Loss cause!! (Dayton, Salem, Amanda: apartments, high crime, home)

[weatherphotographer]

Originally Posted by Amandarthegreat

I agree 1000x. I don't mind paying more at Target or Meijers just because the stores are cleaner, feel safer and I can actually find what I want--where it should be-- in new condition (it'd be nice to pick up a lip color that doesn't look like someone took a bite out of it). This may sound a bit classist, but I've noticed that whenever I go to any Walmart, I am more likely to be bumped and jostled or--like hensleya1--catch people rummaging in my cart.

You must like your debit card data stolen at Target!

As for Meijer....I have(And a friend) experienced the "game" from Meijer not honoring sales prices! Once was on a Santa buck deal they tried to cheat me on, and I ended up not buying a coffee pot after 5 minutes of bickering and waiting on a manager to respond(who didn't). Witnessed a friend get ripped off when she signed up for a Meijer credit card and didn't get the 25 dollar credit.

Better answer please.....

[marketingtiger]

Dayton has to put an end to its over-dependence, its beggar ways, and take the lead again, becoming THE most prosperous city in the State of Ohio.

Dayton must re-learn what it means to be a leading city.

:-)

[SWOH]

^Not a bad insight, but I don't know if there's anyplace the city can really go to "beg" anymore.

[hensleya1]

Originally Posted by OHKID

^Not a bad insight, but I don't know if there's anyplace the city can really go to "beg" anymore.

One acronym: MVRPC

And to a lesser extent countywide levies that channel suburban tax dollars into services that really only benefit the city. See: RTA, Sinclair College, Human Services levies, etc. Yes, city residents pay taxes too, but 8.21 mills on a $30,000 house in Westwood is quite a bit less than 8.21 mills on a $450,000 house in Washington Township...

[ohio_peasant]

Originally Posted by marketingtiger

Dayton has to put an end to its over-dependence, its beggar ways, and take the lead again, becoming THE most prosperous city in the State of Ohio.

Setting aside virulent boosterism, there is indeed a truth here. Dayton needs to quit its self-pitying lionization of the 1880-1945 period, to wean itself off of the automotive industry and rust-belt manufacturing, and to aggressively pursue forays into services, insurance/finance, and the various other growth sectors of the globalized world. Dayton needs to become more like Pittsburgh and Columbus, and less like Cleveland and Cincinnati.

[SWOH]

Originally Posted by ohio_peasant

Setting aside virulent boosterism, there is indeed a truth here. Dayton needs to quit its self-pitying lionization of the 1880-1945 period, to wean itself off of the automotive industry and rust-belt manufacturing, and to aggressively pursue forays into services, insurance/finance, and the various other growth sectors of the globalized world. Dayton needs to become more like Pittsburgh and Columbus, and less like Cleveland and Cincinnati.

Agreed, to an extent. A lot of Pittsburgh's boom has been based off of health services. And given the fact that field has basically been non-growth since the beginning on time, I'd be willing to bet we are riding a bubble there. But regardless, there is a lot of varied industries in Pittsburgh, so I can see how it'd be a good model.

Overall though, I have faith in 1) my own belief that Dayton is pretty great right now, and 2) it will be getting even better in the future because of its small size and easy mobility.

That's why anything that impedes that mobility, like oppressive political regimes that come from things like unions, needs to go. And I'm thinking the loss of about 12,000 union jobs between Delphi and GM plant closings, among others, helped that out. I personally cannot stand being oppressed, and defining a city by commitment to organizations whose sole purpose was to oppress people was a monstrosity. I'm very happy to say those days, as far as I can see, are behind us. I hope they never come back. I am proud to say I never saw 1980's-era union-depressed Dayton, nor do I ever want to see it. The unions (nearly) killed our city. They better not come back.

In regards to history, I'd argue the other side of the coin. In fact, I'd argue that the average person's blatant ignorance of our city's really cool and unique heritage is one factor causing low pride in the city. When people keep telling you you're in a horrible cowtown, you tend to believe them until you really experience a horrible cowtown. Then that plants the seed that makes you A) hate the cowtown and B) want to leave. But if you make people realize how good they have it, how significant that little building on the corner really was to the history of the area (and the nation), how one's own family tied into a city and helped build it into what it is today... that's powerful.

That's how you build a culture of happy, proud, lifelong residents, just like building a similar culture in a corporation. No real difference there. That's why I get infuriated by the stupidity of tearing our heritage down. Those "old buildings" many seem happily willing to discard are our heritage. They are us, they made us into what we are today. Like in Troy, I had generations of my family work at the Adams St. plant they are tearing down. And for what? Fast food restaurants I bet. I can point to a whole village worth of fast food restaurants and McMansions that currently stand on what used to be MY family heritage, even my own heritage.


It's horrible the amnesia we have in this country, and even I am to blame as I like to look into the future a lot more than the past. But recently CP brought up a lot of excellent points on how her Eastern European Catholic past is being forgotten, rapidly, by UD and the likes right under her very nose in Dayton. We forget, when we really need more than anything to remember. That's the real problem. Who wants to live in a place that has never existed? That has no uniqueness or no culture? Not me, taht's for sure. I hope y'all don't either.

[Dayton Sux]

there is indeed a truth here. Dayton needs to quit its self-pitying lionization of the 1880-1945 period, to wean itself off of the automotive industry and rust-belt manufacturing, and to aggressively pursue forays into services, insurance/finance, and the various other growth sectors of the globalized world. Dayton needs to become more like Pittsburgh and Columbus, and less like Cleveland and Cincinnati.

"making things" was...and to some extent still is...Dayton's thing. The thing that sets this place apart from other rust belt places that were about "making things" was that we have this big Air Force operation here that drives a part of the economy...that our economy is somewhat diversified already tho not into that global finance sector (which is going to be unlikely anyway). So you have things balance out a bit...declining factory town and this DoD-driven nerdistan out in suburbia.

how significant that little building on the corner really was to the history
of the area (and the nation), how one's own family tied into a city and helped
build it into what it is today... that's powerful

The pragmatic, practical, common-sense side of our local culture is what makes stuff like historic preservation such a hard sell, since the its not really a cost-effective way of doing real estate. Easier & cheaper to tear down old stuff and build new....the value or patina of "the old", the character, if you will, isn't really something that makes sense to a city of engineers, scientists, and tool & die makers.

[SWOH]

^D8nSux, as always you hit the nail on the head.

And yeah, excellent point about preservation not being cost-effective. Low labor costs around here makes the odds of preservation even worse, because we're at a point where you can build new for stupidly less than it costs to do a rehab. Those sprawl economics at play.... maybe someday we'll wake up and smell the stupid.

[J. PRICE]

Originally Posted by OHKID

The OP is an older individual who reminisces about the west side of the 1970s and earlier. He lives in California.

He is the OP of many other threads and does one hit wonders like this on his large thread. I'm not sure what his purpose is, because Dayton of 1970 is never coming back. The question is, would we want it back? I know I don't.

MY DEAR FRIEND WHAT makes so sad with Dayton, is because we ownd 2 homes on Salem Ave. they are in excellent condition, but Salem Ave. ISN'T.

[weatherphotographer]

Salem Avenue is a very high crime area

(awaits the rose colored glasses poster to say it isn't.....)