Governor Edwards pardons 40 murderers (New Orleans, Many: high crime, felony, public school)

[tijlover]

Originally Posted by 87112

I can't find the compassion for murders. I prefer the Singapore or Iran or Saudi Arabia methods. You took someone off the earth you will be gone too.

And let's not forget all those taken off Death Row, over the last 20 years, cleared from DNA tests. There's any number of innocent people behind bars today.

[TunedIn]

Originally Posted by annie_himself

We've also socially agreed on pardons.

They shouldn't have any bearing, in my opinion. They don't know how to rehabilitate people, the original purpose of the prison system before it was corrupted with private prisons.

Aims of rehabilitation play no role in sentencing nor does rehabilitation itself necessitate parole or pardon. This has been reinforced legislatively and judicially. As well as by common sense. Rehabilitated? Great, it'll come in handy after you've served your debt to society.

[Cloudy Dayz]

Originally Posted by TunedIn

This claptrap again. Louisiana's violent crime rate isn't because they incarcerate too many violent criminals. It's because too many violent criminals call Louisiana home. And why not check with the loved ones of the victims to see if feebleness and old age is a fitting criteria for parole.

Point being the system is not working. It's not deterring crime. Locking people up for life just costs society a lot of money and doesn't seem to offer any real benefit. If Louisiana was seeing a lower crime rate as a result of all the money being spent on prisons, then a good argument could be made for keeping the status quo.

But paying so much tax money to lock so many people up, and then still having to deal with some of the highest crime rate in the country, is not going to make Louisiana an attractive place to live.

[Cloudy Dayz]

Originally Posted by Lizap

I didn’t realize prisoners had rights..

Eighth Amendment.

[TunedIn]

Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz

Point being the system is not working. It's not deterring crime. Locking people up for life just costs society a lot of money and doesn't seem to offer any real benefit. If Louisiana was seeing a lower crime rate as a result of all the money being spent on prisons, then a good argument could be made for keeping the status quo.

But paying so much tax money to lock so many people up, and then still having to deal with some of the highest crime rate in the country, is not going to make Louisiana an attractive place to live.

You're not applying logic. I submit that the crime rate would be higher if those incarcerated were left at large. And doesn't it follow as well that states with high crime rates will have large prison populations?

[Cloudy Dayz]

Originally Posted by TunedIn

You're not applying logic. I submit that the crime rate would be higher if those incarcerated were left at large. And doesn't it follow as well that states with high crime rates will have large prison populations?

It's not me who has a problem with logic.

Now to answer your question, no. The large prison population in Louisiana is due to people being locked up for much longer periods of time, not due to more criminals being locked up for committing crimes.

Try that logic.

[TunedIn]

Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz

It's not me who has a problem with logic.

Now to answer your question, no. The large prison population in Louisiana is due to people being locked up for much longer periods of time, not due to more criminals being locked up for committing crimes.

Try that logic.

You're admitting then that longer prison sentences aren't increasing crime, but simply increasing the prison population. And letting inmates out sooner can't possibly lower the crime rate but cerainly CAN increase it through recidivism. I'm ok with tougher and longer sentencing erring on the side of public safety. And you, yourself, have already stipulated that Louisiana has a higher than average crime rate. Where do you suppose the perpetrators end up? Leading to a higher than average prison population. Not difficult stuff.

[Cloudy Dayz]

Originally Posted by TunedIn

You're admitting then that longer prison sentences aren't increasing crime, but simply increasing the prison population. And letting inmates out sooner can't possibly lower the crime rate but cerainly CAN increase it through recidivism. I'm ok with tougher and longer sentencing erring on the side of public safety. And you, yourself, have already stipulated that Louisiana has a higher than average crime rate. Where do you suppose the perpetrators end up? Leading to a higher than average prison population. Not difficult stuff.

I never said longer sentences increased crime. But it clearly doesn't decrease crime either. Or Louisiana would have the lowest crime rate in the country. On the other hand decreasing the prison population and using the cost savings on other more useful things like education, job training, healthcare could very possibly reduce the crime rate.

Anyway letting 40 senior citizens out of prison for crimes they committed when they were young, is sure not going to increase the crime rate.

[TunedIn]

Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz

I never said longer sentences increased crime. But it clearly doesn't decrease crime either. Or Louisiana would have the lowest crime rate in the country. On the other hand decreasing the prison population and using the cost savings on other more useful things like education, job training, healthcare could very possibly reduce the crime rate.

Anyway letting 40 senior citizens out of prison for crimes they committed when they were young, is sure not going to increase the crime rate.

You've offered no causal effect whatsoever regarding your appraisal of the the relationship between crime and length of prison sentence. Many U.S. states impose longer average sentences than Louisiana yet boast much lower crime rates. Michigan inmates serve the longest average sentence and its crime rate is far below that of Louisiana. Pennsylvania at number two is safer still. Florida has by far the most inmates sentenced to life without parole and has a substantially lower crime rate than Louisiana. Why even put forth a premise that longer sentences "don't deter crime"? Length of sentences aren't primarily predicated upon, or determined by, deterrent or rehabilitative aims. Serious crimes are punished by lengthy punitive prison terms, not to be commuted in the event that local crime doesn't decease. Does this surprise you?

[victimofGM]

Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz

I never said longer sentences increased crime. But it clearly doesn't decrease crime either. Or Louisiana would have the lowest crime rate in the country. On the other hand decreasing the prison population and using the cost savings on other more useful things like education, job training, healthcare could very possibly reduce the crime rate.

Anyway letting 40 senior citizens out of prison for crimes they committed when they were young, is sure not going to increase the crime rate.

Look at cities where criminals are quickly released from jail in a revolving door manner. Arresting criminals and sending them to prison reduces crime because those in prison aren’t still on the streets committing crimes. It’s not just about punishing criminals or reducing crime, it’s about protecting the public. Problem is soft on crime approach leads to worse crime. Problem starts at the family home, or lack of family. It extends to public schools too afraid of the criminal students to properly enforce school rules.