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Old 12-27-2016, 06:01 PM
 
Location: Sydney, Australia
11,654 posts, read 13,078,612 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgtheone View Post
Is this the closest thing to a Mediterranean climate in Russia?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novorossiysk#Climate
Good find. Definitely is Med-like. But are there closer ones? I don't know.

For the love of god, this Victorian climate confuses the hell out of me. Is it Mediterranean or semi-arid? It also seems rather "oceanic", but its summer are too hot for that:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bendigo#Climate
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Old 12-27-2016, 06:53 PM
 
Location: Rochester, NY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
Good find. Definitely is Med-like. But are there closer ones? I don't know.

For the love of god, this Victorian climate confuses the hell out of me. Is it Mediterranean or semi-arid? It also seems rather "oceanic", but its summer are too hot for that:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bendigo#Climate
Don't see how bendigo can be a med climate. It has a slight summer dry season as the wettest winter month doesn't even get twice the precipitation as the driest summer month. Also 44.4% of annual precipitation falls in summer, well above the level of most med climates and 56-44 is a relative even distribution.

As for oceanic, summers are far too hot and it lacks real oceanic influence with the low-ish precipitation, probably high sunshine, high diurnal range, and decent seasonal variation.

According to Koeppen's aridity formula, it would need under 430 mm of precipitation to be semi arid. It gets 509 mm, well above the threshold.

I'd say it's just solidly a Chance climate, just on the dryer side.
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Old 12-27-2016, 08:07 PM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
Good find. Definitely is Med-like. But are there closer ones? I don't know.

For the love of god, this Victorian climate confuses the hell out of me. Is it Mediterranean or semi-arid? It also seems rather "oceanic", but its summer are too hot for that:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bendigo#Climate
It's a clearly a Cfb climate -the rainfall is the most obvious Cfb aspect,-very typical. Look at those low summer minimums as well -certainly not what one would expect from a Cfa or Cwa climate.
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Old 12-27-2016, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Rochester, NY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
It's a clearly a Cfb climate -the rainfall is the most obvious Cfb aspect,-very typical. Look at those low summer minimums as well -certainly not what one would expect from a Cfa or Cwa climate.
But it also has 30C summer maximums, gets over 40C and has over 15C diurnal ranges in summer. Not very oceanic. One could say that it's not typical of a subtropical climate either, but the hot summer days and high diurnal ranges are clearly not because of the ocean and if it had dominant oceanic influence, it would have much different summers--cooler highs, warmer lows.

I'd still say it's just a dry Cfa climate.
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Old 12-27-2016, 08:35 PM
 
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steelernation71 View Post
Don't see how bendigo can be a med climate. It has a slight summer dry season as the wettest winter month doesn't even get twice the precipitation as the driest summer month. Also 44.4% of annual precipitation falls in summer, well above the level of most med climates and 56-44 is a relative even distribution.

As for oceanic, summers are far too hot and it lacks real oceanic influence with the low-ish precipitation, probably high sunshine, high diurnal range, and decent seasonal variation.

According to Koeppen's aridity formula, it would need under 430 mm of precipitation to be semi arid. It gets 509 mm, well above the threshold.

I'd say it's just solidly a Chance climate, just on the dryer side.
Good analysis. Perhaps it's a transitional Cfa/Cfb climate. I don't know, but it seems very ambiguous and multifaceted. It can be semi-arid, humid subtropical, Mediterranean and oceanic, depending on how you "interpret" it. Perhaps it's a concoction of these four?
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Old 12-27-2016, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steelernation71 View Post
But it also has 30C summer maximums, gets over 40C and has over 15C diurnal ranges in summer. Not very oceanic. One could say that it's not typical of a subtropical climate either, but the hot summer days and high diurnal ranges are clearly not because of the ocean and if it had dominant oceanic influence, it would have much different summers--cooler highs, warmer lows.

I'd still say it's just a dry Cfa climate.
Any Cfb climate in Victoria will get 40C days. While 30C in the warmest month is warm for Cfb climate, it probably gets a combination of hot days from the interior and cooler days from the south -not unusual for Victorian Cfb climates.

NZ sees summer months with a diurnal range averaging around 15C (up to 22C range on record months), so diurnal range is what could be expected for an inland location.

Cfb climates are more likely to see higher maximums/cooler minimums than the opposite -average minimum for the month here so far is around 8.5C, so there certainly aren't warmer lows in Cfb climates, than would be found in Cfa or Cwa climates at comparable latitudes.
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Old 12-27-2016, 08:54 PM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
Good analysis. Perhaps it's a transitional Cfa/Cfb climate. I don't know, but it seems very ambiguous and multifaceted. It can be semi-arid, humid subtropical, Mediterranean and oceanic, depending on how you "interpret" it. Perhaps it's a concoction of these four?
There is nothing Mediterranean or semi arid about it. It's almost entirely Cfb in makeup.

The only aspect the could be considered Cfa are the summer maximums, but Cfa climates get their summer heat from subtropical air masses, and Bendigo's low minimums indicate a lack of major influence from subtropical airmasses.

Last edited by Joe90; 12-27-2016 at 09:04 PM..
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Old 12-27-2016, 09:04 PM
 
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
Any Cfb climate in Victoria will get 40C days.
Yes, but many of them don't have an average mean above 22C in the summer. So if they get 40C+ temps and have an average mean of 19C in the hottest month, they're an still oceanic climate.

Quote:
While 30C in the warmest month is warm for Cfb climate, it probably gets a combination of hot days from the interior and cooler days from the south -not unusual for Victorian Cfb climates.
Except, the mean of Bendigo is 22C for two consecutive months. Koppen-wise, it is NOT a bona fide oceanic climate. Does it have oceanic influence? Yes. But you can't just call it "oceanic" under Koppen's scheme. This contradicts his classification rules, no?

Quote:
There is nothing Mediterranean or semi arid about it. It's almost entirely Cfb in makeup. The only aspect the could be considered Cfa are the summer maximums, but Cfa climates get their summer heat from subtropical air masses, and Bendigo's low minimums indicate a lack of major influence from subtropical airmasses.
Perhaps there is nothing Mediterranean or Semi-arid about it. I am on that boat. But it is definitely NOT "entirely Cfb in makeup". So you're saying it's like London and Glasgow? At least, in Koppen's scheme it is NOT oceanic, as it has two warm months with mean temps above 22C. This is a deal-breaker.

Again, you can say that it's a transitional Cfa/Cfb climate. It's neither of those fully for sure.
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Old 12-27-2016, 09:19 PM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
22,216 posts, read 21,854,852 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
Yes, but many of them don't have an average mean above 22C in the summer. So if they get 40C+ temps and have an average mean of 19C in the hottest month, they're an still oceanic climate.


Except, the mean of Bendigo is 22C for two consecutive months. Koppen-wise, it is NOT a bona fide oceanic climate. Does it have oceanic influence? Yes. But you can't just call it "oceanic" under Koppen's scheme. This contradicts his classification rules, no?


Perhaps there is nothing Mediterranean or Semi-arid about it. I am on that boat. But it is definitely NOT "entirely Cfb in makeup". So you're saying it's like London and Glasgow? At least, in Koppen's scheme it is NOT oceanic, as it has two warm months with mean temps above 22C. This is a deal-breaker.

Again, you can say that it's a transitional Cfa/Cfb climate. It's neither of those fully for sure.
Bendigo is further from the sea, so warmer summer maximums and cooler winter minimums are to be expected - just like all Cfb climates.

I'm only interested in genetics as a way of defining climate, not some line in the sand that ignores overall characteristics , but Koppen's original threshold was actually 72F, not 22C, so technically, Bendigo fails to reach the 72F threshold anyway.

Cimates in classifications aren't "alike" - they share characteristics. My climate isn't like Glasgow or London either, but it shares it basic genetics with them and Bendigo - any differences are explained by latitude and geography.

Anyway -I'm off for a swim.
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Old 12-28-2016, 04:17 AM
 
Location: Sydney, Australia
11,654 posts, read 13,078,612 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
Bendigo is further from the sea, so warmer summer maximums and cooler winter minimums are to be expected - just like all Cfb climates.
Who said that Cfa's can't have that feature?

Quote:
I'm only interested in genetics as a way of defining climate, not some line in the sand that ignores overall characteristics , but Koppen's original threshold was actually 72F, not 22C, so technically, Bendigo fails to reach the 72F threshold anyway.
Fair enough. But, to be fair, the common threshold is 22C (71.6F) nowadays. I'm going with that. Heck, I think the mean subtropical threshold should be lower (21C at least), though winter higher at around 5C at most.

Quote:
Cimates in classifications aren't "alike" - they share characteristics. My climate isn't like Glasgow or London either, but it shares it basic genetics with them and Bendigo - any differences are explained by latitude and geography.
Wait, I thought you ridiculed the fact that Wollongong is an oceanic climate and "more" in the likes of London than Sydney. Remember that one?
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