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While I certainly understand your concerns about religion in Kentucky, maybe we should take another angle. I, personally, shall not do more than express my friendship to you. As a result of that friendship, I may wish to know all about you, including your personal feelings about faith, religion, and causes.
If I inquire about your religion, instead of being angry that I asked, a person with your obvious logical intelligence would instead feel honored that someone dared to care about you for no really obvious reason. You would see it as a compliment and instead of being frustrated, even angry, you would recognize that Kentuckians truly are team players and care about our neighbors. Now, for some unexplainable reason, that "brotherly love" comes from the New Testament. Interesting, if you think about it.
Now, let me ask you this, what if one of us is wrong about our faith? I can't prove my faith, nor can you prove my faith is bogus. If I am wrong, no big deal, but if you are wrong...... I wonder.
Why does it have to be a case of right or wrong and proof or lack of proof? If a man comes to my door and says "let me tell you about Jesus" and proceeds to do so, he will be welcome at my door and I would listen to all he has to say and let him go on with a smile. He has done what his Lord has requested he do. If the same man comes to my door and says, "let me tell you about Jesus and how wrong you are for believing the way you do and when you die you will go straight to Hell because you don't believe the way I do" then he is not welcome and I would not listen. He has done exactly the opposite of what his Lord requested. If the Christian Holy Book says "judge not" then the man has negated everything he says he believes in. Faith is faith and does not need proof for it to exist or to convince another to believe in that faith. It seems to me that all that is required is the telling of the story and a good and kind spirit with which to tell it.
I've seen some posts touch on this topic, but not in depth...
My family and I are agnostic, not religious...We are very DIS enchanted with NM (the land of enchantment--ha!) mostly because of the massive influx of illegals and gangs, not to mention ridiculous housing prices.
We have friends in KY who think it is wonderful, and we are considering relocating there. (I'm an English teacher, he's in HVAC). How important is religion to folks in Kentucky?
We've heard about Benton (KKK? Really?) and other smaller towns; we like the idea of a safe, affordable, family oriented area (who doesn't?) but we don't want to feel out of place or persecuted. We DON'T want anyone praying for our souls, ya know? It's hard enough to be the only white people in town (welcome to NM!); we don't want to exchange one square peg with another, so to speak. Would we be the only agnostics in town? Would they have vigils outside our home? Or is there still a place where kind-hearted non-judgemental respectful responsible people live, and let others live? Could that place be somewhere in Kentucky?
Check out the responses from tomocox to beilart and you will have your answer about the importance of religion in rural Ky. Church is a huge part of the social life for many in rural Ky.
I'm not sure if Tomocox was responding to me or to Beilart, but I hope it wasn't me because in no way did I indicate anger toward anyone. I was trying to express how left out we feel because religion is SO important to so many. I'm not discounting that importance; I'm just saying it's NOT important to us.
We are not Christians, but at no time have we ever disrespected anyone else's beliefs, other than to make the occassional comment that when one is judging, one is not acting like a Christian. We are often persecuted for what we DON'T believe, as I mentioned before, to the point of kids not being friends with my children, and people deliberately shunning us. It's easy for those on the other side to assume that it's because we are "shoving it down people's throats" (interesting that that phrase is so often used here in this topic), when in fact, WE never mention it. It is others who want us to agree with their views, and when we don't, either through our silence (because we try to be polite) or through our outright debate (which starts out friendly, but always goes very badly, because we will not simply agree in order to keep people happy). We may be polite, but we are not hypocrites, and we will not pretend to agree with you if we do not.
Bottom line: I, my husband, and my kids are educated enough, mature enough, and independant enough to know our own minds. We aren't Christians not because we haven't heard the Good News, or because we have chosen the wrong path, or because we want to **** people off. What we believe is just as valid and just as important as what any one else believes. We arrived at our decision with just as much thought and care as others arrived at theirs. I may not agree with you; that doesn't mean you are wrong. It means that in the case of religion which can't be proven either way, we see things differently.
nokygirl, I hope you are wrong. I get enough preaching from my parents. Like Beilart, I will take all good thoughts, even if someone calls them prayers, but come on, Mom, stop praying that I will find Jesus! I was hoping KY wasn't like that...at least not to any extreme we haven't already seen here.
Any one else? How will we fit in in KY, if we PROMISE not to shove our lack of religion down anyone's throat?
the bottom line is ....if anyone talks to you about Jesus , it's not that we are trying to "shove him down your throat" (although I won't deny that some christians are very judgemental and that is wrong, I agree with you )....it's that we genuinely care and that's it. Just like your mom who prays for you.....I can tell you just by you starting this thread has got alot of us praying for you too. BTW- that's a good thing , you'd rather us do that than hate you right ?We all will spend eternity in one place or the other and like Tom said...if we are wrong, then we're just wrong, but what if you are ?
I'm not sure if Tomocox was responding to me or to Beilart, but I hope it wasn't me because in no way did I indicate anger toward anyone. I was trying to express how left out we feel because religion is SO important to so many. I'm not discounting that importance; I'm just saying it's NOT important to us.
We are not Christians, but at no time have we ever disrespected anyone else's beliefs, other than to make the occassional comment that when one is judging, one is not acting like a Christian. We are often persecuted for what we DON'T believe, as I mentioned before, to the point of kids not being friends with my children, and people deliberately shunning us. It's easy for those on the other side to assume that it's because we are "shoving it down people's throats" (interesting that that phrase is so often used here in this topic), when in fact, WE never mention it. It is others who want us to agree with their views, and when we don't, either through our silence (because we try to be polite) or through our outright debate (which starts out friendly, but always goes very badly, because we will not simply agree in order to keep people happy). We may be polite, but we are not hypocrites, and we will not pretend to agree with you if we do not.
Bottom line: I, my husband, and my kids are educated enough, mature enough, and independant enough to know our own minds. We aren't Christians not because we haven't heard the Good News, or because we have chosen the wrong path, or because we want to **** people off. What we believe is just as valid and just as important as what any one else believes. We arrived at our decision with just as much thought and care as others arrived at theirs. I may not agree with you; that doesn't mean you are wrong. It means that in the case of religion which can't be proven either way, we see things differently.
nokygirl, I hope you are wrong. I get enough preaching from my parents. Like Beilart, I will take all good thoughts, even if someone calls them prayers, but come on, Mom, stop praying that I will find Jesus! I was hoping KY wasn't like that...at least not to any extreme we haven't already seen here.
Any one else? How will we fit in in KY, if we PROMISE not to shove our lack of religion down anyone's throat?
I agree with everything you are saying . My husband is also an agnostic. I am not trying to dampen your enthusiam, I just want to emphasize that church IS an issue, regardless of the picture some are painting. The fact that two people who don't even know you are already "praying" for you because you have admitted *gasp* that you don't believe in the same religion is a good indication of the religious climate in Ky.
You may want to think about Northern Ky - that is where I am originally from and the people there are much more accepting. Lexington is also a good option. Check out some of the posts by EclecticEars. He does a good job of describing some of the nice and not-so-nice communities in Kentucky.
Anyone else out there trying to get me to heaven? Anyone care to join me in hell? Please, please, speak up for your good state and let me know if this is really how it is.
Are there any agnostics out there in Kentucky? Is everyone clear on what an agnostic is? I am not an atheist ("not that there's anything wrong with that!") Agnostic is from the Greek, and it means "not knowing." Agnostics believe that since the nature of God is unknowable, and since the presence of God is unprovable, and eternity is a mystery, and salvation is just a human's idea of what needs to be done or said or believed to be saved (depending on your denomination), that we can't know or say with certainty what is or what is not. In fact, Tomocox and others, when you agree that neither one of us can prove anything, you are very close to what we agnostics believe.
You may say that I don't have any faith, and I'm sure some of you will be praying for that, too, but the fact is, I do have faith. I have faith that the source from which all life comes gave me the courage and the intellect and the conscience to recognize what MY soul tells ME. I can allow what ever is to simply be. I don't have to understand it, I don't have to name it, and I sure as heck don't have to get on my knees to it. My source, if it does in fact exist, which, again, no one can prove, knows me and knows my soul. I am what I should be, and I will take no criticism from people who find me lacking, even if it is out of Christian brotherly New Testament love.
Tomocox, your "if you are wrong...." comes off as an insult to me. That is exactly the kind of thing I was hoping to avoid.
Hi, nokygirl. I guess we were simultaneously typing. Thanks for the input. I expected to get people started praying for me (it happens every time, god love 'em! You'd think I'd be converted by now!) I just want to know if it will happen MORE in Kentucky, than, say, Texas, where I lived for years, and New Mexico, where I'm from. We have our "pockets" too; I can deal with a bit more of the same, but I just don't want to deal with a LOT more. The prayers and genuine concern I can handle, the hate and the judgement cloaked in "brotherly love" I can do without. Oh, and the thinly veiled threats of "but if you're wrong...." are just not working for me.
Hi, nokygirl. I guess we were simultaneously typing. Thanks for the input. I expected to get people started praying for me (it happens every time, god love 'em! You'd think I'd be converted by now!) I just want to know if it will happen MORE in Kentucky, than, say, Texas, where I lived for years, and New Mexico, where I'm from. We have our "pockets" too; I can deal with a bit more of the same, but I just don't want to deal with a LOT more. The prayers and genuine concern I can handle, the hate and the judgement cloaked in "brotherly love" I can do without. Oh, and the thinly veiled threats of "but if you're wrong...." are just not working for me.
As I said in my direct message to you, I admire your openness and ability to state your beliefs with no apologies. I agree with alot of what you say. Kentucky can use more people like you...
BTW, we have friends who moved to New Mexico in March from Kentucky. They think the landscape is beautiful. She tells me that due to the number of Native Americans and Hispanics, white people are the minority, just as you have stated.
It is beautiful. A very different sort of beauty than Kentucky. Not green and wet and mellow, but dry and rocky and dramatic. I don't think there is a prettier place than the places we have here. And no where in the world will you find sky this blue, or sunrises and sunsets this gorgeous.
BUT it is a state that is very tolerant of illegal immigration, which is becoming a big problem. Lots and lots of drug and alcohol problems, spousal and child abuse, major poverty, but on the flip side of that, there are many people moving there that are VERY rich and can afford to stay isolated from the "peasants" and the harsher side of life here.
I have lived here for almost twenty years, with a fourteen year stretch in the middle in Texas. Kentucky sounds a lot like Texas, to me anyway. LOTS of small towns with pockets of racism and religious fervor, lots of really nice people, lots of Americana. It seems much prettier than Texas though.
Where did your friends move to? Are they posting here? I would like to hear how they compare KY and NM.
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Yikes!
. My husband is also an agnostic. I am not trying to dampen your enthusiam, I just want to emphasize that church IS an issue, regardless of the picture some are painting. The fact that two people who don't even know you are already "praying" for you because you have admitted *gasp* that you don't believe in the same religion is a good indication of the religious climate in Ky. 
