Land lease verses owning the land. (Dover, Lewes: condos, purchaser, gated)

[elizamary]

Originally Posted by rossc

If memory serves, you are retired and sold a property somewhere else. You probably cashed out and own your house in DE outright. If you had to make a living here to pay a mortgage, you would see it in a different light.

You're right, people come here to retire with a bunch of cash from the sale of a property they had owned for 30 years and think they hit the lottery. They look at our real estate values relative to their previous state, not relative to the average local wage. That mentality is pushing the local real estate market out of reach for locals who need to make a mortgage payment on an average wage.

Average wages and quality of living is actually a little higher in TN around the larger metro areas yet the sale property there would cost 1/3 what it does here. Wages, real estate and costs of living are very much in proportion there.

Rossc,
Sorry but you preception of my situation is false. We did not move here with a "bunch" of cash. Without getting too personal, I will tell you we had a mortgage in Phily and have one now too.
I do not have my job for I retired. There is no way I could of retired and stayed in my home in Philly. Just would not have been able to afford living there at all.

[rdlr]

Originally Posted by rossc

Absolutely, that is exactly why wages and real estate prices in this state are so out proportion. People who have to live and work here can barely afford to own a house. Some can't, which explains the 52% rise in Sussex Co foreclosures this year.

I can relate, first hand, to the real estate market and foreclosures.

[elizamary]

Originally Posted by Delly

I can relate, first hand, to the real estate market and foreclosures.

From watching national news, this seems to be a national problem effecting every state in the union. Not only a DE problem.
The real estate market is horrible all over. the goverment is trying to help citizens so they won't have to face foreclosure but at a snail pace, it ain't gonna happen soon enough.

What I don't understand is why anyone would take an adjustable rate in the first place.
This issue was part of the reason people got into trouble.

[rdlr]

Well, Eliza, there are a number of reasons homeowners have gotten in trouble, not just adjustable rate mortgages. Many banks/mortgage companies were giving mortgages away like candy, not scrutinizing the loan package/applicant's ability to pay, etc. Many 95% loans were given, plus many with 100% financing. Developers were advertising such things as $100 moves you in, but then they were raising prices at the same time. Because of the tremendous housing boom, there were many comparable sales for appraisers to utilize, and justify those values, and everybody qualified for a mortgage. Now the balloon has burst.

[rossc]

Originally Posted by elizamary

Rossc,
Sorry but you preception of my situation is false. We did not move here with a "bunch" of cash. Without getting too personal, I will tell you we had a mortgage in Phily and have one now too.
I do not have my job for I retired. There is no way I could of retired and stayed in my home in Philly. Just would not have been able to afford living there at all.

Sorry for the assumption, but the gist of what I said still applies. You were comparing costs based on your previous state, not based on income you would have to earn in DE.

[elizamary]

Originally Posted by rossc

Sorry for the assumption, but the gist of what I said still applies. You were comparing costs based on your previous state, not based on income you would have to earn in DE.

I worked for Federal Gov. Not sure of the hour rate in De for each state has a different pay scale
I would assume the minum pay is around the same as in Pa?
Not sure but I will check it.
At any rate, I am retired and not looking for work,,,,,,,,,,thank God
But I do understand finding a job in DE is hard from what I heard but have not experienced this first hand.

[rossc]

Originally Posted by elizamary

From watching national news, this seems to be a national problem effecting every state in the union. Not only a DE problem.
The real estate market is horrible all over. the goverment is trying to help citizens so they won't have to face foreclosure but at a snail pace, it ain't gonna happen soon enough.

What I don't understand is why anyone would take an adjustable rate in the first place.
This issue was part of the reason people got into trouble.

It is worse is some parts that others. A 52% rise in foreclosures over last year is substantial. Who pays for that federal assistance? Does it just add to an already out of control national debt or does it trickle down in the form of higher income taxes, fuel taxes and other federal taxes? Foreclosure assistance doesn't solve the problem, it displaces the problem.

People took adjustable rates because when rates were low they could get more money for less. They don't think ahead and the bankers don't properly explain what happens when the rates sky rocket. People don't understand that a couple points can raise their house payment $500. Also, when they took the loan the economy was stronger, they had a good job, the real estate market was booming, life was good. Now the tables have turned.

If you want to feel better about the real estate crisis, look a the consumer credit issues going on now. The credit card companies estimate that there is over 100 billion in credit card debt that they consider high risk.

[elizamary]

Originally Posted by rossc

Sorry for the assumption, but the gist of what I said still applies. You were comparing costs based on your previous state, not based on income you would have to earn in DE.

Well, I don't know what I would have earned in DE cuz I do not have a federal goverment pay table handy but I did find the minum wage chart and it seems DE and PA are the same.

It depends what type of job you have and how much education. We all have choices and like I said before.........If I was that unhappy with DE, I certainly wouldn't hang around. When the time was right, I would have hot footed out of DE just like I did PA.
U.S. Department of Labor
Employment Standards Administration Wage and Hour Division

[elizamary]

Originally Posted by rossc

It is worse is some parts that others. A 52% rise in foreclosures over last year is substantial. Who pays for that federal assistance? Does it just add to an already out of control national debt or does it trickle down in the form of higher income taxes, fuel taxes and other federal taxes? Foreclosure assistance doesn't solve the problem, it displaces the problem.

People took adjustable rates because when rates were low they could get more money for less. They don't think ahead and the bankers don't properly explain what happens when the rates sky rocket. People don't understand that a couple points can raise their house payment $500. Also, when they took the loan the economy was stronger, they had a good job, the real estate market was booming, life was good. Now the tables have turned.

.

I suppose in the long run, everyone will pay one way or another. We refinanced a few years back when the economy was strong but there was no way we were going to take a chance with an adjustable rate.

We sold our home on the cusp. Another couple months and we would have been in trouble.
many people who live in our community still have not sold their home.
I think since Bush has been our leader, everything has gone to H in a handbag.

[Summering]

Originally Posted by beachbird

Fro you who are new to the owner of modular or mobile homes on leased lands, you may want to ask your Homeowner Association about tao bills which are coming out of the Manufactured Housing subcomittee (hopefully) to be debated. SB 122 is a right of refusal that would allow a community to buy its land from the owner when it is offered for sale--Did you know that your owner only has to give you a year's notice to vacate the leased land?
Where will you move your home?
The other piece of legislation is Hb258 which requires a park owner to justify any annual rent increases which are above the CPI (consumer price index).
For those of us who ignored the advice of a licensed realtor and bought into a leased community, lot rents have risen sharply especially in communities where water access or views are offered. Is anyone prepared to see their lot rent raised to the Fair Market Rental which is a number devised by the land owner--based on lot prices in non -leased communities.
If you want more information about the bills, I suggest you contact the Delaware Manufactured Home Owners Association (phone number is in the Lewes/Rehoboth book) or call your state Senator or District representative and voice your questions and concerns.
There are some genuinely humane family park owners out there who are probably mystified by the increases demanded by their peers in the business. Many of the communities are not owned locally but by out-of-state investors--does that contribute to the greed? But greed does exist--if annual rents with numbers like $5,000 to $17,000 per year payable in one lump sum shock your sensibilities, you may want to lose some of our natural complacency and ask, "Why? or When?"

I looked this up in the search ,as I am in deep thought lately, wondering the value of putting an expensive home on someone elses land.
I'm reading the above and it convinces me even more that it is a scarey idea.
Putting your hard earned money into a gorgeous home, then plopping it on land not yours, how can that feel right?
I know of plenty communities that are pretty much senior, and yet.....the homes are on their own land. They have a pool, even a lake....some small rules. Now that sounds more logical to me.
Being under the control of the landowner is something one would have to live with constantly......A long lease helps with the " you'll have to move it in a year" that probably exists in some places. But, the rebuild at a cost we tell you......if something bad happens......is out of your hands also.
Do people know the retirement age rules and how they would affect the passing of their home to a family member upon their death?
The person it goes to, must be 55 too! So if you want to deed the home to your youngest son or daughter.....they can't have it. It will not become the family home passed down. We asked that question for my sister, whos daughter is in her 40's. She would not be allowed to live in the senior community god forbid something would happen to her Mom.
I also wonder if people are fine with the children rules. I know for myself ......I'd want my grandkids with me more then a week.....I'd want them to stay the summers, a month......whatever.
The rules on how long a child can stay with you, aren't conducive to my lifestyle.
What is going on in Pots Nets is a horriable situation. It seems.......the landowner has all the power. Your on his land......it is his, not yours.
I think the builders saw a good way to keep having income forever in a lease community. I think it is good for the builder/landowner.......but, never for the buyer.
Be careful, read all fine print.......and try to own your land, at all cost.