Do we underestimate and downplay how Great Sacramento weather really is? (Los Angeles: shelters, alligators)

[Chimérique]

Originally Posted by tstieber

Sacramento does have such a beautiful urban Forest.....it's nice to see that humans can get some things right.

True that, those trees add oxygen, and provide a ton of shade. See the Sacramento Tree Foundation for info on Native Trees in Sacramento. The Sacramento Valley is the largest natural aquifer in California. When u dig a deep hole in Downtown Sacramento it naturally fills up with a lot of water.

June 18 10:30 am

Austin 91F

Portland 70F
Sacramento 70F

[sacite]

Originally Posted by tstieber

Sacramento does have such a beautiful urban Forest. Considering that almost all of those trees are non-native species that have been planted by people over the decades, it's nice to see that humans can get some things right.

Sac is awesome. It is one of the most underrated cities in the nation; possibly in the world. OK, maybe that is stretching it. But, the natural beauty here is remarkable for a city that has received so much flak for being a "cowtown". Who would have thought that cows have such an affinity for trees? I agree that the abundance of and differentiation in the fauna and trees (in this city) is one of its features that really make it unique. It's a great place to just spend a day walking around.

[MrJester]

Originally Posted by sacite

Sac is awesome. It is one of the most underrated cities in the nation; possibly in the world. OK, maybe that is stretching it. But, the natural beauty here is remarkable for a city that has received so much flak for being a "cowtown". Who would have thought that cows have such an affinity for trees? I agree that the abundance of and differentiation in the fauna and trees (in this city) is one of its features that really make it unique. It's a great place to just spend a day walking around.

There's plenty of trees within the city, but once you get out onto the plains, it's just flat, boring farmland that looks about as well forested as the windswept plains of Kansas. Not to mention that during the summer everything is brown, dry, and dead outside the city. Go to the newer areas of Roseville and you'll see what I mean.

The choice of trees is extremely odd. Douglas firs and ponderosa pines in a place where it regularly exceeds 100 degrees and never rains in the summer makes about as much sense as growing a conifer forest in Vegas. At least cities like Phoenix are actually honest with themselves and promote native vegetation (rock gardens, cacti, mesquite, palo verde, etc.) than pretend to be a phony alpine resort.

[Chimérique]

Originally Posted by MrJester

There's plenty of trees within the city, but once you get out onto the plains, it's just flat, boring farmland that looks about as well forested as the windswept plains of Kansas. Not to mention that during the summer everything is brown, dry, and dead outside the city. Go to the newer areas of Roseville and you'll see what I mean.

We, and the early settlers of California called those brown hills and valleys, Golden, hence the Golden State. Sacramento's Mediterranean climate means very predictable weather and very little inclement weather.

Many people find the flat farmland quite beautiful, lots of open space. It’s especially beautiful when you consider that open space is feeding the world with fruits and vegetables, and alot of those farms surrounding Sacramento are organic farms.

Those brown hills and valleys you see in Roseville are typical of 4/5 or more of the most populated areas in California. Many parts of California are dry but not nearly as dry as the Southwest. NorCal averages 15-40 inches of rain annually; that is alot of rain compared to the deserts in the southwest. And I’m NOT counting the rain forests further up the coast in NorCal.

Sacramento IS alot greener than Phoenix because we sit in a natural acquifer that is fed by snow run-off from the Cascades and Sierras. The Sierras average 300-500 inches of snow and 98% of it all flows west into the Sacramento and San Joaquin Valleys. We don’t need to water our trees very much because of this natural acquifer. Vegas doesn’t get fed water naturally the way Sacramento does. Also the Sacramento Valley is naturally fertile and much of it is at a low elevation meaning it doesn’t freeze for long periods of time as valleys that sit in high elevations like Vegas, Denver or Salt Lake.

Have you ever seen how brown and ugly Denver and Salt Lake are in the Winter, that’s depressing.

5:00PM JUNE 18
DEN - 86F
SAC - 89F
AUSTIN - 99F
PHX - 100F

[Chimérique]

Originally Posted by MrJester

The choice of trees is extremely odd. Douglas firs and ponderosa pines in a place where it regularly exceeds 100 degrees and never rains in the summer makes about as much sense as growing a conifer forest in Vegas. At least cities like Phoenix are actually honest with themselves and promote native vegetation (rock gardens, cacti, mesquite, palo verde, etc.) than pretend to be a phony alpine resort.

Just about anything will grow in the Sacramento Valley. There are 50-100 year old Redwoods growning just fine in Sacramento. Although big, notice those Sacramento Redwoods are not nearly as big as the ones growing in their natural habitat, up north. The Premium Native tree in the Sacramento Valley is the Valley Oak; it lives something like 300-600 years, and it does just fine without rain or water for 3-4 month stretches during Sacramento’s and NorCals dry season.

Sacramento is not pretending to be an alpine resort, we have alpine resorts less than 2 hours up the hill. We can grow Douglas Firs and even Redwoods right in the heart of Sacramento. We don’t call that odd, we call it unique because in our Mediterranean climate we know a wet season will eventually come. Those trees thrive with just a little bit of water during the dry season. Phoenix doesn’t have a prolonged wet season of 20-40 inches of rain like NorCal, and they don’t have a natural fertile valley that helps to contain that water.

Sacramento’s population is one of the most diverse and integrated cities in the nation, and like its people, Sacramento’s vegetation is quite diverse and integrated as well. We can have front yards that are primarly rock gardens with cacti, mesquite, and palos verde, while our backyards can sustain a Redwood tree, Valley Oak and and lemon tree in the backyard. Sacramento averages just the right amount of rain (20 inches/yr). Any less rain on a regular basis coupled with low amounts of snow in the Sierras would make a big difference and we would permanently need to be more like Phoenix or SoCal.

*By the way, Ponderosa Pines are NATIVE to the foothills just East of Sacramento.

7:15PM JUNE 18

San Francisco - 51F - Winter like temps

Portland - 82F
SAC - 83F

Redding - 90F

[Chimérique]

First 20 days of June 2018

Low Temps - Nights and Mornings

18 Days - 50's
2 days - Low 60's

High Temps - Highest Temp for the Day

12 Days - 80's
6 Days -90's (heat index)
2 Days - 70's

Zero Days -100

[sacdukeman]

My Sacramento weather report card = Spring: A- Nice temps, some rain, green surroundings, variety in conditions. The only real flaw is too many north wind days. Summer: B the days in the 80's and low 90's are fine, though sometimes a bit dry, but at least close to a good humidity but the 95+ days are too arid, and you get some with the God awful north wind, like today. No rain either, so everything not irrigated is dead. Poor air quality on the days without the Delta breeze. Nights are usually pleasant though. Fall: C It's too damn short. Sometimes it's hot through half of October, which isn't my idea of autumn. When those 60's and 70's are here, it's glorious, but usually it's no more than a month before winter hits. Winter: B Not terribly cold, and much less fog than 20+ years ago. A little snow now and then would be nice for variety, like we had when I lived in Newcastle. Some of those winter storms pack devastating winds though.

Overall I'd give Sacto a B = good, not great.

[Chimérique]

Originally Posted by sacdukeman

My Sacramento weather report card = Spring: A- Nice temps, some rain, green surroundings, variety in conditions. The only real flaw is too many north wind days. Summer: B the days in the 80's and low 90's are fine, though sometimes a bit dry, but at least close to a good humidity but the 95+ days are too arid, and you get some with the God awful north wind, like today. No rain either, so everything not irrigated is dead. Poor air quality on the days without the Delta breeze. Nights are usually pleasant though. Fall: C It's too damn short. Sometimes it's hot through half of October, which isn't my idea of autumn. When those 60's and 70's are here, it's glorious, but usually it's no more than a month before winter hits. Winter: B Not terribly cold, and much less fog than 20+ years ago. A little snow now and then would be nice for variety, like we had when I lived in Newcastle. Some of those winter storms pack devastating winds though.

Overall I'd give Sacto a B = good, not great.

Fair analysis, I say more like A- or B+. I think you are overestimating the North Winds, there are not very many of those days.

[MrJester]

Originally Posted by Chimérique

Fair analysis, I say more like A- or B+. I think you are overestimating the North Winds, there are not very many of those days.

My grading of Sac weather:

Winter: B+ (I'd upgrade it to an A- if it was like Redding, which sees a couple inches of snow every year. Also, would like a bit more rain; last winter was below average precipitation, though not terribly dry.) No blizzards, significant rain=automatic B+ for me.

Spring: C+ (Severe pollen, not enough rainy days to keep the pollen at bay)

Summer: D

Upgrades that need to be done to Sac summers:

1. NO MORE 115 degree days or obnoxiously cool 75 days in Summer. (Those are extremes, true, but it goes to show how much Sac temps fluctuate). Make the temps more consistent. 85 degrees on a rainy or overcast day, 95-100 degrees on a sunny day.
2. MORE CLOUD COVER. It would be a lot more exciting watching clouds move around the sky. Also, would provide relief from intense sunshine.
3. SUMMER RAIN. You heard me. When it's 95-100 degrees outside and sunny, I want the afternoon to end in a rain shower that cools everything by 15 degrees. And it feels even cooler due to the sea breeze that blows the rain in. I like the rain warm so I can splash around in flip-flops instead of rainboots.

Also, I would like to see the foothills bursting with lush, dark green subtropical vegetation. Let's get some bayous in the Delta, too, some spanish moss on the oak trees; bald cypress swamps and alligators would be cool.

The rain would greatly improve air quality, too.

4. WARMER EARLY MORNINGS. Sacramento nights can be warm, but they usually cool off to a chilly 55-60 degrees by sunrise. I want to sit on my porch, barefoot, in shorts and a t-shirt, and still feel warm while observing the sunrise.

Saving grace of Sac summers is no hurricanes, no tornadoes, no dust storms.

By comparison, Florida and Gulf Coast summers receive an A from me (if they didn't get as many hurricanes they'd be A+ weather.) The rest of The South gets a B+, Tuscon gets a B (they got rain in the form of monsoons), Las Vegas gets a D- (far less monsoons than Tuscon), Redding a D- (even hotter than Sacramento), and Yellowstone an F (WTH? I'm camping in a tent, I wake up, and it's 35 degrees in the morning--on a good day!!!!).

Fall: C+

Would like Early Fall to be just like the A+ summer I described above, then progressively cooler.

In the US:
Places with worse weather (overall) than Sac: Pacific Northwest, the entire Midwest, the Northeast, the Mountain West, the Mojave Desert.

Places with better weather (overall) than Sac: The former Confederate states, plus the Sonoran Desert in Phoenix, Tuscon, and Coachella Valley. Also, LA and San Diego metro areas.

Satisfied, Chimerique? See, I even admitted that Sacramento has better weather than all of the US outside of The South, SoCal
and Southern Arizona!

[sacdukeman]

Originally Posted by Chimérique

Fair analysis, I say more like A- or B+. I think you are overestimating the North Winds, there are not very many of those days.

Perhaps you are right and they just stick out in my mind because I so hate them but I am confident we get at least 20 such days a year where it's > 15 mph. Yesterday was one of them! Also, as much as we all enjoy the Delta Breeze, there are some days where it is too strong - say 20 or more, where it isn't pleasant. If it were less windy here, and more breezy, Sacto would move up to B+ for me.