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Old 04-03-2012, 12:24 AM
 
Location: Valencia, Spain
16,155 posts, read 12,875,284 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mind over Chatter View Post
A) Everything that begins to exist has a cause.
B) The universe began to exist.
C) Therefore the universe has a cause.
A) Everything that begins to exist has a cause.
B) Your god (allegedly) exists.
C) Therefore your god has a cause.
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Old 04-03-2012, 06:29 PM
 
867 posts, read 499,250 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chango View Post
Rainbows
Best argument I have ever heard. It is almost nothing, but still, it is the best so far.
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Old 04-03-2012, 06:35 PM
 
867 posts, read 499,250 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mind over Chatter View Post
Well the aren't necessarily personally my own evidences but the accepted evidences for theist philosophers and apologists. If I was to pick one that I think to be the strongest I would say the origin of the universe is probably the strongest because:

A) Everything that begins to exist has a cause.
B) The universe began to exist.
C) Therefore the universe has a cause.
Your "thinking" is simplistic to the point of being child-like. Not an insult, just an honest observation based on its expression in your words.

For example, who says the Universe began to exists. It could have existed forever in a big-bang/retraction/big-bang rotation.
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Old 04-04-2012, 07:37 AM
 
9,229 posts, read 8,564,219 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by distraff View Post
I would like theists to list some evidence they have for God existing. I will rough up each one a little bit to see the strongest ones and them make threads about each individually.
So, you are asking for material proof of a spiritual existance?

Did you miss the whole point?

One's faith in God is not a science project. While I have no doubt that physics will eventually lead us to find the basis of the structure that Fritjof Capra refers to as "The Web of Life," that will ultimately prove that we live, breath and have our being in the vast array of God's consciousness, for now I am satisfied to rest comfortably in the knowledge that God IS.

Be well.
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Old 04-04-2012, 08:34 AM
 
278 posts, read 358,124 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LookinForMayberry View Post
So, you are asking for material proof of a spiritual existance?

Did you miss the whole point?

One's faith in God is not a science project. While I have no doubt that physics will eventually lead us to find the basis of the structure that Fritjof Capra refers to as "The Web of Life," that will ultimately prove that we live, breath and have our being in the vast array of God's consciousness, for now I am satisfied to rest comfortably in the knowledge that God IS.

Be well.
I am not asking for physical proof, I am asking for something that indicates that God exists. This can be a philosophical argument, rather than physical evidence.
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Old 04-04-2012, 08:48 AM
 
Location: East Coast of the United States
27,646 posts, read 28,745,041 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LookinForMayberry View Post
So, you are asking for material proof of a spiritual existance?

Did you miss the whole point?
But this spiritual existence is said to influence the material world in a way that is detectable.

That places this spiritual existence within the realm of scientific investigation.

Last edited by BigCityDreamer; 04-04-2012 at 09:50 AM..
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Old 04-04-2012, 10:01 AM
 
12,967 posts, read 13,701,057 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by distraff View Post
Wait, you were so skeptical that some acts of kindness means love yet you just seem to assume that they do mean acts of duty.

This view is not consistent. Why do you think many acts of kindness are acts of duty?
This is a good question that can be answered by the parable of the good samaritan.
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Old 04-04-2012, 10:36 AM
 
278 posts, read 358,124 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thriftylefty View Post
This is a good question that can be answered by the parable of the good samaritan.
That is only a story. There is just as much justification for acts of love as acts of duty. To accept one is to follow the same reasoning for accepting the other.

So you cannot say that supposed acts of love are actually acts of duty without providing evidence for acts of duty that won't provide a way for proving acts of love too.
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Old 04-04-2012, 11:46 AM
 
12,967 posts, read 13,701,057 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by distraff View Post
That is only a story. There is just as much justification for acts of love as acts of duty. To accept one is to follow the same reasoning for accepting the other.

So you cannot say that supposed acts of love are actually acts of duty without providing evidence for acts of duty that won't provide a way for proving acts of love too.
I worked jobs that I thought were humiliating and even had to regularly see my peers from academia on this job. But I also had small children and off course I loved them and I would feed my self to a lion if they ask me to. Was working this job an act of love, duty or sacrifice ? We may be at a semantic impasse, but I think it doesn't matter and that these motivations are sometime inseparable.
I think religion over emphasizes the word love. Some times Pragmatism and realism can get the same results as religion.
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Old 04-04-2012, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Rome, Georgia
2,745 posts, read 3,963,698 times
Reputation: 2061
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatles4evr View Post
Your "thinking" is simplistic to the point of being child-like. Not an insult, just an honest observation based on its expression in your words.

For example, who says the Universe began to exists. It could have existed forever in a big-bang/retraction/big-bang rotation.
Actually, the retraction theory seems to have been mostly debunked as the universe is expanding at a faster rate, making a "big crunch" unlikely without some fairly serious metaphysics of it's own. It appears to be a one time shot, our part of an infinite multiverse outside of our own universe. Or maybe there is a god.
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