in this country.

No one is going to give the same courtesy to Christianity or any other religion, so why them?
You do not think your govenment gives Christianity respect and courtesy?

Who did the Blackfeet drive out and who drove them off most of their land. And should not all citizens benefit from living in their own country? They are Americans. And many are Christians.
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:25 AM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie View Post
They drove out the people that were there before them. And they will benefit from living in this country.

No one is going to give the same courtesy to Christianity or any other religion, so why them?
I don't often agree with you, but I think I do here. Many Indian tribes took over land from other Indian tribes, just as their land was later taken over. This article -- although about Canada -- is quite enlightening, particularly the part where you scroll down to "Warfare in Aboriginal societies" (https://www.canada.ca/en/department-...h-america.html). That section begins: "Despite the myth that Aboriginals lived in happy harmony before the arrival of Europeans, war was central to the way of life of many First Nation cultures. Indeed, war was a persistent reality in all regions..."
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:31 AM
 
16,058 posts, read 7,079,088 times
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All religions have the right to freedom of expression and practice in the USA. That is a non-issue.
What is sacred is in the mind, not in the object. I believe all land should be protected from Corporate encroachment. All environmental resources should be protected from depletion and degradation for profit. The natural resources belong to all life forms, not just human. But some land IS needed for all of us to live and work and enjoy a good life. That is why we have Environmental protection laws to oversee how land should be used.
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:45 AM
 
10,532 posts, read 7,067,480 times
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The activist groups are using Indian's as a last resort to pressure people to have their way. Maybe at some point some nomadic Indian setup a teepee and looked at nature, and took it all in, however none of the descendants today actually believe the land is sacred. If they are saying its sacred, its because they are trying benefit monetarily some way or another.

Also, its difficult for many Indians to stake land claims in areas. Indians were nomadic, and their lands which they roamed were conquered dozens of times over by other Indian tribes.

Like usual the activists found someone who's 20x grandparent, camped outside an area in the summer of 1469, and now its sacred land claim.
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Old 09-14-2022, 10:55 AM
 
18,976 posts, read 7,056,709 times
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Originally Posted by badlander View Post
You do not think your govenment gives Christianity respect and courtesy?
You tell me. Should churches be able to have that ability to shut down drilling?
Quote:
Who did the Blackfeet drive out and who drove them off most of their land. And should not all citizens benefit from living in their own country? They are Americans. And many are Christians.
Since time began, people have been driving out those there before them. The Blackfeet were not the original people group to settle in the area. It happened in Europe, Africa, Asia, and the Americas.
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Old 09-14-2022, 11:20 AM
 
9,345 posts, read 4,337,982 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie View Post
You tell me. Should churches be able to have that ability to shut down drilling?


Since time began, people have been driving out those there before them. The Blackfeet were not the original people group to settle in the area. It happened in Europe, Africa, Asia, and the Americas.
I am unaware of any drilling on church land. I have yet to see a derrick in a rural churchyard or cemetery.

Besides it sounds like you do not feel any land oe place is sacred as peoples come and go.
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Old 09-14-2022, 05:11 PM
 
18,976 posts, read 7,056,709 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badlander View Post
I am unaware of any drilling on church land. I have yet to see a derrick in a rural churchyard or cemetery.

Besides it sounds like you do not feel any land oe place is sacred as peoples come and go.
Ok. Suppose Joel Osteen decided his church needed to expand and use land that is currently public land. Does he have that right?

My point is that we currently don't allow any religion to dictate to others how things are done. Whether Christian or otherwise. So why this?
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