Socially awkward teen , I need advice (autism, parents, girl, appropriate)

[Beejay24/7]

I really appreciate the helpful comments, Romanigypsy,thanks for sharing your experience, I'm probably on the Aspie range myself,so I can identify, and no, I don't have any relatives in driving distance. Well, we had a talk, and instead of suggesting stuff, I took the good advice offered on the board, and asked what he would like to do, he's willing to try soccer and he actively likes the idea of swimming lessons, he did mention boxing because he felt that might help him pull his punches if he gets attacked again, (from what I understand he punched the other kid in the face during the fight, and gave him a black eye, which he feels bad about now) so I'm going to see about signing him up for whatever is available this weekend


I'm meeting with the school and I'm hoping we can put something in place to help stop bullying, they don't seem to have any official policy or game plan, the responses I kept getting were "I don't know what to tell you", "I really can't answer that"


I did think about moving , but he doesn't do too well with change, I asked him how he felt about a move and he was against it


We worked a little on his approach to other kids, we did some role play, and he is now willing to reach out to other little 'lone rangers' sitting by themselves,

After our discussion he seemed pretty upbeat, although some of that might have been because I threw in the offer of a trip to gamestop to seal the deal . Once again I appreciate the advice offered, not only did it help me communicate with him better, but it was reassuring to actually talk to people who had been in the situation, and come through the other side. I did kind of have nightmares of my child being the withdrawn guy in the basement in his underwear playing warcraft on his computer 24/7 ;-)

[Marlow]

You sound like a really good mom and your son is lucky to have you. It's important that your home be a haven for him and it appears to be. Some advice I got on this forum years ago that I've never forgotten is if you're child is having a hard time socially, never blame him. Always be on his side and never say "it's your fault because you're annoying" or anything similar. You can role play, etc., but always in a positive way. Kids really need to feel like their parents are on their side.

[GotHereQuickAsICould]

Other than the PSP, is there an area or subject he is interested in, fascinated by?

Robotics clubs, for example, are filled with socially awkward teens who grow up to be engineers and scientists. In between they have a good time, travel to regional and even national competitions.

Rebuilding vintage cars? Track down a vintage car groups and see if there is some retired guy who would appreciate a helping hand.

Trains? Some areas have tourist train operations run by volunteers.

Music? Playing in the band has been great fun and a wonderful experience for many.

The teen years are fraught with peril for even the liveliest of teen boys. They key is to remember that these are the years they learn to stand on their own two feet, figure out how to think for themselves, find their passion in life.

Don't make too big a deal out of the social experience of high school. Very few people look back on high school as being the high point in their lives. Most of us trudge our way through, anxious to get into the "real world."

Ten years later, we're lucky if we have one good friend left from high school.

And don't forget to have some adventures with him. I know work and life is busy, but these are the last few years he'll want to go anywhere with you. Don't pass up those trips, those memories.

What fun you two are going to have. Enjoy.

[RomaniGypsy]

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

I really appreciate the helpful comments, Romanigypsy,thanks for sharing your experience, I'm probably on the Aspie range myself,so I can identify, and no, I don't have any relatives in driving distance.

I'm noticing that you didn't say "I don't have any living relatives"... to me this means you do have relatives, but they live far enough away that it doesn't qualify as "within driving distance". If you feel that you need the help of someone else, ask these relatives (starting with those closest to you) if they'd be able to help were you local to them. If they say yes, then you should move close to [whomever] even if that means you transfer your job or get a different job. Bear in mind that what I said before about "he's watching and paying attention" can work in your favor even if nothing is happening. If you tell him that you've decided the best thing to do is move away to be near [some relative who can help out] because that'll also take him away from the people who pick on him, that'll satisfy him for a while as long as he can see that you're trying to make it happen. You have no control over whether or not you will get a job right away in that new area... he'll accept that as long as he can see that you're trying.

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

Well, we had a talk, and instead of suggesting stuff, I took the good advice offered on the board, and asked what he would like to do, he's willing to try soccer and he actively likes the idea of swimming lessons, he did mention boxing because he felt that might help him pull his punches if he gets attacked again, (from what I understand he punched the other kid in the face during the fight, and gave him a black eye, which he feels bad about now) so I'm going to see about signing him up for whatever is available this weekend

That's strange, that he would feel bad about giving some tormentor of his a black eye... I did that a couple of times and to this day I'm glad I did because it shut the person up and sent a message to anyone else who'd pick on me. I always noticed a dramatic drop in torment right after I redecorated someone's face... word got around fast. Do yourself a favor and don't discourage him from defending himself violently in the face of assault and/or torment from a habitual offender. My parents did exactly that and it counterbalanced all of the benefits I had earned by beating up [whomever]. I got challenged one time by a kid whom I could have easily whipped (when I'm angry, LOOK OUT)... and I had no choice but to avoid the fight because my parents told me I'd be in a world of trouble at home if I got into another fight at school. Once the other kids knew I wouldn't be making examples out of them too, they resumed their old ways of tormenting me.

See, I'd agree that boxing classes might be a good thing, but my reasoning would be "because it'd teach him how to fight and how to defend himself".

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

I'm meeting with the school and I'm hoping we can put something in place to help stop bullying, they don't seem to have any official policy or game plan, the responses I kept getting were "I don't know what to tell you", "I really can't answer that"

Then, next time you have such a meeting, bring a lawyer (or someone you trust to be a witness) and/or a tape recorder. Get evidence and a credible witness attesting to this, and you might actually have a state-level case... or, even better, a federal case. You might cause more positive change than you can imagine.

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

I did think about moving , but he doesn't do too well with change, I asked him how he felt about a move and he was against it

Ask him why. This is a good opportunity, because his answer appears illogical on the surface. This says, to me, that there is something about your present area which is sufficiently positive in his mind to more than counterbalance the negativity he is experiencing at school. Something makes it "worth staying despite what I deal with at school". Figure out what that is, and that may be all the information you need to determine how to play up the positives.

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

We worked a little on his approach to other kids, we did some role play, and he is now willing to reach out to other little 'lone rangers' sitting by themselves,

Those people make the best "friends" because the kids who can't seem to get along with the pack feel much less pressure to give up their individuality in the name of following the pack. That makes them, among other things, substantially more loyal than "pack" people.

I will caution you about one thing, however. It's not guaranteed that your son will make many friends. Even now, at age 33, I have very few friends. I could count them all on one hand and still have fingers left over. However, that is of my choice and not anyone else's doing. I hold a very high standard for what constitutes "friendship"... in today's world where a "friend" is someone who has clicked a button on Facebook, my friendship standard is almost unheard of... but for me, what most people call "friends" I would usually call "acquaintances". I have a bunch of people I could call who'd do just about anything for me if I needed it... but I don't open up to many people because I don't find them to be sufficiently similar to me. It's hard enough being me... I feel that NOBODY truly understands me. Some people come close... some people (such as my wife) accept and respect the way I am and can anticipate how I will operate and/or react in various situations... but nobody has ever truly understood why I am the way I am. To understand that, they would have to value logic over emotion. Yes, I am more of a real-life Vulcan than most people. I have plenty of emotion... I've always felt that I was more emotional than most men... but my thought processes focus on logic. The one time I went with emotion over logic, at least in my adult years, I got terribly burned. That was, for sure, a taste of what "normal" people deal with.

Another reason why I can't make friends easily is because I don't respect the reasons why other people are the way they are. I understand that people generally have the freedom to make their own decisions, but I very rarely respect those decisions and the reasons underlying them. I may understand the reasons but I don't respect them. I've studied people very closely since my very young years - I pretty much had to, because it seemed as though they were all against me. Since I obviously couldn't be "one of them", at least I had to understand "them" to the best of my ability. By now I think I have most people figured out.

For example, I don't get why people smoke. It says on the pack "this is going to harm your health and probably kill you", it stinks to high heaven, it offends many people, it's expensive, we're taught from a very young age that it's bad, articles are all over the Internet about the various different ways in which smoking harms you, and it offers absolutely no absolute positive benefit... yet people smoke and most don't quit (even though many people have quit) once the "peer pressure" situation disappears. I recently heard that my wife's aunt resumed smoking recently because of some issue between her daughter and her son. From my perspective, I fail to see any way that her inhaling poison will improve the situation between her children. I know she'd say "I'm smoking to relieve stress", but first of all - she needn't stress over it, secondly - she could feasibly improve it if she tried, thirdly - the situation is the same once her cancer stick has been reduced to ash so her having consumed that cancer stick doesn't cause any improvement in the situation. Now, I understand that people start smoking because they're insecure in themselves and they continue smoking after getting addicted because they don't believe they're worth enough as people to be non-smokers, but since both of those reasons are essentially bullcrap (insecurity doesn't excuse stupidity, nor does failure to recognize one's intrinsic value as a human being), I don't respect them. People will try to argue this point ad nauseam but that doesn't make them right. That is a further reason why I don't respect this reasoning or the people who promote it... and cannot befriend such people.

Here's another one - I don't understand why people follow sports fanatically. Most people hate the obscene amounts of money that athletes earn, when the average American is under significant economic stress... but yet they feed the system that enables these athletes to earn such ridiculous sums of money. People somehow experience extreme emotional swings watching the actions of some athlete thousands of miles away, whom they don't know, when those actions have no tangible effect on the person's life. They operate as though these athletes will hear their screams, their insults, their cheers, their [whatever]. If their team loses, they're extremely angry. Heck, I saw an article not long ago where some waiter commented about the Auburn college football team having won a game against the Alabama college football team, and in so doing he ticked off an Alabama fan (who retaliated by not leaving a tip). All of this, because a bunch of entitled buffoons on scholarships (which should have gone instead to actual SCHOLARS, hence the name "scholarship"), whom neither of them know, performed better in a game than the other bunch of entitled buffoons on scholarships. I understand that people follow sports because: 1) all human beings are wired to believe in something greater than themselves and sports fanatics misdirect that belief toward their teams of choice, and 2) because their normal lives are so boring and void of action that they have to seek entertainment in the form of buffoons running each other over on television (or in person). I understand it but I don't respect it because it's not good. Again, people will argue this but that doesn't make them right... and this is another reason why I cannot befriend such people.

Now, you want to hear something weird? I have had a reputation for being a great counselor and advisor, since age 16! I might not have many friends but apparently, I have developed an unusually strong understanding of how and why people do what they do. Mission accomplished, I say. In my last two years of high school, not only did people I know seek me out to get advice and solutions to their problems, but people I DIDN'T know did the same thing, based upon what they'd heard about the quality of my advice! Can you beat that? To this day, I still find myself counseling people on a regular basis. The only conclusion I can draw is that I definitely understand how people SHOULD operate!

The discrepancy between what people "should do" and what they "actually do" is what prevents me from having close relationships with most people. I can't get into what most people enjoy because it strikes me as stupid. I dislike being in large group / crowd situations because they don't make sense. (Case in point: A few years back, I was at a chamber of commerce meeting and I was talking with someone. Another guy came by, interrupted the conversation by summoning the other person - "Hey [name], how ya doin'?" - and then the conversation was derailed as my former conversation partner shifted his attention to the other person. To me, what the interrupter did was rude. In reality, it was obviously successful. To me, what my conversation partner did was rude, because he should have said "Don't interrupt me - I'm in the middle of a conversation!". If he wanted to end the conversation with me for whatever reason, he should have done so when he decided that, rather than continuing it for some platitudinous reason.) On top of that, being self-employed, I rarely have the chance to meet people.

Despite this, I seem to be universally liked, these days. It's better than any alternative, for sure. Maybe that's because I'm not a jerk. If your son gets to this point, even if he doesn't have many friends, don't worry about that. He'll survive. At least there's the Internet... it has its perks. I met my wife on the Internet... it's the great social equalizer, for sure. Don't stress over whether or not your son has friends - focus on whether or not he is happy. Some people can be perfectly happy by themselves.

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

After our discussion he seemed pretty upbeat, although some of that might have been because I threw in the offer of a trip to gamestop to seal the deal . Once again I appreciate the advice offered, not only did it help me communicate with him better, but it was reassuring to actually talk to people who had been in the situation, and come through the other side. I did kind of have nightmares of my child being the withdrawn guy in the basement in his underwear playing warcraft on his computer 24/7 ;-)

Would that be so bad? I say there are worse things he could do. He could be out drinking/doing drugs, and having promiscuous sex with who-knows-who every night. He could be in a gang. The list goes on and on. You'll want him to be productive and establish some sort of career, but if he's obsessed with computer games, heck, the programmers who make these games get huge bucks for doing so. He could become one of those... and then, suddenly, his video game prowess becomes a very good thing!

One more story. Here's the coolest one of all. When I was 17, I got a job in the town where I lived in my worst years growing up. Along the way, I encountered three people who were in my graduating class from middle school. These people were always fence-walkers... they didn't pick on me but they also weren't friends of mine. We got talking over lunch one time, and we started going over "where are they now?" for our old classmates. Oh, the stories they told... "[this one] got pregnant at age 16, [this one] is on drugs, [this one] ended up in jail for grand theft auto, etc"... good grief, even the three of them were all chugging away on cigarettes as they talked... and then one of them said, to me, "You know, I guess you're the only one who didn't get screwed up!" Well whaddya know about that? The guy whom everyone picked on, was the only one who wasn't screwed up three years later! Chances are that there were some other kids who didn't get screwed up, but the point is that my tormentors got screwed up while I didn't. You know what they say about "he who laughs last".

[malamute]

What's very good -- the OP's son can talk to her about these problems. Having someone to talk to can mean so much. Someone who can help him analyze his approach and suggest better approaches -- and help him get the right extracurricular activities.

It can also be a good thing to have experienced social awkwardness. Many of the kids who go on to be the most successful actually were not the most popular in high school. Later in life you meet so many people who were not always super slick socially but experienced social awkwardness at one time or another.

[malamute]

The problem with encouraging your kid to fight back violently is that there are some schools and parts of the country where that can get your kid killed. My kids grew up in an area where gangs are very prevalent -- there are no one-on-one fist fights here. If a kid even tries something like that, he's going to get met up a large group that will have knives and at the very least will take him on as a group. They won't try to kill because they don't want the consequences but they will go for a punctured lung and serious injuries.

Only encouraging punching and fist fights if you live in a part of the country where the kids aren't potential criminals. My oldest ran into a problem once where he was injured -- in a bathroom where the gang types hung out -- and he admitted he lipped off to them which provoked a violent response, so I told him he needed to never utter a word and stay out of that bathroom. The schools will not address the gang problems other than have a policeman stationed in the school to break up violence after it's big or if a particular thug has injured enough kids then maybe alternative school for him.

[Ollie1946]

Disclosure: 3 sons (all adults now). Intact/traditional family. Stay at home mother. Me, dad, involved. WE STILL HAD ISSUES! Kids attended private schools, public schools and for several years were homeschooled due to circumstances living abroad. And we are also church folks.

You are battling the whole of our culture. You are battling an education system that is barely functional for the best students and non-functional for vast numbers. The "inmates" run the asylum in a sense. I don't see how school teachers stay in the profession more than 20 minutes. Bless'em. But you won't get any help there as you already know.

We also did the testing thing, counseling thing and in truth we prayed a LOT.

The son we had the most difficulty with was battling his own sexuality. We did not know that. A psychologist did not pick that out. We were mystified. Son would not discuss "stuff" with us. Self-isolated. I LOCKED AWAY ALL THE GUNS.

Other sons struggled with the friendship thing. Some ugly times. Not invited to birthday parties or other social events. Church was no help. Even youth leaders in churches pick and choose their favorites.

I could write pages (and have in my journal) about that part of our family life. I can only tell you that today, all 3 are functioning, sound adults. They are close to their parents. They are not particularly close to each other. They have no links to their past associations. They could care less about reunions and such. They have their own circle of friends now.

What happened? Time passed. Hormones settled down. Gay son understood and accepted completely.

I think it is worthwhile to try and have conversations with him. But you need to explain your position helping him to understand what you are going through. You have to take care of yourself first to survive this. It is survivable though it doesn't seem like it now.

I will suggest, however awful it sounds, to be alert for any signs of rage in him such that he does something bad to himself which is possible especially with social media. Also look for any tipoffs that he might want to do something to his peers at school. Sad to say, we live in those sort of times.

Every problem does not have a solution. I think most of the time that is true and no matter how much energy you pour into it, there will not be an answer other than the passing of time.

Growing up ain't easy. Rearing children is a nightmare at times.

Best to you.

[Vasily]

My two cents' worth as a former counselor … A good counselor who specializes in working with kids that age group will provide him with someone he can discuss his difficulties with, and help him work out and test strategies for improving his relationships with his peers. Speaking frankly, it sounds like you're too close to the problem and the temptation is to try and "fix" things for him. That's just a part of growing up, and you'd be surprised how many successful and popular people were awkward and socially inept at his age. It would help him to work with someone who can help him find ways to deal with his problems on his own, and who is impartial.

What I'd suggest doing is meeting with the school for a referral to a *male* counselor who can help your son work at building his social skills rather than looking for the school to "stop the bullying". The latter won't work and he may become "that kid whose mother made the school get us into trouble".

[Beejay24/7]

@Vasily, I'll check that out and see,it's definitely worth mentioning.

And Ollie "What happened? Time passed. Hormones settled down. ". I hope so, Oh God do I hope so.

Malamute, thank God we live in a relatively peaceful suburb. I've seen firsthand some of what you mentioned, which is why we moved from the city to a suburb when the kids were still little(unfortunately this is why I have to work two jobs,living here aint cheap)

Romani gypsy, I would literally have to emigrate to be with my family, and even then everyone has their own lives,so whatever help they would offer, and some would definitely try to help,but it would be limited by their own situations, and my situation would still be pretty much the same as it is now,except I would literally have to start all over jobwise. Like I said your experience has really helped give me some insight, my son does have a few kids that are friends outside the school, and this weekend, I invited one of them over, he brought his wii , stayed for hours and they had a blast.As for his concern about the kid he punched I guess it's partly because he liked the kid, even though the boy had picked on him for ages,plus at heart, my son isn't really the kind of kid that likes hurting people, it's just that like you, as you related , he was pushed to the limit

Honeycrisp, I did ask if he would be interested in going back to scouts , he was definitely not, martial arts he was so so about, and taking the advice here I focused more on what he told me he wanted

Looking at him today I'm glad that he is showing this resilience, when I was his age I would have brooded for ages, he was really upset when this happened and then by the next day he was back to baseline, I'm gearing up to talk to the principal, we'll see how it goes

[RomaniGypsy]

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

Malamute, thank God we live in a relatively peaceful suburb. I've seen firsthand some of what you mentioned, which is why we moved from the city to a suburb when the kids were still little(unfortunately this is why I have to work two jobs,living here aint cheap)

You haven't yet stated for the record whether you are, or are not, functionally a single parent... but even if you aren't, working two jobs is rough. My dad did that for 13 years while my mom was a stay-at-home mom and I know it wore on our family. He had to take the second job when I was 8 and my family moved to the more expensive rich-people town that was my private hell for six years. I don't know your exact situation, but is it possible that you'd serve your son better by living in an area or in a house where you could easily afford life on only one job, instead of two?

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

Romani gypsy, I would literally have to emigrate to be with my family, and even then everyone has their own lives,so whatever help they would offer, and some would definitely try to help,but it would be limited by their own situations, and my situation would still be pretty much the same as it is now,except I would literally have to start all over jobwise.

Hmmm.... I think you've got me there. If you and your son are the only people in your family who live in this country, moving to be near family would be very hard. However, you already said that your son doesn't want to move... so it's a non-issue anyway.

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

my son does have a few kids that are friends outside the school, and this weekend, I invited one of them over, he brought his wii , stayed for hours and they had a blast.

Sounds like me when I was his age. Almost all the time when I got together with friends, we played video games together... for the entire duration of the visit. Anything over which people can bond, even if it's something inane like video games, will strengthen a relationship.

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

As for his concern about the kid he punched I guess it's partly because he liked the kid, even though the boy had picked on him for ages

Interesting. I can't say I've ever experienced that. Anyone I ever punched due to any feelings of malice or desire to get revenge, I truly hated. I never regretted any punch I ever threw.

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

,plus at heart, my son isn't really the kind of kid that likes hurting people, it's just that like you, as you related , he was pushed to the limit

I never wanted to hurt people either. I did, however, want to get them off my back. Any time I ever beat on anyone, I wasn't looking to overcompensate for what they did to me... essentially I wanted to give them enough of a reason to shut up... and that was it. Had I known, by whatever means, exactly how much injury I had to deal to a person to get him to stop picking on me, I would have gone exactly that far and no further.

Originally Posted by Beejay24/7

Looking at him today I'm glad that he is showing this resilience, when I was his age I would have brooded for ages, he was really upset when this happened and then by the next day he was back to baseline, I'm gearing up to talk to the principal, we'll see how it goes

He's resilient because deep down, he WANTS his life to be positive... and, thankfully, he's still young enough to be blissfully ignorant of the harsh truths of the adult world. When I was his age, I was also very resilient. For example, I once counted that I had 36 different crushes over the four years when I was in middle school... not one of which resulted in a date or even reciprocation of the feelings... and yet I kept on pursuing women... "maybe THIS TIME it'll work out!". Enjoy his resilience while he shows it. I can only hope that he will retain it through his adult life. I know I haven't, even though some people think I am still unusually resilient. The pressures of being a logical person constantly having to try to conform in certain ways to a totally illogical world just to survive are enough to wear any such person down after a while.