Why is Maine a poor state? (Lewiston, Bangor: new house, taxes, live in)

[Submariner]

Originally Posted by JoulesMSU

One of the big things that I have noticed (having just moved here recently) is the lack of connection with Quebec. It's not very easy to get to Quebec City or Montreal. These two major cities that could facilitate a lot of trade (or at the vest least, tourists) are only accessible via highway if you drive through Vermont!

This is completely ridiculous when you consider that Quebec City has over 500,000 people, nearly half of Maine's population, and Montreal has MORE people than Maine does. That is a lot of people who live nearby but don't have easy access to this state, and most likely spend their time (and money) in Vermont or upstate New York instead.

A highway from Montreal to Augusta and another from Quebec City to Newport would be a huge boon. Heck, add another one from Saint John, New Brunswick to Bangor as well and it would really make the state more accessible to its neighbors.



I'm from Michigan, where we also border Canada, although not much. There's a huge body of water between us and Ontario for the most part. However, where you can cross on land, we made sure to make it possible - you can go across from either downtown Detroit or the Flint/Port Huron area. Additionally, there is a highway that goes straight up to Sault Ste. Marie in the Upper Peninsula, which is another border city. These are literally the only points to cross from, but they are all covered via highways to make it easy to get to.

So it's very odd that Maine is surrounded by Canada, and yet only has 1 major entry point on land (in Houlton). Quebec is a huge providence with lots of people and resources... and it's like you are trying to ignore that they are there!

I can see that.

I always wondered why it is that Rt 201 from Jackman going toward Saint Georges and Quebec, then when your so close to Canada you could spit across the border, it makes that sudden left turn to go through NH, and then through Vermont. 50 miles South, before doing a U-turn back up along the Canadian border back up to near Jackman again before proceeding to Quebec.

If Rt 201 only went straight, from Jackman to Saint Georges, you could cut off over 100 mile of driving. No need to go through NH and Vermont at all.

Mainers seem pretty dumb when you look at it that way.

Does anyone know why there are no roads connecting Maine to Canada?



You would think that roads like Rt27 out of Eustus, or Rt 201 out of Jackman, or Saint Juste road from Allagash Lake, or Blanchete road, or any of the other dozen roads that cross between Maine and Canada, before you get to Big Twenty Township. Any of those roads coudl be handy, instead of routing traffic down South through two other states.
[/sarcasm]




Maps show a bunch of crossings. No map shows any invisible route from Maine South through two states to get to Canada.

I suggest you look at a 'map'. Cool things that show roads.

[Richard102938]

Originally Posted by Submariner

Some would argue that the only road to 'progress' it so first borrow money [at interest] so we can double taxes, and then pave over all of that nasty forest, bring high-rise condos, shopping malls, casinos and meth-labs in, pack them as tight as possible. Yeah that should fix Maine's problems.

Gotta deal with that growing forest land somehow, Agent Orange might help.

Some would argue that we should have no industry in Maine and it should be "preserved" as a highly restricted park for wealthy people from away, leaving a few poor farmers for people to gawk at while driving by in their Volvo's and the rest of the people from Maine should be herded into a few cities or preferably deported from the state itself.


Now that we have the extreme's out of the way, can we come back to earth now?

[cebdark]

IMHO, until we take reviving industry seriously (like buying locally whenever possible) and we are willing to pay a little more for it, nothing will change. If "small business is the backbone of the economy" is true, then we're only screwing ourselves over.

We can talk until we're blue in the face, and that's all talk will get us - blue in the face.

[IHeartMaine]

One thing that I notice about Maine is that there is still a TRUE middle class here!

There are the career MaineCare/welfare recipients (and I do apologize to those truly in need and have used these services)

There are the wealthy part-timers (summer people)

And then there are the rest of us..........from low-middle to upper middle class........workers, small business owners and retirees that while struggling at times.........can still live comfortably, own a home and land, and go to bed at night feeling mostly secure about the next day.

[flycessna]

Originally Posted by Submariner

I can see that.

I always wondered why it is that Rt 201 from Jackman going toward Saint Georges and Quebec, then when your so close to Canada you could spit across the border, it makes that sudden left turn to go through NH, and then through Vermont. 50 miles South, before doing a U-turn back up along the Canadian border back up to near Jackman again before proceeding to Quebec.

If Rt 201 only went straight, from Jackman to Saint Georges, you could cut off over 100 mile of driving. No need to go through NH and Vermont at all.

Mainers seem pretty dumb when you look at it that way.

Does anyone know why there are no roads connecting Maine to Canada?



You would think that roads like Rt27 out of Eustus, or Rt 201 out of Jackman, or Saint Juste road from Allagash Lake, or Blanchete road, or any of the other dozen roads that cross between Maine and Canada, before you get to Big Twenty Township. Any of those roads coudl be handy, instead of routing traffic down South through two other states.
[/sarcasm]




Maps show a bunch of crossings. No map shows any invisible route from Maine South through two states to get to Canada.

I suggest you look at a 'map'. Cool things that show roads.

I am very confused by your post Sub. Are you saying there is no direct way to get to Quebec? or something else?

I have driven to Quebec city numerous times via 201 through Jackman and have found it to be pretty easy and straight

From "MY" home (door to door) to the old part of Quebec is 278 miles... that includes getting out of the downtown area of my home(south Portland) and then traversing the downtown area of Quebec..

As a crow flies its 227 miles.. I don't think that is so bad considering our geography and we are talking about two major cities! but again maybe I am missing something..

Also, I have to throw this out there... but right now we have a Pipe line running north into Canada that we have been pumping oil through for decades but now because of a proposed oil sands venture in which the tar sands oil from Canada can be piped down the environmentalist are going crazy.. Generally if you look at something in Maine and wonder why this or that has not been done this is usually why.. its not that no one has thought about it or that we are backwards, its we have a difficult time moving forward with industry and therefore remain relatively poor!

[Submariner]

Originally Posted by flycessna

I am very confused by your post Sub. Are you saying there is no direct way to get to Quebec? or something else?

I meant that as sarcasm. I apologize that it was not readily seen as such.

A previous poster had said that there were no roads between Maine and Canada. That a Maine had to drive down to Vermont before they could get into Canada.

So I listed a few of the roads that cross into Canada.

Sorry about the confusion.

[JoulesMSU]

Originally Posted by Submariner

I meant that as sarcasm. I apologize that it was not readily seen as such.

A previous poster had said that there were no roads between Maine and Canada. That a Maine had to drive down to Vermont before they could get into Canada.

So I listed a few of the roads that cross into Canada.

Sorry about the confusion.

I clearly said "highway". Back roads with 55 mph or lower speed limits and stop signs/lights are not ideal to travel on, especially for long distances. People prefer to take highways where they can go ~70 mph and never have to stop. That option is not possible if you want to go from Maine to Quebec (unless you want to drive through Vermont).

And it makes absolutely no sense that there is not a direct highway considering how big and populous Quebec is.

I mean, just pretend you live in Quebec City for a second. Would you rather spend hours driving on a 1-lane back road to get to a vacation destination, or take the highway the whole way? I'd want to take the highway... so I would go visit Vermont instead of Maine. I postulate that is what happens more often than not; Quebecois go to Vermont instead. Maybe I can find some tourist data to see if I'm right or not.

[Submariner]

Originally Posted by JoulesMSU

... Back roads with 55 mph or lower speed limits and stop signs/lights are not ideal to travel on,

I prefer them when it makes for a shorter distance to travel.

[flycessna]

Originally Posted by Submariner

I meant that as sarcasm. I apologize that it was not readily seen as such.

A previous poster had said that there were no roads between Maine and Canada. That a Maine had to drive down to Vermont before they could get into Canada.

So I listed a few of the roads that cross into Canada.

Sorry about the confusion.

My apologies for not reading the entire thread. I can understand your sarcasm

[arctichomesteader]

Originally Posted by Submariner

I meant that as sarcasm. I apologize that it was not readily seen as such.

A previous poster had said that there were no roads between Maine and Canada. That a Maine had to drive down to Vermont before they could get into Canada.

So I listed a few of the roads that cross into Canada.

Sorry about the confusion.

As part of our statehood deal, when we traded our status as an independent republic for a state in these united states, Vermont forbade the construction of any roads to Canada from Maine. Those roads you mentioned will simply have to be shut down so traffic can be routed through Vermont first. (sarcasm alert).