[RisingSun333]

I am considering the possibility of relocating to Las Vegas sometime next year. I've visited Vegas many times and I already know much about the visitor's Vegas (shows and restautarants on the strip), and moving to Vegas sounded like a dream plan (until I learned more about it on this wonderful forum). Reading some threads, I had an impression that most people living in Vegas actually do not even go where the tourists (strips) are except for some occasions when they have visitors from outside. Some people even say cultures are non-existent in Vegas. I remember reading some guidebook on moving to Vegas, where they say Vegas is filled with transient people and it's very hard and almost impossible to find other people for long-term friendship or relationship (is that true?) Phoenix is the other possibility (for my relocation) at this point. Would you kindly give me some persuading reasons why I should move to Vegas (as opposed to Phoenix) or to Phoenix (as opposed to Vegas). Thank you very very much!

[Lola Granola]

Check out this thread on why others chose LV.

https://www.city-data.com/forum/las-v...las-vegas.html

We do enjoy going to the Strip once or twice a month, and we do like to catch a show occasionally. We also enjoy hiking at Red Rock Canyon and Mt Charleston. There's a huge amount of things to do, even off the strip. I've found the people to be friendly, and even though we've been here only a few months, we've been invited to people's homes... I've found it to be a much friendlier place than the mid-western cities that I came from.

What you should do is make a list of the things you like to do, what types of things you want in a city, what type of weather you'd like, etc. List as many things as you can (traffic, political, social, religious, career, costs) about your "perfect" place, without even thinking about specific cities. Also make a list of negatives, and what would rule out a city absolutely. Keep in mind, all cities have crime, but not all cities are Detroit, Atlanta, or Camden. Some negatives are simply a part of a large population, and the only way to mitigate those problems is to choose a smaller city. Also, you want to focus on attributes that will differentiate between cities. Pros or cons that are common to all cities won't help you choose between cities. When you have your lists, start investigating cities and see which ones are the best matches.

[olecapt]

Both are large Southwestern cities.

Crime is similar.

Schools are similar

Home costs are similar. Both RE markets are similar (and stink)

Phoenix is a little more congested.

Phoenix is hotter. Nice in the winter bad in the summer.

Techies should go to Phoenix. Relatively Vegas is a no show.

Service workers should go to Vegas...nothing beats the service worker mecca.

Few Vegans make heavy use of the strip. It is our factory zone. You work there not play there.

"Transient Las Vegas" appears to be an urban myth. Many come few leave. Statistics suggest normal big city turnover.

The Phoenix forum is at least as unfriendly to Phoenix as the Vegas Forum is to Vegas. It is customary.

[Greatday]

Quality of life issues need to be considered:

Far more educational choices in Phoenix - FAR MORE

More cultural opportunities - from Performing Arts venues, to Museums, to Libraries, to Zoos, to Parks to .......

Housing prices tend to be about the same as Capt mentioned but, there are more Planned communites -

Shopping is far superior to Las Vegas -

Recreational opportunities, proximate to Phoenix, are far superior to LV

While more congrested (almost 5 million people), there is a tremendous freeway system with 3 beltways and another one under development

Hotter in summer? Yes. Usually 5 to 8 degrees warmer than LV. But, the other 9 months are "Chamber of Commerece" type -

[jfkIII]

Not sure what the current MONTHLY numbers are (due to housing situtation) but during the boom years, it was something like 6000 new residents in, 3000 out....thats a net change of 9000 per month that either were there last month and are gone, or weren't there last month and are now living there. I'm sure Olecapt has current stats.

As you can imagine, it's tough to get too involved with neighbors, co-workers, friends from church and others, when they may be gone next month, or next year. One other thing that one of my brother's friends mentioned to me...he said that LV is not a good sports town. To this, I was totally surprised, as I was thinking that Vegas has all the legal sports books and gambling and such. He said that because so many people, come from so many other areas, everyone roots for their "home" team where they came from...or whoever they placed a sports bet on.

Good luck on your choice...it's great to see someone actually doing their homework before they move their with vacation goggles still on and realize that resident Vegas is not like vacation Vegas!

[Greatday]

Ah - I did forget about the sports differences?

Phoenix is the spring training capital for MLB - Almost every team is here with major facilties

Pro Sports: Baseball, Football, Basketball, Hockey

Collegiate Sports

If you like sports - Phoenix has it all over LV

[ParkTwain]

Originally Posted by Greatday

Quality of life issues need to be considered:

Far more educational choices in Phoenix - FAR MORE

More cultural opportunities - from Performing Arts venues, to Museums, to Libraries, to Zoos, to Parks to .......

Housing prices tend to be about the same as Capt mentioned but, there are more Planned communites -

Shopping is far superior to Las Vegas -

Recreational opportunities, proximate to Phoenix, are far superior to LV

While more congrested (almost 5 million people), there is a tremendous freeway system with 3 beltways and another one under development

Hotter in summer? Yes. Usually 5 to 8 degrees warmer than LV. But, the other 9 months are "Chamber of Commerece" type -

Why do you say the shopping is better in Phoenix? Wouldn't agree off the top of my head. There is MORE shopping in more places (reflecting that there are more people), not better shopping, in Phoenix.

Outdoor recreation around LV is probably better than around Phoenix, but the two are somewhat comparable (Ariz. has several national parks, forest, etc.). The Spring Mtns west of LV offer a very large number of trails and sights. We have Lake Mead and lower Colorado River, proximity to so. Utah and Grand Canyon (esp. North Rim), proximity to Death Valley and its fantastic sights.

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by jfkIII

Not sure what the current MONTHLY numbers are (due to housing situtation) but during the boom years, it was something like 6000 new residents in, 3000 out....thats a net change of 9000 per month that either were there last month and are gone, or weren't there last month and are now living there. I'm sure Olecapt has current stats.

As you can imagine, it's tough to get too involved with neighbors, co-workers, friends from church and others, when they may be gone next month, or next year. One other thing that one of my brother's friends mentioned to me...he said that LV is not a good sports town. To this, I was totally surprised, as I was thinking that Vegas has all the legal sports books and gambling and such. He said that because so many people, come from so many other areas, everyone roots for their "home" team where they came from...or whoever they placed a sports bet on.

Good luck on your choice...it's great to see someone actually doing their homework before they move their with vacation goggles still on and realize that resident Vegas is not like vacation Vegas!

The problem with transiency is definition. Las Vegas loses about 3% of its population each year. That appears normal for a large city. Phoenix is I believe similar. So is Phoenix a "transient" city?

I would not think growth makes one transient. Transient implies turnover.

I have yet to see a single real statistic indicating Las Vegas has high turnover or "transiency".

Currently monthlies are running 6,000 in and 3,000 out...down from 8,000 in and 3,000 out a while back. Long term has been a net gain of over 5,000 a month.

[Greatday]

Originally Posted by ParkTwain

Why do you say the shopping is better in Phoenix?

Not only more but, more varied. From more big department stores like Dillards, Macys and Nordstroms, but also a tremendous number of specialty stores (Restoration Hardware, Crate and Barrell) to boutiques - travel to Carefree, Cave Creek, Scottsdale, AJ etc

Originally Posted by ParkTwain

Outdoor recreation around LV is probably better than around Phoenix,

I have to disagree - while there is great recreation areas around LV - Red Rock, Valley of Fire, north to Utah, Lee's Canyon etc., there are a number of LARGE National Forests in proximity to the Phx Metro area - including north to Oak Creek Canyon, the Kaibab, Coconino etc. Major snow ski areas (and winter recreation) within short drives - Flagstaff, Tucson (Mount Lemon), Showlow (Sunrise) etc. 6 large area lakes - including Canyon, Apache, Pleasant, Barlett, Saguaro, Roosevelt. Then there is the Areas around Jerome, Prescott, Globe and Miami etc.

Hope this helps

[ParkTwain]

Originally Posted by Greatday

Not only more but, more varied. From more big department stores like Dillards, Macys and Nordstroms, but also a tremendous number of specialty stores (Restoration Hardware, Crate and Barrell) to boutiques - travel to Carefree, Cave Creek, Scottsdale, AJ etc



I have to disagree - while there is great recreation areas around LV - Red Rock, Valley of Fire, north to Utah, Lee's Canyon etc., there are a number of LARGE National Forests in proximity to the Phx Metro area - including north to Oak Creek Canyon, the Kaibab, Coconino etc. Major snow ski areas (and winter recreation) within short drives - Flagstaff, Tucson (Mount Lemon), Showlow (Sunrise) etc. 6 large area lakes - including Canyon, Apache, Pleasant, Barlett, Saguaro, Roosevelt. Then there is the Areas around Jerome, Prescott, Globe and Miami etc.

Hope this helps

Dillard's, Nordstrom's, Macy's in LV? check
Crate & Barrel in LV? coming (but they're everywhere else, not big deal)
I'm thinking of the shopping available on the Strip in Venetian, Forum Shops, Wynn, Bellagio. Not too easy to find that elsewhere in the U.S.

I've seen Jerome, it's about a 2-hr stop. Couple of nice artists' shops.
Can't comment on lakes around Phoenix, not my thing.
Can't comment on Nat'l Forests around Phoenix. I've done some of the Saguaro Desert Park near Tucson, very nice.
Oak Creek Canyon and Sedona are great but trumped by Zion, IMO. But you can't buy a home in Zion, of course. Not as many crystals shops in Springdale, UT, as in Sedona, either.

Like recreation in southern NV, the recreational facilities I have seen in central AZ are relatively underdeveloped. Nevada and Arizona are not wealthy states. The national parks in both states are the standouts.