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We downsized after the kids went away to school and moved out.
We spend a lot of time on our screened porch which is on the back of our home. We love it ! In fact it was the main decision maker when we bought this home. It’s large and we have a full dining room table as well as sitting area out there.
Our lots are smaller here and the homes are closer together. We have no issue with that because one of our goals was to have a manageable lot size so we were not slaves to yard work.
We love our Neighbors and have great relationships with all of them.
A weekend evening/night often includes us having friends over. Grilling, dining and often playing games on our porch. It’s nothing crazy or obnoxious. But we do love to laugh and there is always a lot of that.
Early on our neighbor on one side commented that we can get really loud. I was immediately horrified that we were disturbing them! She assured me we weren’t. I let them know that they were welcome to come over and join us.
I pointedly invited them each time I knew we would be entertaining. They came twice. They sat and chatted but left pretty early. I continued to extend the invitations but after the first two times they joined us they would decline. Eventually I stopped inviting them.
We learned that they are pretty early to bed early to rise people. With this in mind and in an effort to not disturb them once the clock hits 10:00 we will move ourselves and our guests inside. 10:00 is our towns noise ordinance.
During Covid my daughter and son came home from college as most did because they closed the campus down. They made comment that they swear Mrs. Kravitz was peeking at them through the blinds.
I laughed it off because the idea was so preposterous.
Fast forward. Mrs. Kravitz in chatting has made comments that are weird. Some examples. She knows things about conversations my husband has had with his mother on the phone. Some on the porch, some inside. She has started up conversations with statements like “I saw you watch Survivor”.
She has unlocked our fence and walked into our yard and right up onto and in our porch and had conversations with us.
I take my morning coffee out on my porch and often in my pajamas and she has barged right in. Even after I have said “Mrs Kravitz I’m in my pajamas”. Her response is “oh it’s fine I don’t care about that”
Well I care!!!
In an effort to give us more privacy we have planted a number of trees and hedges along our fence.
We also have had opaque solar shades Installed on our porch. The only place we couldn’t place a shade was on the screen door of the porch due to space and weight constraints.
Mrs. Kravitz has now figured out exactly where to stand along the fence where there is a break in the hedge and an angle where she can look into our porch through the screen door.
My husband and I have started joking “May Day ,May Day the eagle has landed. Do not make eye contact, I repeat , do not make eye contact.”
But honestly it has become and issue.
We have placed a lock on our gate that requires a key to open.
Yesterday I came home and pulled into my garage. Before I could even get out of my car she was standing inside my garage “needing to talk to me”
I understand that living on smaller lots affords one less privacy. Our first home was of this nature and yet we never ever have experienced anything like this.
We have made comments in the nature of
“we really enjoy our alone time out on the porch.”
“When the shades are down , no one should come round”
We really are at a loss. They are nice people.
Looking for suggestions on how one might remedy this without hurting anyone’s feelings.
My first thought is to be completely direct with her.
As in : "I am sorry and I am not trying to be rude but when I say I am in my pajamas its because I don't want to be seen in my pajamas because it makes me uncomfortable"
Or simply
" hey sorry its just not a good time and I can't talk right now"
As far as the peeking through the blinds and her noting private information, well thats just wrong!
I don't know anyway around that other than moving. I am not sure you could confront her with that because it is a speculation on your part.
However next time she mentions something precise like a phone conversation or TV show , I would point blank say:
" how are you aware of my phone conversations?"
Or
"how do you know we like Survivor, as I am positive its information we haven't shared with you?"
If doing these things doesn't make her self conscience of her actions or stop them, then I would begin to wonder if perhaps she has some challenges with social norms.
The reason Mrs. Kravitz is a stereotype is because there are so many of them! Lonely, curious people whose age is causing them to feel out of the loop in the fast-changing social world. Sounds like you have gone the extra mile in dealing with this in a neighborly way.
I remember many of them in our life. The one who came over in the spring to give me flowers to plant along the west side of the house under the kitchen window so she'd have an excuse to stand outside "checking on her flowers" every day. The widow who announced with outrage that she'd seen partying college boys relieving themselves on the yard across the street at 2:00 in the morning. The very proper neighbor across the alley, who asked to be addressed as Mrs. rather than her first name, who I saw in a bathrobe and curlers on her hands and knees in the bushes by the neighbor's deck one night when I got up to visit the bathroom. (I guess in that case I must have been her Mrs. Kravitz.)
A certain amount of looking out to see what's going on might be the norm with homeowners. But for some people whose lives lack fulfilment maybe it gets to be a compulsion.
You sound compassionate and frustrated. That's how I felt, too. And puzzled. What's the solution?
Never did get that figured out but I learned to be very direct, yet polite, when we were being inconvenienced. Maybe they are just like the folks who, when you start looking at your watch, just don't get the hint. But I think it feels more compulsive and a little spooky to us when we know we are being watched and listened to.
I don't think that's the intention, though. We aren't suppose to know they are there or mention it. And that complicates the game of "spy."
Are they "sick" or desperately lonely? I don't know. What I can say is that after many different neighbors over the years this has been one of the smaller irritations we've had and it went from being a subject of persistent problem to a subject of humor. I've never encountered one who was dangerous.
It could be that her harassing behavior is retaliation for your noisy porch parties.
If your porch is close to her windows then she can probably hear every word of your conversations inside her house and finds it intrusive, so maybe feels you deserve the same.
Not saying you are not within your rights to entertain on your porch or excusing her coming onto your property uninvited, but maybe put yourself in her shoes for a minute.
I once had close by neighbors who invited people over for outdoor get-togethers that lasted hours. The decibel level of 4 or 5 adults + a few kids (+ alcohol) was loud enough to disburb me inside the house with the windows closed. I would not have minded if it were just once in a while, but this was 4 or 5 nights a week, every week year round. They also had a habit of making long phone calls outside, I got to know more about their personal business than I wanted. I am not sure they were aware of how much I and other neighbors could hear.
Patios and porches are nice but the truth is voices carry and in closer living situations your neighbors are involuntary guests at your porch parties.
It could be that her harassing behavior is retaliation for your noisy porch parties.
If your porch is close to her windows then she can probably hear every word of your conversations inside her house and finds it intrusive, so maybe feels you deserve the same.
.
IMO, it sounds like the OP has handled this beautifully. See the quote below:
We love our Neighbors and have great relationships with all of them.
A weekend evening/night often includes us having friends over. Grilling, dining and often playing games on our porch. It’s nothing crazy or obnoxious. But we do love to laugh and there is always a lot of that.
Early on our neighbor on one side commented that we can get really loud. I was immediately horrified that we were disturbing them! She assured me we weren’t. I let them know that they were welcome to come over and join us.
I pointedly invited them each time I knew we would be entertaining. They came twice. They sat and chatted but left pretty early. I continued to extend the invitations but after the first two times they joined us they would decline. Eventually I stopped inviting them.
We learned that they are pretty early to bed early to rise people. With this in mind and in an effort to not disturb them once the clock hits 10:00 we will move ourselves and our guests inside. 10:00 is our towns noise ordinance.
The reason Mrs. Kravitz is a stereotype is because there are so many of them! Lonely, curious people whose age is causing them to feel out of the loop in the fast-changing social world. Sounds like you have gone the extra mile in dealing with this in a neighborly way.
I remember many of them in our life. The one who came over in the spring to give me flowers to plant along the west side of the house under the kitchen window so she'd have an excuse to stand outside "checking on her flowers" every day. The widow who announced with outrage that she'd seen partying college boys relieving themselves on the yard across the street at 2:00 in the morning. The very proper neighbor across the alley, who asked to be addressed as Mrs. rather than her first name, who I saw in a bathrobe and curlers on her hands and knees in the bushes by the neighbor's deck one night when I got up to visit the bathroom. (I guess in that case I must have been her Mrs. Kravitz.)
A certain amount of looking out to see what's going on might be the norm with homeowners. But for some people whose lives lack fulfilment maybe it gets to be a compulsion.
You sound compassionate and frustrated. That's how I felt, too. And puzzled. What's the solution?
Never did get that figured out but I learned to be very direct, yet polite, when we were being inconvenienced. Maybe they are just like the folks who, when you start looking at your watch, just don't get the hint. But I think it feels more compulsive and a little spooky to us when we know we are being watched and listened to.
I don't think that's the intention, though. We aren't suppose to know they are there or mention it. And that complicates the game of "spy."
Are they "sick" or desperately lonely? I don't know. What I can say is that after many different neighbors over the years this has been one of the smaller irritations we've had and it went from being a subject of persistent problem to a subject of humor. I've never encountered one who was dangerous.
Oh my goodness! What was she looking at? That's hilarious! You could've opened the window and said, "HI!" really loudly-haha. On second thought, you probably just shook your head, like "well just look at Mrs. Proper now"! LOL
IMO, it sounds like the OP has handled this beautifully. See the quote below:
We love our Neighbors and have great relationships with all of them.
A weekend evening/night often includes us having friends over. Grilling, dining and often playing games on our porch. It’s nothing crazy or obnoxious. But we do love to laugh and there is always a lot of that.
Early on our neighbor on one side commented that we can get really loud. I was immediately horrified that we were disturbing them! She assured me we weren’t. I let them know that they were welcome to come over and join us.
I pointedly invited them each time I knew we would be entertaining. They came twice. They sat and chatted but left pretty early. I continued to extend the invitations but after the first two times they joined us they would decline. Eventually I stopped inviting them.
We learned that they are pretty early to bed early to rise people. With this in mind and in an effort to not disturb them once the clock hits 10:00 we will move ourselves and our guests inside. 10:00 is our towns noise ordinance.
It could still be 4 or 5 hours of loud outdoor partying a couple of days a week, every week.
That can be annoying if one is trying to enjoy a quiet evening at home reading or watching tv with a constant backdrop of loud neighbors. It depends on the acoustics, but where I lived with this issue it really did sound loud enough that it seemed like the neighbors were in my living room with me. I could hear everything and sometimes was tempted, like "Mrs. Kravitz" to go over there and comment the subject of their conversation, but I didn't.
We downsized after the kids went away to school and moved out.
We spend a lot of time on our screened porch which is on the back of our home. We love it ! In fact it was the main decision maker when we bought this home. It’s large and we have a full dining room table as well as sitting area out there.
Our lots are smaller here and the homes are closer together. We have no issue with that because one of our goals was to have a manageable lot size so we were not slaves to yard work.
We love our Neighbors and have great relationships with all of them.
A weekend evening/night often includes us having friends over. Grilling, dining and often playing games on our porch. It’s nothing crazy or obnoxious. But we do love to laugh and there is always a lot of that.
Early on our neighbor on one side commented that we can get really loud. I was immediately horrified that we were disturbing them! She assured me we weren’t. I let them know that they were welcome to come over and join us.
I pointedly invited them each time I knew we would be entertaining. They came twice. They sat and chatted but left pretty early. I continued to extend the invitations but after the first two times they joined us they would decline. Eventually I stopped inviting them.
We learned that they are pretty early to bed early to rise people. With this in mind and in an effort to not disturb them once the clock hits 10:00 we will move ourselves and our guests inside. 10:00 is our towns noise ordinance.
During Covid my daughter and son came home from college as most did because they closed the campus down. They made comment that they swear Mrs. Kravitz was peeking at them through the blinds.
I laughed it off because the idea was so preposterous.
Fast forward. Mrs. Kravitz in chatting has made comments that are weird. Some examples. She knows things about conversations my husband has had with his mother on the phone. Some on the porch, some inside. She has started up conversations with statements like “I saw you watch Survivor”.
She has unlocked our fence and walked into our yard and right up onto and in our porch and had conversations with us.
I take my morning coffee out on my porch and often in my pajamas and she has barged right in. Even after I have said “Mrs Kravitz I’m in my pajamas”. Her response is “oh it’s fine I don’t care about that”
Well I care!!!
In an effort to give us more privacy we have planted a number of trees and hedges along our fence.
We also have had opaque solar shades Installed on our porch. The only place we couldn’t place a shade was on the screen door of the porch due to space and weight constraints.
Mrs. Kravitz has now figured out exactly where to stand along the fence where there is a break in the hedge and an angle where she can look into our porch through the screen door.
My husband and I have started joking “May Day ,May Day the eagle has landed. Do not make eye contact, I repeat , do not make eye contact.”
But honestly it has become and issue.
We have placed a lock on our gate that requires a key to open.
Yesterday I came home and pulled into my garage. Before I could even get out of my car she was standing inside my garage “needing to talk to me”
I understand that living on smaller lots affords one less privacy. Our first home was of this nature and yet we never ever have experienced anything like this.
We have made comments in the nature of
“we really enjoy our alone time out on the porch.”
“When the shades are down , no one should come round”
We really are at a loss. They are nice people.
Looking for suggestions on how one might remedy this without hurting anyone’s feelings.
How close are your houses? Your daughter thought the neighbor was standing outside their window peeking in, or the neighbor was in her house and peeking from over at her house? That's pretty weird.
You have gone way above and beyond to curtail this neighbor to no avail. She just continues to work around your preventative measures. You're going to have to just talk to her bluntly and lay it all out. Tell her exactly what you expect and what you no longer want. You can be really nice about it, but you have to make sure she gets what you're saying. Don't apologize either.
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