Infrastructure of Norfolk/Portsmouth - Midatlantic, Southern (Virginia Beach, Chesapeake: apartment, rent)

[757Cities Southsider]

Originally Posted by tvpirate05

Downtown Norfolk has its phases...it was hot in the mid-to-late-2000s, then Town Center started taking some of its thunder, and now it's slowly coming back. Far from dead, or even life support, just in a bit of a lull.

The Granby Tower and Westin projects would've been nice; the former is being heavily reconsidered with the Waterside renovations coming into play. That won't necessarily be a game changer, but it definitely helps bring traffic back to the city (and business district).

Downtown Norfolk had some really nice plans for towers a few years ago...unfortunately, they were proposed when the economy went straight into the toilet, so naturally most of them fell through, except for the Wells Fargo Tower across from Scope. 10 years ago, it wouldn't have been a problem, but with the slowly recovering economy, things are looking good. The new courthouse will be another nice one.

There's been some talk about the "St. Paul Quadrant", which would go off Tidewater Dr., across from Ruffner Middle. That would be nice to see, but the city (as always) is dragging its feet with that one. I think that and the other side of Brambleton are the future of downtown Norfolk with it being so landlocked. Would love to see more restaurants next to Harbor Park as well...a riverwalk leading all the way to Waterside.

This is what I will have to disagree with. I do not see ANY need to tear down that neighborhood whatsoever. Not only is there plenty of land from Monticello to Yarmouth that is not utilized properly...there are several other lots inside DT itself that are not developed. There is plenty of "filler" now they need to build up." St. Pauls Quadrant" does not speak to the rest of Norfolk...nobody REALLY from here would even call it that. Those yuppies dont have any connection to the rest of Norfolk...theyre not sending their children to Ruffner or Booker T. Im not for displacing the economically "poor" just because all of a sudden some brats want to live in an "urban" environment all of a sudden. Tidewater Park is known thoughout the East Coast and world not like "Cabrini Green" either; known for style and wit not for notorius violence. Tidewater Park all the way to Youngs Park is the soul of Norfolk and the Southside...something petrified yuppies will never understand and something Va Beach nor Chesapeake can copy.

[tvpirate05]

I see what you mean...odd thing is, it bothers me that Norfolk's solution to everything is to knock down anything built before 1974 and replace it with "luxury" condos and townhouses, and St. Paul would be no different. Broad Creek is okay and all, but it still doesn't come close to the suburbs found in VB and Chesapeake. Same goes for Middletown Arch, right beside NSU. Not that NSU is the worst place in the world (gets a bad rep), but I still have trouble seeing Middletown as suburban.

Not to mention Norfolk's projects never turn out as grand as they promise them to be, so yeah, I definitely see your argument about St. Paul. To me, they did a much better job with revising Ghent (Princess Anne Road area, close to Maury High School) in the late-70s/early-80s. I didn't realize until a few months ago that Ghent was really in dire straits up until that point.

[757Cities Southsider]

Originally Posted by tvpirate05

I see what you mean...odd thing is, it bothers me that Norfolk's solution to everything is to knock down anything built before 1974 and replace it with "luxury" condos and townhouses, and St. Paul would be no different. Broad Creek is okay and all, but it still doesn't come close to the suburbs found in VB and Chesapeake. Same goes for Middletown Arch, right beside NSU. Not that NSU is the worst place in the world (gets a bad rep), but I still have trouble seeing Middletown as suburban.

Not to mention Norfolk's projects never turn out as grand as they promise them to be, so yeah, I definitely see your argument about St. Paul. To me, they did a much better job with revising Ghent (Princess Anne Road area, close to Maury High School) in the late-70s/early-80s. I didn't realize until a few months ago that Ghent was really in dire straits up until that point.

Yep, Ghent was a slum.

As far as Broad Creek and Middle Town Arch...you said it all...one shouldnt even be THINKING about the suburbs when judging those areas, and the fact that you thought to compare them to suburbs means that Norfolk did the city a disservice. Norfolk is a city and should look like one. Let Chesapeake and Va Beach do the suburb thing...just focus on being a city. Thats one of Norfolks problems.

What I really hate other than when they knock down 60-70 year old brick buildings is when they tear down those SUPER TALL trees that have been there for EVER and give those neighborhoods charachter. And then they plant these midget trees in a barren neighborhoods riddled with vinyl siding crap. Seas of vinyl siding throw up houses.SMH!!!!

[Falcor117]

Downtown Norfolk and a few other areas in Norfolk resemble Baltimore/certain sections of DC.

The rest of Hampton Roads is odd. It's southern mixed with "generic, corporate, strip mall".

The peninsula is so different than the southside that it deserves its own separate comparision. It's basically just farm land that has been converted into strip malls, suburban homes, and apartments. Almost all the growth is related to people coming in from the Military and the Shipyard. Without those two things, the peninsula would probably still be farmland(much like the upper peninsulas).

Problem is Hampton Roads doesn't have, and never will have, direction. Too many people from too many backgrounds coming from all over trying to live in a spread out area with only a few connections between them.

If Hampton Roads were a city, it would be America's "lost" city. Not lost as in it has been forgotten, but lost as in it will never find its way. Nothing ever gets done around here. Easily correctable problems(mainly transportation related) are never fixed and will never be fixed. Major industries don't move here and talented people tend to leave first chance they get.

It's like this place can't accept what it is... a place that supports the military.

[11KAP]

downtown newport news is the first
english-american settlement city.

[757Cities Southsider]

Originally Posted by Falcor117

Downtown Norfolk and a few other areas in Norfolk resemble Baltimore/certain sections of DC.

The rest of Hampton Roads is odd. It's southern mixed with "generic, corporate, strip mall".

The peninsula is so different than the southside that it deserves its own separate comparision. It's basically just farm land that has been converted into strip malls, suburban homes, and apartments. Almost all the growth is related to people coming in from the Military and the Shipyard. Without those two things, the peninsula would probably still be farmland(much like the upper peninsulas).

Problem is Hampton Roads doesn't have, and never will have, direction. Too many people from too many backgrounds coming from all over trying to live in a spread out area with only a few connections between them.

If Hampton Roads were a city, it would be America's "lost" city. Not lost as in it has been forgotten, but lost as in it will never find its way. Nothing ever gets done around here. Easily correctable problems(mainly transportation related) are never fixed and will never be fixed. Major industries don't move here and talented people tend to leave first chance they get.

It's like this place can't accept what it is... a place that supports the military.

I think you are kinda off on your assesment. Most sturdy neighborhoods filled with locals are hidden. And although the military provides alot of jobs major shipping industry does move hear. Also, our transportation issues have been slowly getting fixed for the past 10 years...the most expensive issue of the tunnels is really the only one that has been constantly put off because of financing. Now it looks like that will be fixed and you all will be back to paying tolls. The area is not LOST...they just dont do what "visitors" want them to do...they have their own way of doing things.

[ChuckG2008]

I'd just like to chime in on this discussion and throw in my two cents if I may lol. I'm a student at Regent University in Va Beach (although I'm online, not on campus now), but when I lived on campus from 2009-2010, one of the first things I noticed about this area was how drastically different it is from any of the East Coast metros not too far to the north. Public transit is largely nonexistent by East Coast standards, and traffic is absolutely horrendous. Trying to cross a simple suburban street on a bike or by foot becomes a monumental task! Almost every road in that area (specifically non-interstate thoroughfares) seems to be at least 8 or 10 lanes wide! It's insane! For a city of over 430,000 people, closely surrounded by other cities with hundreds of thousands of additional inhabitants, it is appalling that nearly every single commuter is forced to travel by car. Like previous posters have said, if only the other six cities were built just like Norfolk is, this problem would be significantly reduced. Really, the only easily walkable area of all of Virginia Beach is those few blocks right along the oceanfront. Now don't get me wrong, I really enjoyed my time in the area and the people are great overall, but the infrastructure is like nothing I had ever seen before.

[11KAP]

hampton roads is a car culture.
you need a car to get around
unless you live downtown and
don't go anywhere else.

[tvpirate05]

I have constantly wondered where this area would be had Norfolk taken over the land that is now Chesapeake and Virginia Beach. Instead of becoming independent cities 50 years ago, they would've fallen under the Norfolk umbrella, and Norfolk would have a population of nearly 1 million (Norfolk is 240K, Chesapeake 220, VB 450). Transportation, infrastructure, and pro sports would all be a completely different story if those three cities had become one in the early-60s.

At the very least, this area would have more of a Dallas-Fort Worth, Raleigh-Durham, or Minneapolis-St. Paul partnership. I've heard rumblings about trying to make Norfolk-Virginia Beach the name for the area, which makes a lot of sense for branding purposes. Would love to see it become official, being how many people here live in one city, and work or socialize in another. Light rail expanding to VB would be a great move, but that's 5 years away...the steps need to be laid beforehand.

[Falcor117]

Originally Posted by 757Cities Southsider

I think you are kinda off on your assesment. Most sturdy neighborhoods filled with locals are hidden. And although the military provides alot of jobs major shipping industry does move hear. Also, our transportation issues have been slowly getting fixed for the past 10 years...the most expensive issue of the tunnels is really the only one that has been constantly put off because of financing. Now it looks like that will be fixed and you all will be back to paying tolls. The area is not LOST...they just dont do what "visitors" want them to do...they have their own way of doing things.

Largest employer in Hampton Roads is the Federal Government.

Second largest is Newport News Shipbuilding, which builds Navy ships.

City government jobs and healthcare are the next two largest on the list.

After that: Wal-Mart.

We do have some shipping companies but they are not large employers in the area.

We only have 4 Fortune 500 companies here, and with the exception of Smithfield Foods(which itself does not have a great reputation for being a great employer), are not large employers in the area.

Do you even live in HR? Our transportation issues are far from fixed. Look at google maps at 5pm and look at the traffic. It's a sea of red across the region.

If you don't have family here, are not military or a federal employee, I don't understand why you're not looking for the first ship out of here.