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Old 10-21-2012, 11:42 PM
 
Location: Chicago
38,707 posts, read 103,433,361 times
Reputation: 29990

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainNJ View Post
cheat???? its just a job.
If it were just a job, anyone could do it So no, it's more than that. It's a competitive sport with rules that he (most likely) violated in order to win. That makes him (most likely) a cheat.
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Old 10-22-2012, 07:16 AM
 
8,095 posts, read 10,133,877 times
Reputation: 22697
So, there was not enough information to prosecute.

But based on hearsay, the court of cycling found him guilty.

Even though he passed every one of their tests during the period in which he competed.

Nothing to see here.

When the sport of cycling could benefit in extraordinary commercial ways this guy was a hero.

Now that they don't need him, he is a doper.

Meh. This guy rode his a$$ off in some extraordinary terrain against some pretty competitive fields who were just as likely to be dopers as well.

Put him in the same group as Roger Clemmons (who was exonerated because the evidence against him was all 'hear-say') and move along.

Lance Armstrong gave us some incredible entertainment and raised a LOT of money for cancer research.

In my book that makes him a pretty decent guy.
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Old 10-22-2012, 08:00 AM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
77,771 posts, read 105,079,410 times
Reputation: 49251
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpideySwag View Post
I think the media is portraying Lance Armstrong in a much more negative light than what is needed. Cycling is one of the dirtiest sport especially in the new millennium (just look up "list of doping cases in cycling" in Wikipedia) and I've heard from multiple radio hosts, avid cycling fans and sports fans alike, that it wouldn't surprise them if >80% of the cyclists in Tour De France used some sort of performance enhancing drugs...And I don't disagree with them. Cycling 200km a day for 20+ days is NUTS!

Now let's look at it like this: if no one in the whole race was using performance enhancing drugs, then wouldn't you think that Armstrong would still be the best cyclist to emerge out of the whole group? But unfortunately PED use is pervasive in cycling, and it makes sense for the cyclists to use drugs in order to level the playing field with everyone else violating the rules. It's sad and it's scathing to the integrity of sports but that's just the reality.

Obviously not every cyclist gets tested on a regular basis for PEDs and only the elite ones like Armstrong will be the subject of most scrutiny. But when they do get tested, with the advances in science and technology, scientists are able to come up with newer and modified substances that are not on the list of banned substances that allow the cyclists to pass the test surreptitiously. And when committees like USADA includes more drugs to banned PEDs, there will be substances in altered form that will be able to bypass the tests undetected.

I'm not saying what Armstrong did is right (if in fact it's true) nor the pervasive use of PEDs in sports, which is the reality of sports today. But out of this came something good, the LIVESTRONG Foundation which raised hundreds of millions of dollars for a good cause to help cancer patients and to provide hope. Whether you think he did this for his own stardom or to sway the attention away from his doping allegations is up to you, but you can't deny that this philanthropic organization is bad for the world, or not enough to overshadow the blemish in his lustrous cycling career.

I'd be willing to guarantee that if any other cyclists used whatever PEDs that Armstrong used for his Tour De France career, he would not come remotely close to winning 7 TDF titles in his career. This allegation is much to meager in contrast to the accolades and accomplishments that he achieved in his career and I think that all this diatribe about Lance Armstrong needs to stop.
He used a drug he should not have used: no, I have no sympathy for him..Yes, he has raised a lot of money and done a lot of good, this doesn't make up for cheating....Are you trying to say, it is ok cause being a super star is how he was able to raise the money he did? I guess you think it is ok to steal from your employer if you also give to charity? Maybe you want to bring Robinhood back? Oh, I forgot, we already have him, his name is Obama...Geeze!!!!!
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Old 10-22-2012, 08:13 AM
 
17,410 posts, read 12,020,316 times
Reputation: 16189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hendu View Post
He also could have come clean instead of using his enormous influence/wealth to tarnish reputations of anyone who dared speak the truth.

Armstrong Accused Of Intimidating Potential Witness Tyler Hamilton In Aspen Restaurant | Cyclingnews.com

Betsy Andreu reveals intimidation by Lance Armstrong | Mail Online
Tyler Hamilton is a piece of crap that got caught doping, and decided to enact revenge on those he thought had done him wrong. There is no doubt that Armstrong is a jerk, but that doesn't change that fact the he NEVER failed a drug test, but Hamilton did.

This is a witch hunt, through and through. Did Armstrong dope? Maybe. But to convict someone in the court of public opinion based on testimony of disgruntled former friends bent on revenge, with no concrete scientific proof, is disgusting.
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Old 10-22-2012, 08:16 AM
 
17,410 posts, read 12,020,316 times
Reputation: 16189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
I think its a reasonable assumption that he doped. Does it mean anything to me? No, but to many former team mates, some as highly respected in the sport as Armstrong was, have said he doped.

Like I said, to me, its the fact he's lied about it for so long thats so disappointing to me.
So you've decided that Armstrong is lying, but his teammates are telling the truth? How did you decide they could be trusted, and Armstrong not? Just curious.
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Old 10-22-2012, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Oklahoma
17,901 posts, read 13,830,510 times
Reputation: 17988
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
So you've decided that Armstrong is lying, but his teammates are telling the truth? How did you decide they could be trusted, and Armstrong not? Just curious.

If you want to say that Livingston had a vendetta you might have a point, but not the whole team.
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Old 10-28-2012, 07:45 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
1,870 posts, read 2,398,389 times
Reputation: 2032
Did anyone watch The World According to Lance on CNN last night? The show covered a lot of detail and presented it well.

It originally aired on the Four Corners TV series in Australia. They posted the entire show online:
The World According to Lance - Four Corners

They also posted an article about the "key players," including a videotaped deposition of Armstrong in the SCA case (He firmly states under oath that he never used performance enhancing drugs):
The World According to Lance - key players
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Old 08-16-2013, 06:26 AM
 
Location: Texas
37,963 posts, read 17,947,470 times
Reputation: 10385
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpideySwag View Post
I think the media is portraying Lance Armstrong in a much more negative light than what is needed. Cycling is one of the dirtiest sport especially in the new millennium (just look up "list of doping cases in cycling" in Wikipedia) and I've heard from multiple radio hosts, avid cycling fans and sports fans alike, that it wouldn't surprise them if >80% of the cyclists in Tour De France used some sort of performance enhancing drugs...And I don't disagree with them. Cycling 200km a day for 20+ days is NUTS!

Now let's look at it like this: if no one in the whole race was using performance enhancing drugs, then wouldn't you think that Armstrong would still be the best cyclist to emerge out of the whole group? But unfortunately PED use is pervasive in cycling, and it makes sense for the cyclists to use drugs in order to level the playing field with everyone else violating the rules. It's sad and it's scathing to the integrity of sports but that's just the reality.

Obviously not every cyclist gets tested on a regular basis for PEDs and only the elite ones like Armstrong will be the subject of most scrutiny. But when they do get tested, with the advances in science and technology, scientists are able to come up with newer and modified substances that are not on the list of banned substances that allow the cyclists to pass the test surreptitiously. And when committees like USADA includes more drugs to banned PEDs, there will be substances in altered form that will be able to bypass the tests undetected.

I'm not saying what Armstrong did is right (if in fact it's true) nor the pervasive use of PEDs in sports, which is the reality of sports today. But out of this came something good, the LIVESTRONG Foundation which raised hundreds of millions of dollars for a good cause to help cancer patients and to provide hope. Whether you think he did this for his own stardom or to sway the attention away from his doping allegations is up to you, but you can't deny that this philanthropic organization is bad for the world, or not enough to overshadow the blemish in his lustrous cycling career.

I'd be willing to guarantee that if any other cyclists used whatever PEDs that Armstrong used for his Tour De France career, he would not come remotely close to winning 7 TDF titles in his career. This allegation is much to meager in contrast to the accolades and accomplishments that he achieved in his career and I think that all this diatribe about Lance Armstrong needs to stop.
Lying and cheating can be excused if others are doing it. Is that what your workplace is like?
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Old 08-16-2013, 11:02 AM
 
2,908 posts, read 3,882,661 times
Reputation: 3170
I'm mad at Lance because he spawned a culture of middle aged dorks taking to the street on $3000 bikes wearing embarrassing outfits. IMHO, this is a much greater crime than doping,
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Old 08-16-2013, 11:07 AM
 
47,050 posts, read 26,153,749 times
Reputation: 29534
Quote:
Originally Posted by smittyjohnny38 View Post
So even though he was a better cyclist than the rest, he was supposed to just let almost all the others who were juicing beat him while he didnt?
"All the others did it" is not a valid excuse from a grown man.
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