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i think the biggest reason is that central ohio is growing at 13%..thats significant,and when you look at the projections for the future..columbus will be the dominant city in ohio in our childrens future.cincinnati has done great to grow at 6% in the msa..dayton 54 miles away from cincinnati is in horrible decline,montgomery county..my goodness i dont think cincy would ever want that included in the csa.
i think the biggest reason is that central ohio is growing at 13%..thats significant,and when you look at the projections for the future..columbus will be the dominant city in ohio in our childrens future.cincinnati has done great to grow at 6% in the msa..dayton 54 miles away from cincinnati is in horrible decline,montgomery county..my goodness i dont think cincy would ever want that included in the csa.
Actually, Dayton, according to estimates, has been growing since 2009-2010. It didn't show up in the 2010 census because the losses 2000-2001 to 2008-2009 were more significant. Still, it's a turnaround and if it keeps up will definitely show up in the 2020 census. The 2011 estimate also had Cincinnati's rate of decline (for the city, not the metro which is growing) slowing significantly, so it's also possible that we may end up seeing Cincinnati growing by 2020 as well. It would be great for Ohio overall to show at least some of its cities growing again because having so many in decline is a big negative for public perception.
Considering that along I-75 between metro Cinti. and metro Dayton, it's hard to tell where one ends and the other begins. Many people live in one metro area and commute to the other. I would argue that Cinti. and Dayton are really one metro complex. So add another 800,000 or so to the Cincinnati total for Dayton and another 100,000 or so for the Hamilton/Middletown area SMSA (which lies between them both). Cleveland, much the same. Considering that Cleveland dominates Northeastern Ohio, looking at the stats, I'd place Akron and even Youngstown and Canton in a metro complex with Cleveland along with Lorain on the westside of Cleveland. Just my opinion of course, but Cleveland and Cincinnati both offer so much more in terms of attractions, culture, professional sports, diversified neighborhoods, etc., etc., that there's no contest in my mind. In the 3C competition Cleveland and Cincinnati are tied for first and Columbus is still bringing up the rear as a distant t(h)urd. I wonder what issues folks in Columbus are dealing with that it seems they're always posting numerical comparisons on City-forum to try and prove something. In the final analysis, the conversation comes down to, "well we're Columbus, and we've got OSU, the Short North and the Buckeyes". Bottom line is every other sizable city in this country has at least one interesting neighborhood, one notable educational institution and sports team to brag about. To all the folks insecure about Columbus' standing, I'd say that more than 20 miles away from the place no one gives a hoot. Trust me on this, I'm from upstate NY and about the only time you ever hear anything about central Ohio is if the Buffalo Bills draft someone from OSU, and even then it's one line in a small article on the last page of the Buffalo News sports section. As a transplant, it doesn't matter to me; 2.000 people or 2 million people in Columbus it still has been a major disappointment to me.
Continuous development, however, is not a requirement for metro combination. Consider NYC, Boston, Philly, etc are all basically connected by development (significantly moreso than Cincy-Dayto) and aren't all in a combined metro. There are other smaller examples all over the US. The standards also include commuting, etc, and at least through 2010, Cincy-Dayton didn't meet the requirements. It really doesn't matter what you think Columbus residents think or how Cincinnati/Dayton residents perceive things. It's based on hard numbers, not what anyone thinks or wishes. This is not to say it won't happen, just that it wasn't up to par the last time metros were figured. Maybe it will be in a few years, but we have all been hearing how they should be combined for years now and it just wasn't supportable, so who knows. The same is true for Cleveland-Akron, though in that case I think the argument is even weaker because the entire Cleveland metro is losing population, making overall intra-city commutes, etc even less likely over time. At least Cincy has a growing metro in its favor.
Funny, for the claim that people in Columbus and those "posting numerical comparisons", which no doubt is in reference to myself, are insecure, there are a whole lot of people who go into a defensive frenzy spewing insults left and right whenever Columbus even comes up in casual conversation. And clearly when you have media powerhouses like the NY Times regularly writing about your city and it's neighborhoods is clearly an indication that no one notices you 20 miles away. If Columbus is such an awful city no one knows or cares about, some of you spend an inordinate amount of time trying to sell that story. Apparently the consensus isn't exactly widespread.
Considering that along I-75 between metro Cinti. and metro Dayton, it's hard to tell where one ends and the other begins. Many people live in one metro area and commute to the other. I would argue that Cinti. and Dayton are really one metro complex. So add another 800,000 or so to the Cincinnati total for Dayton and another 100,000 or so for the Hamilton/Middletown area SMSA (which lies between them both). Cleveland, much the same. Considering that Cleveland dominates Northeastern Ohio, looking at the stats, I'd place Akron and even Youngstown and Canton in a metro complex with Cleveland along with Lorain on the westside of Cleveland. Just my opinion of course, but Cleveland and Cincinnati both offer so much more in terms of attractions, culture, professional sports, diversified neighborhoods, etc., etc., that there's no contest in my mind. In the 3C competition Cleveland and Cincinnati are tied for first and Columbus is still bringing up the rear as a distant t(h)urd. I wonder what issues folks in Columbus are dealing with that it seems they're always posting numerical comparisons on City-forum to try and prove something. In the final analysis, the conversation comes down to, "well we're Columbus, and we've got OSU, the Short North and the Buckeyes". Bottom line is every other sizable city in this country has at least one interesting neighborhood, one notable educational institution and sports team to brag about. To all the folks insecure about Columbus' standing, I'd say that more than 20 miles away from the place no one gives a hoot. Trust me on this, I'm from upstate NY and about the only time you ever hear anything about central Ohio is if the Buffalo Bills draft someone from OSU, and even then it's one line in a small article on the last page of the Buffalo News sports section. As a transplant, it doesn't matter to me; 2.000 people or 2 million people in Columbus it still has been a major disappointment to me.
Considering that along I-75 between metro Cinti. and metro Dayton, it's hard to tell where one ends and the other begins. Many people live in one metro area and commute to the other. I would argue that Cinti. and Dayton are really one metro complex. So add another 800,000 or so to the Cincinnati total for Dayton and another 100,000 or so for the Hamilton/Middletown area SMSA (which lies between them both). Cleveland, much the same. Considering that Cleveland dominates Northeastern Ohio, looking at the stats, I'd place Akron and even Youngstown and Canton in a metro complex with Cleveland along with Lorain on the westside of Cleveland. Just my opinion of course, but Cleveland and Cincinnati both offer so much more in terms of attractions, culture, professional sports, diversified neighborhoods, etc., etc., that there's no contest in my mind. In the 3C competition Cleveland and Cincinnati are tied for first and Columbus is still bringing up the rear as a distant t(h)urd. I wonder what issues folks in Columbus are dealing with that it seems they're always posting numerical comparisons on City-forum to try and prove something. In the final analysis, the conversation comes down to, "well we're Columbus, and we've got OSU, the Short North and the Buckeyes". Bottom line is every other sizable city in this country has at least one interesting neighborhood, one notable educational institution and sports team to brag about. To all the folks insecure about Columbus' standing, I'd say that more than 20 miles away from the place no one gives a hoot. Trust me on this, I'm from upstate NY and about the only time you ever hear anything about central Ohio is if the Buffalo Bills draft someone from OSU, and even then it's one line in a small article on the last page of the Buffalo News sports section. As a transplant, it doesn't matter to me; 2.000 people or 2 million people in Columbus it still has been a major disappointment to me.
^^ Kudos for an updated and accurate assessment of Ohio's "3-Cs." Not much need be added here that hasn't already been said before; no doubt your post will elicit numerous shedding of tears, gnashing of teeth, and attempts at rebuttal, but it is what it is... Nice job!
Funny, for the claim that people in Columbus and those "posting numerical comparisons", which no doubt is in reference to myself, are insecure, there are a whole lot of people who go into a defensive frenzy spewing insults left and right whenever Columbus even comes up in casual conversation. And clearly when you have media powerhouses like the NY Times regularly writing about your city and it's neighborhoods is clearly an indication that no one notices you 20 miles away. If Columbus is such an awful city no one knows or cares about, some of you spend an inordinate amount of time trying to sell that story. Apparently the consensus isn't exactly widespread.[/quote]
I have no problem with people saying whatever they want about Columbus, everyone's entitled to their opinion. I take solace in the fact that Columbus must be doing something right for Franklin County to be blowing away Cuyahoga County and Hamilton County in growth, and for the Columbus MSA and CSA to be doing the same. As it grows Columbus will only continue to get better.
Funny, for the claim that people in Columbus and those "posting numerical comparisons", which no doubt is in reference to myself, are insecure, there are a whole lot of people who go into a defensive frenzy spewing insults left and right whenever Columbus even comes up in casual conversation. And clearly when you have media powerhouses like the NY Times regularly writing about your city and it's neighborhoods is clearly an indication that no one notices you 20 miles away. If Columbus is such an awful city no one knows or cares about, some of you spend an inordinate amount of time trying to sell that story. Apparently the consensus isn't exactly widespread.
I have no problem with people saying whatever they want about Columbus, everyone's entitled to their opinion. I take solace in the fact that Columbus must be doing something right for Franklin County to be blowing away Cuyahoga County and Hamilton County in growth, and for the Columbus MSA and CSA to be doing the same. As it grows Columbus will only continue to get better.[/quote]
Not to offend, and trust me, I'm a Cbus fan, but I really think the main reason that Columbus has been doing a better economically in the last 20 years than Cleveland and Cincinnati is because the city's history is so different. Columbus did not experience anything even remotely close to the losses incurred by the other two cities losing steel and manufacturing jobs. Despite that, both Cincy and CLE are coming back pretty strong.
Not to offend, and trust me, I'm a Cbus fan, but I really think the main reason that Columbus has been doing a better economically in the last 20 years than Cleveland and Cincinnati is because the city's history is so different. Columbus did not experience anything even remotely close to the losses incurred by the other two cities losing steel and manufacturing jobs. Despite that, both Cincy and CLE are coming back pretty strong.[/quote]
I see this idea posted a lot and there are problems with it. First, Columbus did grow up initially with a lot of manufacturing. Just 12 years ago, the city had more than 100,000 manufacturing jobs, and the % to population was fairly significant earlier in its history just like it was with Cleveland and Cincinnati. People cite things like OSU as economic stabilizers, but OSU didn't even exist until 1870, more than 6 decades after its founding, and didn't become a serious university until the 1910s. After that, it was another 40 years to really become well-known. It wasn't overnight, and regardless, population grew before, during and after it came about at double-digit levels. It's success has occurred alongside Columbus', but was not the lone catalyst people make it out to be. Also, all of Columbus' F500 companies are homegrown. Nationwide, Big Lots, Cardinal Health, Limited Brands, and even AEP, which was founded nearby, moved to NYC years later and then moved back in the 1970s. These represent insurance, healthcare, fashion/retail and utilities. The amount of retail has created a ton of distribution capacity as well, a major player in why other smaller companies have moved there or expanded there. You also have Battelle, the largest private research company in the world. You have Wendy's, White Castle, Piada, Charley's Grilled Subs, Bob Evans, Max & Erma's, Donatos Pizza, etc, all based there, most, again, homegrown. Here's a list of just some of the companies based there: Category:Companies based in the Columbus, Ohio metropolitan area - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Almost none of these are based on government or education. They are private sector jobs that come from all types of industries. Manufacturing was important to the city during its development, but once that manufacturing began to decline in the US and state, other industries simply took its place over time. This didn't happen as much in Cleveland/Cincinnati and a large part of why they suffered longer and more often. Also, Mayor Sensenbrenner's decision in the 1950s to start an aggressive annexation policy kept the perception of growth going during the worst part of the urban "white flight" movement to the suburbs, creating a sense that the city was more successful during those years than it really was. This was a huge advantage that Cincinnati/Cleveland also couldn't take advantage of as, being founded 30 years earlier than Columbus, were already largely boxed in by their suburbs. Annexation is still used, but now at the smallest rate since the 1940s.
As far as current job growth goes, Columbus has seen the most jobs come back since the recession ended, the vast majority coming not from government, which has lost 22,000 jobs in the city since 2010, but from every other industry, particularly healthcare as literally every single major hospital is going through huge expansions. Nationwide Children's Hospital just became one of the largest pediatrics center in the nation, OSU is building a 21-story, $1.1 billion medical center, Riverside is adding a 10-story addition, etc. Healthcare jobs are up 25% in the last year alone. Columbus WAS little more than a college town at one time, but by then the seeds had already been planted to be something else. OSU and state government remain important, but the private sector has more than pulled its own weight in keeping the economy stable, something that too often is ignored in writing off Columbus' success.
I would also argue that only Cincinnati is seeing a real recovery out of the other two 3-Cs. It's at least gained jobs since the recession ended, something Cleveland has more or less not done yet, despite the resurgance of domestic manufacturing there.
Cinti is very conservative and boring. Enough said Cincinnati doesn't have enough culture to offer. This is the reason more ppl are choosing to relocate to other thriving cities. I like Columbus better and I live in Cinti....but relocating this year to a more thriving city and state
I can't imagine how anyone could consider Cincinnati a boring city. Not to be insulting, but do you just sit at home and do nothing? For the years I spent living in the 'Nati, time was my problem. There just was never enough of it to do or see all the things I wanted to. I'll tell you what, I'll make you a bet--- take a drive up to the lookout in Devou park in Covington on a clear day and just observe the beauty of Cincinnati and Covington from several hundred feet up. If that doesn't inspire you and take your breath away, then you should check your pulse for signs of life. No wonder Mark Twain proclaimed Cincinnati the "most beautiful inland city in America" over a century ago.
Thanks. In all these posts throughout the Ohio forum about which city is bigger, better, etc, I have not seen one reference to R. Buckminster Fuller, the early 20th Century visionary, inventor and philosopher. Fuller, while he was not busy inventing various "Dymaxion" devices, correctly predicted (in my opinion) that there would be two great "Megalopoli" in the eastern half of the United States. One would be "BosNyWash" which would encompass the corridor from Boston to Washington and the other would be "ChicaPitts", the entire Great Lakes basin from Chicago to Pittsburgh. As an aside, to all the proponents of the notion that Columbus is somehow special in any measure, I invite you to check out Toronto, Ontario. A clean, modern, cosmopolitan, very affluent world class city of several million people. I'm thinking it'll change your perspective a bit.
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Cincinnati doesn't have enough culture to offer. 
This is the reason more ppl are choosing to relocate to other thriving cities. I like Columbus better and I live in Cinti....but relocating this year to a more thriving city and state
