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Hi, all. A little over a year ago I moved into a great house that I love, but I had to leave behind my pellet furnace to heat with oil (very common in New England, but I'd been heating with pellets for several years so oil heat was a bit of a shock !). Next month I am having a pellet insert installed in the fireplace in my living room, which should (with my floor plan) work well for heating the main floor during the day with some heat going up the stairway to the 2nd-floor bedrooms (don't need much heat on that floor during the day).
I expect that I'll use oil at night but hopefully the pellets will take care of most of my heating needs. The only problem is storage. I don't know how many pellets I'll go through in a winter, but I expect 4. I bought 8 tons (yep!) and will be storing those in my garage this coming winter UNLESS I can get a lean-to shed built in the next month (not likely!).
The lean-to shed would be placed alongside my garage. Setback requirements aren't a problem. The shed would be about 18' wide by 5' deep by maybe 6' tall (plus a sloping roof). The garage height is ~9', if that matters. I have a couple of workers who could build it (one built one at his house), but I am wondering about the floor. Here are the options (I think):
(1) kill all the grass/etc. in the footprint, then put down a simple plywood floor directly on the ground (maybe with some sort of moisture barrier on top of that too?)
(2) have a concrete slab poured -- but of course this gets complicated and much more expensive!!
The pellets are on 1-ton pallets that are ~48" by ~42" by 54" high. Ideally, the delivery guy should be able to use a pallet jack to place them in the shed (instead of the garage). With an 18'-wide shed, I could get 4 pallets in there with a bit of room to spare on either side (assuming 2x4s for each side); I would then stack a few more bags on each pallet so I'd ideally store 5 tons in there.
I figure the lack of grass/etc. plus the plywood floor plus the pellets being on pallets would keep them from getting any moisture. Does option (1) sound like it would work or am I missing something major?
Thanks in advance -- reps to anyone who is at all helpful!
He has a big dually truck so he picks up the pellets himself instead of getting them delivered.
Perhaps you could find a larger shed that is like this, it may be an easier way to go.
I think a plywood floor directly on the ground (even if pressure-treated) won't hold up well.
Even though I live in FL, I have a pellet insert sitting in my garage. I brought it from PA because my attempt to sell it before I moved resulted in nothing but people trying to steal it from me. After being here through one winter, I've realized it gets cold enough that it would be useful so I will probably install it at some point.
He has a big dually truck so he picks up the pellets himself instead of getting them delivered.
Wow, I am amazed that its floor could hold 3 tons of weight! I have a storage shed in my back yard but I use that for other things (e.g. riding mower, garden tools, etc.), plus it would be a bit further to go to get pellets to bring into the house (AND there's no way the delivery guy would deliver them to that shed!).
Quote:
Originally Posted by HWTechGuy
Perhaps you could find a larger shed that is like this, it may be an easier way to go.
I think a plywood floor directly on the ground (even if pressure-treated) won't hold up well.
Yeah, this is my concern. I googled "build lean-to shed" to try to figure out how much weight 2x4, 2x6, or even 2x8 flooring could hold at 16 or 24 OC (to avoid the concrete slab). I could even go 12 OC to get the load weight if needed!! The problem with this is that I doubt very much that the delivery guy's pallet jack could load with the shed flooring that high (even with a ramp) so I would have to unload/load several tons of pellets myself. (Actually, that's not THAT bad ... just 2-3 hours of manual labor once a year. Not fun but worth it for the savings using pellets instead of oil!!)
Quote:
Originally Posted by HWTechGuy
Even though I live in FL, I have a pellet insert sitting in my garage. I brought it from PA because my attempt to sell it before I moved resulted in nothing but people trying to steal it from me. After being here through one winter, I've realized it gets cold enough that it would be useful so I will probably install it at some point.
I must say I am really looking forward to using my fireplace! I will need to use a little doorway fan to get some heat back to the TV room, but during daytime hours that room gets a ton of sun so I don't think it will be too bad.
I will say they need to stay dry, if they get wet or even damp enough they turn to mush.
Hence, my concern about flooring. Never had a problem storing them in my garage at the old house -- the pallets kept them several inches above the floor. I even left one ton out one year when I couldn't fit it in the garage -- I used those bags first and had no problems (kept the pallet covered of course!!).
For the floor heigh, depends on how much snow-fall you get during the winter months. What I would do is to build an elevated floor for it using 2" x 6" treated lumber for the joists and the outer boards, and then set a plywood floor on top of this frame. You may have to dig 4 to 6 holes to pour-in concrete piers into 8" in diameter tubular forms (the cardboard tubes sold at Home Depot and Lowe's). These piers should stick maybe 8" above the ground (depending on how much snow falls in the area you live), and the top surfaces should be perfectly level with each other. The frame for the he ground) for the floor sits on top of these piers.
The depth of the piers (underground), depends on how deep the frost line is in your area. For example, where I live in Alaska I have to dig holes for the concrete footings that are 48" deep to build a deck in the back of the house.
You will find a great number of ideas on "how to build a simple deck" on the Internet (youtube and the like). All you are doing is building a sort of a deck that's elevated from the ground. The floor goes on top of this deck, and the shed on top of the floor.
If you don't want to go through the trouble of pouring concrete piers, you can also buy the pre-formed concrete piers found a Home Depot and Lowe's. These are a solid concrete block, about 8" x 8" at the bottom, about 8" tall, with a metallic bracket on top that is used to support a 4" x 4" wooden post. I prefer the piers that have a hole in the middle, which allows me to use an adjustable metallic bracket. The treaded end of the bracket goes into the hole, then a large washer, and a nut on top of the washer. This way if the shed's level changes, I can adjust the bracket's heigh to make it level again. You can used four or more pieces of 4" x 4" posts on top of these piers, and build the elevated floor and frame mentioned above.
For the floor heigh, depends on how much snow-fall you get during the winter months. What I would do is to build an elevated floor for it using 2" x 6" treated lumber for the joists and the outer boards, and then set a plywood floor on top of this frame. You may have to dig 4 to 6 holes to pour-in concrete piers into 8" in diameter tubular forms (the cardboard tubes sold at Home Depot and Lowe's). These piers should stick maybe 8" above the ground (depending on how much snow falls in the area you live), and the top surfaces should be perfectly level with each other. The frame for the he ground) for the floor sits on top of these piers.
The depth of the piers (underground), depends on how deep the frost line is in your area. For example, where I live in Alaska I have to dig holes for the concrete footings that are 48" deep to build a deck in the back of the house.
You will find a great number of ideas on "how to build a simple deck" on the Internet (youtube and the like). All you are doing is building a sort of a deck that's elevated from the ground. The floor goes on top of this deck, and the shed on top of the floor.
Just checked and in my area concrete footings need to be 48" as well.
If I am doing that, would it make more sense for me to just go with the concrete floor? Or is that a LOT more complicated?
Just checked and in my area concrete footings need to be 48" as well.
If I am doing that, would it make more sense for me to just go with the concrete floor? Or is that a LOT more complicated?
A concrete floor is not very complicated. If you are going to have some people helping, you can rent a concrete mixer and pour-in the floor yourself. The problem I can see is that you should always have an elevated floor as mentioned on my previous post, otherwise you can get water inside when the snow melts. However, it's possible that you won't get water on the floor by keeping an area all around the shed clear of snow during the winter. The poured-in concrete piers aren't very complicated, either. You can always rent a motorized hole digger (looks like an ice auger used for ice fishing) to dig the 48" holes. The tubular form is pushed into the hole, and the concrete is poured into the form. But everything must be level, and you may have to place a bracket on top of each pier to hold the frame for the floor.
However as I also mentioned toward the end of my response above, you can always use the pre-formed concrete piers that sit on the ground. Use the adjustable ones, making sure that the ground is level and that each bracket is perfectly level and aligned with the rest. Then build rectangular frame with floor joists to hold the plywood floor. This frame sits on treated 4" x 4" lumber. The heigh of these posts is up to you. For example, if you get around a foot of two of snow during the winter, take that into consideration to keep the snow out of the shed. I have two sheds built this way at the back of my house, and haven't had a single problem. Built these sheds in the early '90s.
For your 18' wide by 5' deep shed, I would use at least 6 piers (one at each corner, at least one in the middle of the 18' front, and the other at the middle of the 18' back).
Karen I wouldn't get crazy about it and if you are going to get crazy build a regular shed so if you or the next homeowner isn't using pellets in the future you have a shed.
Typically with an outside coal bin you're going to use 2*6's for the floor. Pressure treated if you want but as along as its off the ground it won't be an issue. To get it off the ground dig a hole a few feet deep on the corners of every 4*4 square, if you had floor that was 4*8 you'd have 6 holes. fill it with gravel be sure to compact it down good. Use cinder blocks on each hole to get the floor off the ground. If it starts to sink anywhere in the next few years just jack it up when it's empty a little and shim it. You'll only won't need 2*3 walls with 1/2 plywood which will be more than sufficient so you can save yourself some money there.
There is lot of pictures of coal bins here that may give you some ideas, the only difference is you're going to need access to all of it. These are typically built for coal in bulk.
thecoalman has given you good advise. You see the frame built of 2" x 6" at the bottom of the coal bin he posted? For your shed you want do have some floor joists to support the plywood floor. That's the type of frame for the floor I mentioned above, and is quite easy to build. You want that frame sitting on some pillars like thecoalman have mentioned, or just like the pre-formed pillars found a Home Depot and Lowe's.
Build the shed on top of the plywood floor, and that's all there is to it.
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I brought it from PA because my attempt to sell it before I moved resulted in nothing but people trying to steal it from me. After being here through one winter, I've realized it gets cold enough that it would be useful so I will probably install it at some point.
