[City Guy997S]

Originally Posted by Ghaati

Yeah I consume much more in a year than I pay out in property tax. It'd mean consuming less. And, it'd mean an increase in price for everything else. Tourism isn't just Disney, et al. It's the Comfort Inn in some unincorporated area in Brevard County, and the bed & breakfast plantation in the panhandle, cruise ships that leave out of Florida ports, the cost of parking in the parking lots in the area of those cruise ships, and seasonal rentals in the Keys and everywhere else in the state that has seasonal rentals.

You'll just end up with a lot less people visiting (so you can stop bragging, then, about how Florida is on the top 10 list for visitors - that'll go away). The prices will be too high for a proper chunk of them who were previously saving up to come to Florida. In fact, anyone who -currently- has to "save" in order to afford coming to Florida, for anything at all, would likely not be able to come if the tourism taxes had to increase high enough to accommodate a loss of property tax.

That also will equal fewer people coming to Florida for vacation, and thinking "hey - I would love to retire here." If experiencing the state for vacation is needed for them to get a general feel for the area, some of them would just cross it off their list as options for retirement.

But the tax would be on what you consume not the amount of consumption.

My property tax bill will be $24,000 this year. If the tax rate is 10% then I'd have to "consume" $240,000 in taxable goods/services to pay more through the new tax.

Florida attracts people because of the weather/things offered from golf/fishing/cruises/theme parks. Nobody is going to "skip a trip" because it will cost them $350 more in taxes.

My guess: Lawmakers won't want to give up that free money they are guaranteed every Nov (property taxes). The county could be the loser in the tax shift, wealthy small towns like Jupiter Island or Fisher Island get millions for taxes and couldn't replicate that money due to lack of businesses in those areas.

Also consider the "bed tax" is already being used for arenas/ball parks etc.........basically anything citizens don't want to pay for but the county wants to have.

[Dave_n_Tenn]

Originally Posted by chiluvr1228

When the Florida lottery started in the 1980's, it was supposed to be great way for schools to get more money. We all know how that turned out.

I can't see how eliminating property taxes would work for the Florida budget.

Florida Lottery has contributed more than $1 billion per year to education. 25-30% immediately is transferred to the education account. Of course there is the winners who get 60% and the account administration costs too 10%

So far $23,000,000,000 for public education, $11,000,000,000 for colleges and universities and $8,000,000,000 for bright futures. Yes... that's BILLIONS.


And no... there is no right wing assault to look into how taxes are generated and what could or can be done to make less of a burden on all taxpayers.

[kyle19125]

Originally Posted by Dave_n_Tenn

Florida Lottery has contributed more than $1 billion per year to education. 25-30% immediately is transferred to the education account. Of course there is the winners who get 60% and the account administration costs too 10%

So far $23,000,000,000 for public education, $11,000,000,000 for colleges and universities and $8,000,000,000 for bright futures. Yes... that's BILLIONS.


And no... there is no right wing assault to look into how taxes are generated and what could or can be done to make less of a burden on all taxpayers.

The lottery money was supposed to enhance education but has evolved into the primary funding source since the state has cut so much out its budget earmarked for education, which is how teacher pay is ranked 48th among other telltale signs. Also the lottery funds pre-K through college, not just high school as many seem to think.

https://feaweb.org/release/nea-repor...ns-worst-paid/

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/...ege-gets-boost

[Dave_n_Tenn]

Originally Posted by kyle19125

The lottery money was supposed to enhance education but has evolved into the primary funding source since the state has cut so much out its budget earmarked for education, which is how teacher pay is ranked 48th among other telltale signs. Also the lottery funds pre-K through college, not just high school as many seem to think.

https://feaweb.org/release/nea-repor...ns-worst-paid/

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/...ege-gets-boost

Made up stories, untruths and misinformation

The lottery contributes 6% of the education budget, that is not the primary source of funds. I guess you failed math.

Florida ranks 8th for teacher starting wage.

Florida ranks 22nd for overall teacher salary.

$252+ million increase for the teacher salary increase categorical, which will stand at more than $1 billion for school year 2023–2024. Additionally, the Governor will sign: $10 million for the Heroes in the Classroom Bonus Program (HB 1035). $3.5 million for the Dual Enrollment Teacher Scholarship Program (HB 1035). Governor Ron DeSantis Approves Record Increase in Teacher Pay and Signs the Nation’s Most Comprehensive Package of Legislation to Support Teachers.

In Florida, the counties determine teacher wages. Some pay well while others do not.

[mgforshort]

We are in California and I'd be happy to see property taxes replaced with a higher sales tax. It is easier to pay 50 cents more for a gallon of gas than writing that check for $ 3,200 every year - and ours is on the low side. Having said this, I'd like to see sales tax on big ticket items, like cars, trucks, farm machinery, limited to $ 2,000 or 3%, whichever is less.

And if not, than property taxes should be assessed on the size of the home and the number of people in it. A family of seven in a big house needs more government services than a bachelor and his dog in a pricey small condo.

[kyle19125]

Originally Posted by Dave_n_Tenn

Made up stories, untruths and misinformation

The lottery contributes 6% of the education budget, that is not the primary source of funds. I guess you failed math.

Florida ranks 8th for teacher starting wage.

Florida ranks 22nd for overall teacher salary.

$252+ million increase for the teacher salary increase categorical, which will stand at more than $1 billion for school year 2023–2024. Additionally, the Governor will sign: $10 million for the Heroes in the Classroom Bonus Program (HB 1035). $3.5 million for the Dual Enrollment Teacher Scholarship Program (HB 1035). Governor Ron DeSantis Approves Record Increase in Teacher Pay and Signs the Nation’s Most Comprehensive Package of Legislation to Support Teachers.

In Florida, the counties determine teacher wages. Some pay well while others do not.

I provided linked sources for my information and you're spouting it out of where exactly?

[Ghaati]

Originally Posted by mgforshort

We are in California and I'd be happy to see property taxes replaced with a higher sales tax. It is easier to pay 50 cents more for a gallon of gas than writing that check for $ 3,200 every year - and ours is on the low side. Having said this, I'd like to see sales tax on big ticket items, like cars, trucks, farm machinery, limited to $ 2,000 or 3%, whichever is less.

And if not, than property taxes should be assessed on the size of the home and the number of people in it. A family of seven in a big house needs more government services than a bachelor and his dog in a pricey small condo.

What about a bachelor and his dog in a big expensive house, vs. a family of 7 living on the second floor of a lower-income 3-family house?

What about a widowed woman and her twin toddlers living in a cheap condo, vs. a bachelor and his dog in a pricey small condo?

And who will be checking every property in every community in every county, to make sure the "right number" of people are living in each dwelling?

What happens when that bachelor and his dog in the pricey small condo gets married? Or gets a house-mate? Or takes in a friend down on his luck? Or adopts a child?

As for the gas - the only people who pay a single property tax check, are property owners. Renters pay more in rent every year whether the tax goes up or not. PLUS they'd have to pay that extra 50 cents per gallon in gas. You know what happens every time the price of gas goes up over $2.50/gallon - everyone screams and whines, especially people who own gas-guzzlers, cars that require diesel fuel, and people who own boats. Of course it's blamed on politics, which is malarkey since it's the oil companies that set the prices. But the second anyone imposes an additional 50-cent tax on gas, the blame on politicians will finally be valid.

Is that what you want?

[MattMN]

Originally Posted by Ghaati

"Consumption tax" is not the same thing as "tourism tax."

Consumption taxes are imposed on everyone, not just people who rent short-term or visit Disney World. As others have already mentioned up-thread, Florida has a 6% sales tax. Various parts of the state have 1-2% additional tax, and there is an additional tax on hotels and short-term rentals.

A consumption tax would be tax in addition to THOSE taxes - on things like - McDonald's. A 5-pound bag of flour at Publix. Your shoes. Emergency services. Schools, both public and private. Consumption tax is a tax on goods and services. EVERYONE would pay it, on top of what they're already paying. Including people who are low-income and already living on a budget. It is basically a punishment tax for the poor, and a nothingberder for the wealthy.

This is exactly right. Typically, consumption taxes are a terrible idea. They completely favor the rich and make life harder for lower income brackets. Usually these are just another rich-get-richer scheme touted as "helping people".

Tourists are already targeted with hotel tax, airport fees, car rental tax, etc., contributing to the general state income. An increased general consumption tax will hurt the residents of FL disproportionally as compared to the increased contributions of tourists.

If you can afford a home, you can pay some taxes to help run the city/county infrastructure. If you can't afford a home, you still are paying via your rent, as the property owner is paying for these things. It doesn't make sense that tourists need to pay for our local government expenses.

[lunetunelover]

Originally Posted by MattMN

It doesn't make sense that tourists need to pay for our local government expenses.

I agree with nearly everything you said...until you got to this point.

Tourists use our roads, parks, beaches, trash services and many of our public facilities.

In my town, it was recently decided to add a parking fee near our beaches to help pay for trash removal. Residents can get a "pass" at City Hall to avoid the charge. It was discovered the worst offenders for litter and trash at the beaches were non-residents.

[Corrie22]

Originally Posted by lunetunelover

Tourists use our roads, parks, beaches, trash services and many of our public facilities.

Monroe county....Florida Keys...has a population of ~85,000

....way over 5 million people visit the Keys every year

that's over 60 times more tourists...than residents