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Old 06-07-2012, 04:25 AM
 
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I read this article just now and found it interesting and as is my want i thought i'd share it.

BBC News - Joseph Stalin's deadly railway to nowhere

"In the Russian Arctic lies buried an unfinished railway built by prisoners of Stalin's gulags. For decades no-one talked about it. But one woman is now telling the story of the thousands who suffered there - and there is talk of bringing back to life the abandoned railway itself."
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:58 AM
 
Location: Texas
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Interesting. I'd never heard of it until now.
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Old 06-07-2012, 07:55 AM
 
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There were many railroads that were made at great cost of human lives, many were quickly abandoned. Others were just incredibly costly. Stalin and his regime is a subject on its own. The Trans-Siberian railroad must have been equally difficult in construction, but since it has the purpose of unifying and having allowed a route for rapid movement of men and machines in case of war, it remains.

About the time of the building of the Panama Canal, there were a couple of railroads across Mexico and the isthmus.
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Old 06-07-2012, 08:01 AM
 
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Thanks for the article. This part stuck out to me:

Quote:
A 16-year-old girl, whose mother had died and whose father returned wounded from the front, was desperate to feed her four younger siblings. When she was caught stealing half a sack of beetroots she too was sent off to build the railway.

"She got 10 years hard labour for that supposedly political crime," explains Lyudmila, "but what did it have to do with politics?"
The Russian axiom about Stalin usually goes something like, "he found Russia with the wooden plough and left it with atomic weapons". Of course left out of that quote is the incredible suffering of countless millions to achieve it.
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Old 06-08-2012, 09:57 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
Thanks for the article. This part stuck out to me:



The Russian axiom about Stalin usually goes something like, "he found Russia with the wooden plough and left it with atomic weapons". Of course left out of that quote is the incredible suffering of countless millions to achieve it.

"We, in the heat in the frost strained our sinews
Toiled with our shoulders eternally bent
Lived in mud hovels, were sodden and frozen
Fought with starvation, with scurvy were spent
Cheated we were by the quick witted foremen
Flogged by the masters and ground in the soil
All we endured and were patient, God’s legions
Peaceable children of toil
Brethren, you now reap the fruit of our struggle
We have been fated to perish and rot
Do you still think of us sometimes with kindness
Do you remember or not?"

Nekrasov "The Railroad"

NJ...
If you ever find the full version of translation of this particular poem, ( it's rather long) you'll get an idea.
However it's not about Stalin's times. It's about the railroad built from St. Petersburg to Moscow, around 1842, with no Stalin in sight.
I've mentioned once in another thread that one can discuss intelligently everything you want without any reference to God ( or religion,) except when you talk about Israel and Middle East.
Russia is yet another exception ( and may be Africa.)

PS. "Stalin found Russia with the wooden plough and left it with atomic weapons" is not a Russian axiom; these words are ascribed to Churchill. As you know, Britons like to be quick-witted and concise. So blame Churchill for leaving anything out, not Russians.

Last edited by erasure; 06-08-2012 at 10:06 AM..
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Old 06-08-2012, 10:58 AM
 
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Originally Posted by erasure View Post
Brethren, you now reap the fruit of our struggle
The article brought up an interesting point, made by the Russian woman who is leading the rememberance of what happened. The people who worked on constructing it had thought that they were working to achieve a greater good. By abandoning the project and leaving it to rot, their efforts were essentially for nought and they suffered horribly for nothing.

Quote:
NJ...
If you ever find the full version of translation of this particular poem, ( it's rather long) you'll get an idea.
However it's not about Stalin's times. It's about the railroad built from St. Petersburg to Moscow, around 1842, with no Stalin in sight.
I've mentioned once in another thread that one can discuss intelligently everything you want without any reference to God ( or religion,) except when you talk about Israel and Middle East.
Russia is yet another exception ( and may be Africa.)
Ironic, because I doubt the average Russian looks fondly back on Nicholas I (or the man himself) and his pet railroad built on the backs of serfs to allow the upper-classes to move between the capitals. Yet they seem to idolize Stalin, which yes, we have talked about extensively.

Quote:
PS. "Stalin found Russia with the wooden plough and left it with atomic weapons" is not a Russian axiom; these words are ascribed to Churchill. As you know, Britons like to be quick-witted and concise. So blame Churchill for leaving anything out, not Russians.
You are very correct that it is a Churchill quote and not a Russian saying per se. Though, it does seem to be widely quoted in Russian publications and articles written about Stalin, at least ones in English from Russian sources that I have read.
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:34 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
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There's a theory put forward by some historians that the purpose of the Gulag system was to provide free labor for the state.
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Old 06-10-2012, 06:50 AM
 
Location: The Midst of Insanity
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Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
There's a theory put forward by some historians that the purpose of the Gulag system was to provide free labor for the state.
The untouched resources of places like the far north (timber, gold etc) had to be accessed and used somehow. There were no funds to built the roads through Siberia, to set up the settlements, nor the money to employ and pay people as laborers. Many of the camps sprouted along the railways and followed as they were built. GULAG history is fascinating.
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Old 06-10-2012, 01:07 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
There's a theory put forward by some historians that the purpose of the Gulag system was to provide free labor for the state.

I didn't know that there was such theory, put forward by historians)))
To me it became quite obvious even after reading Archipelago.
When you are reading about the whole villages being exiled from Western European part to Siberia under pretense of *political* accusations, you get the picture. Same goes to some other ridiculous accusations of average citizens on so-called "political ground," (in spite of the fact that there were of course some legitimate political prisoners in Stalin's time.) It becomes clear after reading case after case, that someone somewhere gave an order on a national level to round up people and turn them into free labor as much as possible.
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Old 06-10-2012, 01:15 PM
 
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Originally Posted by annika08 View Post
The untouched resources of places like the far north (timber, gold etc) had to be accessed and used somehow. There were no funds to built the roads through Siberia, to set up the settlements, nor the money to employ and pay people as laborers. Many of the camps sprouted along the railways and followed as they were built. GULAG history is fascinating.
Well I wouldn't call it "fascinating," - I'm sure happy that I wasn't born back in those times ( heck, my family barely escaped the infamous Solovki,) but I can somewhat understand where Stalin was coming from. Interestingly enough, some Russians whose parents/grandparents were sent in labor camps, are saying too, that they are less critical of him, than today's government. They are saying that at least in Stalin's times people were suffering in the name of idea and gradual improvement of the country overall, while under Putin people suffer in the name of money and money only, with destruction of national interests all around them.
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