[tijlover]

Originally Posted by LasVegasPlayer

Getting public funding is a huge underdog. Keep in mind that the family trying to bring the Raiders here also owns R-J that they are using as a mouthpiece for the agenda so this time around it is getting more noise than usual.

When I see the big push for a domed stadium, I see Adelson/R-J behind it. Adelson may know very well that the Raiders will never relocate here, but he wants that stadium built, and he plans to only chip in some $400 million, leaving $700 million coming from the tourists.

With all his money, Adelson can well afford to build that stadium with his own money, without subsidies, and slap his name on it!

First things first! Get that light rail line built between McCarran and downtown, projected to cost only $600 million!

[yellowsnow]

Can you even imagine what it would cost to air condition that stadium?

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by yellowsnow

Can you even imagine what it would cost to air condition that stadium?

good point, but there are other stadiums with hot hot falls and they manage to pay the A/C bill. I don't know why, it just seems strange to think of a pro team in Vegas.

[Jukesgrrl]

Originally Posted by yellowsnow

Can you even imagine what it would cost to air condition that stadium?

Phoenix air conditions its baseball field downtown, its basketball arena downtown, and its football stadium in Glendale. It's doable. The University of Phoenix Stadium is a member of the United States Green Building Council (USGBC). Lights and video displays are all LCD. The facility was built at a cost of $455 million (2006 dollars) — $395.4 million for the stadium, $41.7 million for site improvements, and $17.8 million for the land. Contributors to the stadium included the Arizona Sports and Stadium Authority ($302.3 million), the Arizona Cardinals football team ($143.2 million), and the City of Glendale ($9.5 million). It has 88 luxury boxes and room for more to be added later.

Anyone who's worried about gang members going to Raiders games needs to think again. Tickets are cheap in Oakland because they have, hands down, the worst stadium in the NFL. It's in terrible shape and it is not built around corporate boxes as new stadia all are. Tickets at a brand new stadium would be priced very differently.

As for gang members favoring Raiders gear, they favor Pittsburgh gear, too. Why? Because hip hop people and rappers like black clothes probably. Yet in years of going to games at PNC Park, I never saw any groups there I would peg as gang members.

Snoop Dogg is constantly photographed in Steelers and Pirates clothing. I even saw him in a Penguins hockey jersey once. Meanwhile he has a house in Vegas, doesn't he? His son goes to high school in LV. He definitely doesn't hang in Pittsburgh regularly.

[oeccscclhjhn]

Another let's turn las vegas into cali fornia bright idea. I would never vote for this. And I never say never.

[beachhead]

When is the last time you saw a business move it's direct operations into a smaller market, and be successful at it? The Rams tried it, moving from L.A. area (18 million population) to St. Louis (2.2 million) and we know how that worked out. The Raiders are in similar circumstance: Bay Area (7 million) vs. Las Vegas (2 million). Not to mention the disposable income gap between the two cities. How many normal Las Vegas citizens are going to be able to pay the $300 plus per game ticket price to go to a game? Heck, after the first season or two, once the glow wears off, the Rams will hardly ever sell out their fancy new stadium, so how do the Raiders expect Las Vegas to do the same? And without a sold out game, the tv is blacked out, so the tv revenue isn't attractive either.

It just doesn't make sense for the Raiders to move here. While I concede that often what the Raiders do makes little sense, but I really think Las Vegas is just being used as leverage, and that when push comes to shove...they aren't moving here.

[newopty]

The population of Las Vegas and the affluence of its residents is probably somewhat deceiving when considering a sports franchise. A Las Vegas franchise will have a different fan base than any other city. Many of the seats will be filled with fans from the opposing team or tickets comped by casinos. An NHL or NFL franchise will be another reason for people to visit Las Vegas. There are many teams in the NFL that have a fan base that travels to their games. There would be an extra incentive to travel to a game in Vegas.

It does bring into question the home field advantage for a Vegas team.

[C_A_Braun]

Originally Posted by robr2

Raiders gear was adopted by gangs when they were in LA but the people attending the games aren't gang members. The Raider fan is stereotyped as a loud drunkard more interested in creating trouble than watching the game. But eliminating that type of fan and behavior has been a focus of Raider management for years. They know that the ones that pay $250 for a ticket on top of $50 for parking don't want to be harassed by some drunk. They toss people out and cancel season tickets all the time.

As I said, I have no idea what goes on in Oakland. I can tell you though that I went to 2 Raiders games in L.A. One in 84 and the the other in 93. The "clientele" at the 93 game was VASTLY different from that in 84 and NOT for the better.

[tridentsx]

Originally Posted by beachhead

When is the last time you saw a business move it's direct operations into a smaller market, and be successful at it? The Rams tried it, moving from L.A. area (18 million population) to St. Louis (2.2 million) and we know how that worked out. The Raiders are in similar circumstance: Bay Area (7 million) vs. Las Vegas (2 million). Not to mention the disposable income gap between the two cities. How many normal Las Vegas citizens are going to be able to pay the $300 plus per game ticket price to go to a game? Heck, after the first season or two, once the glow wears off, the Rams will hardly ever sell out their fancy new stadium, so how do the Raiders expect Las Vegas to do the same? And without a sold out game, the tv is blacked out, so the tv revenue isn't attractive either.

It just doesn't make sense for the Raiders to move here. While I concede that often what the Raiders do makes little sense, but I really think Las Vegas is just being used as leverage, and that when push comes to shove...they aren't moving here.

I think you are underestimating the number of away fans that would like to fly into Las Vegas for a weekend of sin and then round off the weekend with an afternoon game. I don't think they would have any problems filling that stadium if there was a pro football team in LV.

[beachhead]

Originally Posted by tridentsx

I think you are underestimating the number of away fans that would like to fly into Las Vegas for a weekend of sin and then round off the weekend with an afternoon game. I don't think they would have any problems filling that stadium if there was a pro football team in LV.

I agree that there would be some "bounce" from the visiting team fans, even from locals, but you're not going to have a Green Bay or New England level opponent every week. Who's in the Raiders division? San Diego, Kansas City, and the Broncos. I believe San Diego has a tough time selling out it's home games, so even with the easy drive, probably not going to be the sell out crowd. I'm sure some KC fans would take the trip, along with the Denver ones. But I just can't see "sell out" from those three guaranteed games every year. Then, the rest of the schedule is based off of your success. Recent history doesn't give the Raiders too much hope there either. Think Jacksonville or Cleveland games are going to be big draws?

Now, if they were proposing a 35,000 seat stadium, with more exclusive luxury boxes, where it was very difficult to get tickets and prices were higher, it might work. But, the locals aren't going to be able to pay 500/seat.

It just doesn't seem to be a good move, to me. But then again, I'm not an NFL owner/executive either, so my guess is as good as anyone else's... I'll just stick with the "leverage" thought on this one..