Deciding Between Allen, Frisco, Plano and McKinney... (Dallas, Austin: real estate, buying a home)

[pappy97]

Originally Posted by Soon2BTXN

Pappy, for us, you hit the nail on the head of understanding. My fiance is originally from India. His parents drove him to prep classes which were about three hours before the start of school. Then after school ended he had another two to three hours of more prep classes. Education is extremely important to both of us.

Good for you getting with an Indian guy (I'm Indian too, but born and raised in the US).

Anyways, sounds like you might be in the same boat as the doctor I know, i.e., you can live in McKinney but have your kids attend good private schools, even if they are in the Dallas area. Is that a possibility for you (either now or in the future?). Of course you can avoid having one of you do the crazy McKinney-Dallas-Sherman thing.

Assuming it is down the line, then you don't have to worry so much about the school district in the city where you live. The only thing is if kids attend private school in Dallas, dad works in Sherman, and you work elsewhere in DFW metro (Dallas proper or otherwise), some sacrifices have to be made but it seems like you guys are willing so I'd suggest you focus on McKinney and look into private schools when the time comes, assuming you can afford it.

If private school will never be an option, and your future hubby is willing to do the long commute to Sherman, then I agree with TC80's suggestion that you will want to live (buy or rent) in the following school districts: Southlake Carroll ISD, Plano West's feeder, Highland Park ISD, and Coppell ISD.

And from my own observations, the number of Asian-Americans in Allen and McKinney are growing fast, especially Allen. And like I said, the doctor I know is Indian, his family is Indian (not mixed), and they LOVE McKinney and do not feel out of place living there.

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by pappy97

If private school will never be an option, and your future hubby is willing to do the long commute to Sherman, then I agree with TC80's suggestion that you will want to live (buy or rent) in the following school districts: Southlake Carroll ISD, Plano West's feeder, Highland Park ISD, and Coppell ISD.

OP, I wish we had know that info from the start!! The only public ISD's that are significantly better than average are Carroll ISD (Southlake), Plano West part of PISD, Highland Park ISD, and Coppell ISD. Southlake and Highland Park are the wealthiest and also the least diverse, with Southlake being 90% white and Highland Park/University Park being 95% white. Coppell's HS is 65% white, 18% Asian/Indian, 10% Hispanic, & 6% black. The main zip code for West Plano is 82% white, 3% black, 11% Asian, 4% other (multi-racial, American Indian, etc).

This goes back to our discussion from yesterday that diverse & good schools don't really go hand-in-hand in the DFW area since the best schools are in the wealthiest areas - and those areas tend to be much less diverse.

I pulled these stats from a recent thread about "best schools". Here are the academic stats for these four high schools. I think they speak for themselves, especially when compared to McKinney, Frisco, and some of the other northern burb districts you are considering:

Highland Park High School (HPISD- Exemplary Rated District)
-1203 SAT average (Math + Verbal scores only). #1 highest SAT in North Texas public schools
-Newsweek Magazine ranked #38 high school in the entire United States (based on Advanced Placement tests taken)
-468 students in graduating class (class of 2009)
-12 National Merit Semifinalists; 19 Commended (4% of class)
-2009 graduates admitted to 3 of 8 Ivy League Schools, plus Duke, Rice, Northwestern, all 3 US Service Academies, etc.

West Plano High School (PISD- Recognized Rated District)
-1179 SAT average (Math + Verbal scores only) #2 highest SAT in North Texas public schools
-approx 1020 students in 2010 graduating class
-32 National Merit Finalists, 52 Commended (5% of class)
-college info not on school's website

Carroll High School (Southlake, CISD- Exemplary Rated District)
-1083 SAT average (Math + Verbal scores only) #5 highest SAT in North Texas public schools.
-600 students in 2009 graduating class
-11 National Merit Finalists, 40 Commended (6% of class)
No college acceptance info on school's website.

Coppell High School (CISD- Exemplary Rated District)
-1135 SAT average (Math + Verbal scores only) #3 highest SAT in North Texas public schools
-713 students in 2009 graduating class
-20 National Merit Semifinalists, 33 Commended (7% of class)
-Past 2 years seniors have enrolled in 6 of 8 Ivies, Amherst, Duke, Rice, all 3 US Service Academies, Stanford, etc.


If you are intersted in private schools AT ALL, get moving now for next school year. Most schools require all applications to be submited by late December/early January. Most of these schools are located within 2 miles of the Tollroad & 635-LBJ intersection in North Dallas. Top private schools are:

St Mark's School of Texas
Browser Not Supported (all of the links really do work!)Boys independent (though loosely Episopalian) college prep school for grades 1-12. Easily the #1 private school in all of DFW for academic rigor and sports. Signifcant number of spots for grades 1, 5, and 9. Other years, maybe only 2-5 openings per grade.

The Hockaday School
Browser Not Supported Girls independent college prep school for PK-12. Also offers boarding option. Known for diversity- websites says 30 languages spoken on campus, 37% diverse student body, boarders from around the US & World.

The Greenhill School
Browser Not Supported PK-12. Boys & Girls. Independent college prep school. Leans a little more liberal than the other elite private schools in Dallas. Known for diversity, but no hard %'s on website.

If you are intersted in Catholic, Cistercian (Boys 5-12), St Monica (Co-ed PK-8), Jesuit (Boys 9-12), and Ursuline (Girls 9-12, Bill Gates' wife is an alumna and a BIG supporter) are the best Dallas has to offer. Cisterican is in Irving (near DFW airport), but the rest are in the same general area as the other private schools. Catholic schools are less expensive and typically very diverse- espeically socioeconomically.

There are no private schools worth attending in the northern burbs. They are weak academically compared to the public schools in those areas.

[Soon2BTXN]

Originally Posted by pappy97

Good for you getting with an Indian guy (I'm Indian too, but born and raised in the US).

Thanks!

Originally Posted by pappy97

If private school will never be an option, and your future hubby is willing to do the long commute to Sherman, then I agree with TC80's suggestion that you will want to live (buy or rent) in the following school districts: Southlake Carroll ISD, Plano West's feeder, Highland Park ISD, and Coppell ISD.

I went to school in a great public school district (Fairfax County in Virginia) and loved it. I would like for them to have that exposure. However, this may change after we approach private schools seriously.

Originally Posted by pappy97

And from my own observations, the number of Asian-Americans in Allen and McKinney are growing fast, especially Allen. And like I said, the doctor I know is Indian, his family is Indian (not mixed), and they LOVE McKinney and do not feel out of place living there.

Our Realtor is also E. Indian and I think that is why she is strongly suggesting Allen, McKinney and Plano.

Thank you for your input. I'm so glad you referenced the doctor in Sherman.

[Soon2BTXN]

Originally Posted by TurtleCreek80

OP, I wish we had know that info from the start!!

I'm sorry I did not share this information earlier. I did not know that it would make a big difference but I guess it did.

Originally Posted by TurtleCreek80

The only public ISD's that are significantly better than average are Carroll ISD (Southlake), Plano West part of PISD, Highland Park ISD, and Coppell ISD. Southlake and Highland Park are the wealthiest and also the least diverse, with Southlake being 90% white and Highland Park/University Park being 95% white. Coppell's HS is 65% white, 18% Asian/Indian, 10% Hispanic, & 6% black. The main zip code for West Plano is 82% white, 3% black, 11% Asian, 4% other (multi-racial, American Indian, etc).

This goes back to our discussion from yesterday that diverse & good schools don't really go hand-in-hand in the DFW area since the best schools are in the wealthiest areas - and those areas tend to be much less diverse.

I'm really OK with these stats. The schools I went to (Fairfax County in Virginia) I believe my ethnicity was about 6% of the population. Diversity is important to us but not at the sacrifice of educational quality.

Originally Posted by TurtleCreek80

I pulled these stats from a recent thread about "best schools". Here are the academic stats for these four high schools. I think they speak for themselves, especially when compared to McKinney, Frisco, and some of the other northern burb districts you are considering:

Highland Park High School (HPISD- Exemplary Rated District)
-1203 SAT average (Math + Verbal scores only). #1 highest SAT in North Texas public schools
-Newsweek Magazine ranked #38 high school in the entire United States (based on Advanced Placement tests taken)
-468 students in graduating class (class of 2009)
-12 National Merit Semifinalists; 19 Commended (4% of class)
-2009 graduates admitted to 3 of 8 Ivy League Schools, plus Duke, Rice, Northwestern, all 3 US Service Academies, etc.

West Plano High School (PISD- Recognized Rated District)
-1179 SAT average (Math + Verbal scores only) #2 highest SAT in North Texas public schools
-approx 1020 students in 2010 graduating class
-32 National Merit Finalists, 52 Commended (5% of class)
-college info not on school's website

Carroll High School (Southlake, CISD- Exemplary Rated District)
-1083 SAT average (Math + Verbal scores only) #5 highest SAT in North Texas public schools.
-600 students in 2009 graduating class
-11 National Merit Finalists, 40 Commended (6% of class)
No college acceptance info on school's website.

Coppell High School (CISD- Exemplary Rated District)
-1135 SAT average (Math + Verbal scores only) #3 highest SAT in North Texas public schools
-713 students in 2009 graduating class
-20 National Merit Semifinalists, 33 Commended (7% of class)
-Past 2 years seniors have enrolled in 6 of 8 Ivies, Amherst, Duke, Rice, all 3 US Service Academies, Stanford, etc.

If you are intersted in private schools AT ALL, get moving now for next school year. Most schools require all applications to be submited by late December/early January. Most of these schools are located within 2 miles of the Tollroad & 635-LBJ intersection in North Dallas. Top private schools are:

St Mark's School of Texas
Browser Not Supported (all of the links really do work!)Boys independent (though loosely Episopalian) college prep school for grades 1-12. Easily the #1 private school in all of DFW for academic rigor and sports. Signifcant number of spots for grades 1, 5, and 9. Other years, maybe only 2-5 openings per grade.

The Hockaday School
Browser Not Supported Girls independent college prep school for PK-12. Also offers boarding option. Known for diversity- websites says 30 languages spoken on campus, 37% diverse student body, boarders from around the US & World.

The Greenhill School
Browser Not Supported PK-12. Boys & Girls. Independent college prep school. Leans a little more liberal than the other elite private schools in Dallas. Known for diversity, but no hard %'s on website.

If you are intersted in Catholic, Cistercian (Boys 5-12), St Monica (Co-ed PK-8), Jesuit (Boys 9-12), and Ursuline (Girls 9-12, Bill Gates' wife is an alumna and a BIG supporter) are the best Dallas has to offer. Cisterican is in Irving (near DFW airport), but the rest are in the same general area as the other private schools. Catholic schools are less expensive and typically very diverse- espeically socioeconomically.

There are no private schools worth attending in the northern burbs. They are weak academically compared to the public schools in those areas.

Thank you so much for pulling this information. I wish I could give you a tangible hug for this but here is a cyberhug {{{{{TurtleCreek80}}}}}!

Thank you all for being so helpful to me. I greatly appreciate it. I will follow up to let you know where we bought a home. I am so excited to be moving to Texas. We begin our drive there on November 8, 2010! WOO'HOO!

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by Soon2BTXN

Thank you all for being so helpful to me. I greatly appreciate it. I will follow up to let you know where we bought a home. I am so excited to be moving to Texas. We begin our drive there on November 8, 2010! WOO'HOO!

Please do let us know! We always give advice and then the OP's run off and never tell us what the final decision was. Good luck!!

[MurphyPl1]

Plano East is an excellent school (please see the thread about National Merit Semi-Finalists)

And while some of the schools are not as strong, there are definitely feeder patterns that will rival any in West Plano. However, they are in Murphy, which also happens to be incredibly diverse.

However I've not mentioned it before now because it would be a horrible commute to Sherman. And West Plano would be a very similar situation.

[pappy97]

Originally Posted by Soon2BTXN

Our Realtor is also E. Indian and I think that is why she is strongly suggesting Allen, McKinney and Plano.

Thank you for your input. I'm so glad you referenced the doctor in Sherman.

You are welcome, and as to your realtor, that's the thing: you probably already know that Indians like suggesting to other Indians places to live that already have Indians living there, so given that and one person's commute to Plano, that's why your realtor who is Indian is suggesting Allen/McKinney/Plano.

I'm also guessing you guys don't have kids yet, but will in the future. Why I mention that is because by the time those kids are born and get old enough to socialize, there will be even more kids of mixed ethnicity (in general and in the DFW metro) if that is an issue you are concerned about.

[Soon2BTXN]

Originally Posted by pappy97

You are welcome, and as to your realtor, that's the thing: you probably already know that Indians like suggesting to other Indians places to live that already have Indians living there, so given that and one person's commute to Plano, that's why your realtor who is Indian is suggesting Allen/McKinney/Plano.

I'm also guessing you guys don't have kids yet, but will in the future. Why I mention that is because by the time those kids are born and get old enough to socialize, there will be even more kids of mixed ethnicity (in general and in the DFW metro) if that is an issue you are concerned about.

Yea, I noticed that. The funny thing is...the first week he was in that area he found a cricket game and got to play that same week.

No, we don't have children yet. Originally we thought about buying a place just for now then moving when we have children but there has been so much mixed information about when the housing market will turn into a seller's market. Also, it is such a pain to move and time goes by so fast. This is why the school districts are so important to us now.

I have no doubt we will see mixed kids. We see them a lot where we are at now. Unfortunately, we don't see a lot of the Indian and something else mix. In Illinois that has been a rare sight. I have seen descendants of East Indians born and raised in the West Indies (coolies) do more mixing but their culture is more African based. Their views on mixing are different. This I think you know. Well, we will see...

[Soon2BTXN]

OK, I'm back and I'm frustrated.

My fiancee has been looking at homes in Plano, Allen and McKinney. I'm really disappointed in the homes coming up available in our price range (increased now to $260K max) in Plano and Allen with a pool.

I am really terrified to buy a home in McKinney because of the built out percentage, number of homes up for sale in that city and number of new homes coming up on the market. In Plano and Allen I can see how you keep the resale value because for those that want to live there, there are limited homes coming up for sale.

I abhor (yea...a strong word) the home styles in Plano and for the most part Allen. I love the home styles in Frisco and Prosper (newer homes with hardwoods, sq footage we want, pool, etc.) for the same price. Prosper seems to have good schools as well. What do you all think of Prosper? How would you rank McKinney, Frisco and Prosper in order of areas for good resale value and schools? I'm really getting frustrated.

Thank you in advance.

[dgz]

Or consider east of Plano? For example: Murphy, Wylie, Parker, etc. Good schools and more for your money.