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The notion that spanking lowers IQ's is ridiculous. How is it that this is a so-called proven fact, but any one of us can name any number of people who were spanked as children and grew up to be well adjusted, smart, and didn't end up in prison? A lot of criminals were ABUSED as children, not merely spanked. In fact, if some of them had parents who cared enough to spank them a little more, they may not have ended up in prison.
As far as the whole spanking issue goes, for some kids it's not necessary and some it is. Simple as that. Some kids will break down in tears over the "I'm so disappointed in you" look. Others will stand toe to toe with you, and push their limits as far as they can. For some kids, time outs are a joke. They will sit down for five minutes or whatever, then continue on with whatever misbehavior caused the time out in the first place. Other kids, that five minutes of solitude is torture. It depends on the child. It's up to every parent to decide what works for them, and it's not anybody's place to judge that parents decision unless their discipline crosses over into abuse. In the OP's situation, yes, his discipline had definitely crossed that line. But he was here asking for help. I think it took a lot for him to realize what he was doing was not right, and try to seek some alternatives. I think that he truly loved this child and wanted to do what was right for him. This wasn't coming from a cruel, hateful, or unloving person, albeit a bit ignorant, as we saw from his later posts. But instead he got finger points and accusations. The people that jumped all over him did nothing to help that little boy in that situation. People should try to be more understanding, and not so quick to criticize and judge.
The notion that spanking lowers IQ's is ridiculous. How is it that this is a so-called proven fact, but any one of us can name any number of people who were spanked as children and grew up to be well adjusted, smart, and didn't end up in prison? A lot of criminals were ABUSED as children, not merely spanked. In fact, if some of them had parents who cared enough to spank them a little more, they may not have ended up in prison.
As far as the whole spanking issue goes, for some kids it's not necessary and some it is. Simple as that. Some kids will break down in tears over the "I'm so disappointed in you" look. Others will stand toe to toe with you, and push their limits as far as they can. For some kids, time outs are a joke. They will sit down for five minutes or whatever, then continue on with whatever misbehavior caused the time out in the first place. Other kids, that five minutes of solitude is torture. It depends on the child. It's up to every parent to decide what works for them, and it's not anybody's place to judge that parents decision unless their discipline crosses over into abuse. In the OP's situation, yes, his discipline had definitely crossed that line. But he was here asking for help. I think it took a lot for him to realize what he was doing was not right, and try to seek some alternatives. I think that he truly loved this child and wanted to do what was right for him. This wasn't coming from a cruel, hateful, or unloving person, albeit a bit ignorant, as we saw from his later posts. But instead he got finger points and accusations. The people that jumped all over him did nothing to help that little boy in that situation. People should try to be more understanding, and not so quick to criticize and judge.
This is one of the best posts in the thread...I absolutely agree! How is it that so many people can ride the gentle, sweet, kind train...when it comes to a child and yet turn around and rip a poster to shreds, who has come here looking for guidance on how to be a better parent to a child? Look, either you really care about people or you don't. In this instance, size DOESN'T matter.
AnnaNomus, you are absolutely right about the difference in children. All kids do NOT respond to discipline in the same way. My gosh, I have 4 of them and every single one of those kids, all from the same 2 parents, raised essentially the same, required different types of discipline. I do not have 2 children who are at all alike and they each required their own individual styles and forms of discipline. I had a huge network of other parents and we traded stories and did a whole lot of secret sharing. One style does not fit all and unless you're abusing children, whether emotionally, verbally, or physically......you're doing just fine!
Hell, I'd rather take a beating than have to deal with some of the guilt trips and mental head games that some parents put their kids through. Some of those parents are the ones who push their kids to be ALL that they can be.....instead of just letting them be kids once in a while..it's all college prep, volunteer work constantly, because it looks great on a college application. We all have our own views of what abuse looks like...but I guess that's for another time and another thread!
The kooks do come out of the woodwork when you mention spanking a child. I'm sure some of them are trying hard to trace your info.
Some kids don't need spankings but some don't respond to anything else. Some kids bruise easier than others. That does not mean abuse. No, a child should not be spanked for every little infraction. But disrespect cannot be tolerated or the child will become a thug.
My dad was a school principal, "old school". He spanked hundreds of kids, all boys to my recollection. Former students would talk with him on the street and laugh about the spankings they got from him & thank him for the direction and discipline he gave them. If they had been traumatized, they would have never spoken to him again. Spanking in school is obsolete now and look at the lack of discipline in many schools. The kids practically run some of them. "The inmates running the prison".
My 4th grade teacher burned our hands up with a ruler when we misbehaved. She demanded the best from us and would not tolerate crap. How we hated her at the time, how we loved her later on. We left her class knowing our material well. BTW, she also bought lunches for many kids whose families were struggling.
The average inmate in the nation's correctional facilities is functionally illiterate, probably has a learning disability, never had a steady job, was a juvenile delinquent, used drugs and alcohol, and came from a dysfunctional home in which he or she was abused physically and/or sexually.
Despite the focus on white collar criminals, I would say even these do not have a high IQ. They did get caught.
Ummm... IQ is the capacity for learning - not actual knowledge itself. Someone with a high IQ can easily be illiterate and have most of the other problems you list. Having the capacity for something and having the opportunity for it are two different things.
Also, the "average" inmate is not the stereotype you portrayed above. The most common trait among inmates is impulsivity, they do things without thinking about right, or wrong or even consequences of the behavior.
Most of the young men I worked with in prison were from well to do homes, with educated parents. The kids got mixed up in drugs, which lead them to make mistakes. And while they all say they were abused...criminals will say anything that portrays them as victims to deflect and separate from their crimes. "I was abused, see me as a victim", rather than, "I am a person who robbed a store with a rifle".
The average inmate in the nation's correctional facilities is functionally illiterate, probably has a learning disability, never had a steady job, was a juvenile delinquent, used drugs and alcohol, and came from a dysfunctional home in which he or she was abused physically and/or sexually.
Despite the focus on white collar criminals, I would say even these do not have a high IQ. They did get caught.
Great internet reading. Shame that it's far from the truth. I love these so-called "studies" that simply prove the point of whoever is funding the study.
As far as the whole spanking issue goes, for some kids it's not necessary and some it is. Simple as that. Some kids will break down in tears over the "I'm so disappointed in you" look. Others will stand toe to toe with you, and push their limits as far as they can. For some kids, time outs are a joke. They will sit down for five minutes or whatever, then continue on with whatever misbehavior caused the time out in the first place. Other kids, that five minutes of solitude is torture. It depends on the child. It's up to every parent to decide what works for them, and it's not anybody's place to judge that parents decision unless their discipline crosses over into abuse.
That is exactly what I was trying to say a few pages ago. Especially the last line. I agree completely.
Great internet reading. Shame that it's far from the truth. I love these so-called "studies" that simply prove the point of whoever is funding the study.
^^Exactly right! It doesn't matter how cockamamie an idea is, if you want to find a so-called "study" to back up your theories, all you have to do is hit the Internet.
[quote=jasper12;19130998]Also, the "average" inmate is not the stereotype you portrayed above. The most common trait among inmates is impulsivity, they do things without thinking about right, or wrong or even consequences of the behavior.
Most of the young men I worked with in prison were from well to do homes, with educated parents. The kids got mixed up in drugs, which lead them to make mistakes. And while they all say they were abused...criminals will say anything that portrays them as victims to deflect and separate from their crimes. "I was abused, see me as a victim", rather than, "I am a person who robbed a store with a rifle".[/quote]
Exactly right! It's that "self-proclaimed" victim mentality that got them in with the wrong crowd to start with. As we've said before, you can have a slew of kids who were raised the same way and have ONE child who percieved the spanking that they received as a "beating" (that they didn't deserve), while the other kids got a spanking that "they darn well had coming". These same kids will ride that train, looking for attention and sympathy ...and eventually exucuses for why that spanking/beating was responsible for their anti-social behavior.
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