The Missing Person In The Godhead. What Happen to The Third Godhead?

[katjonjj]

Originally Posted by I_Feel_Fat_2

Okay someone answer this. Why did the Jewish people never mention a trinity? I mean they were god's chosen people right? Wouldn't they know the nature of their own god who chose them? I think the Pentecostals believe in the Oness of god. That makes a little more sense to me.

They didn't believe God was anything but God with spirit. There is only ONE true God. They did not believe the coming Messiah (which is the same one we believe is Jesus) that was foretold in the OT (the same one we believe foretold the coming) was God... They expected him to be a man possessing God's spirit that would help them recover the Kingdom of Israel....

[justamere10]

I did a quick search and came up with the following comments about the 4th century trinity doctrine that many church leaders still insist that their followers accept. What follows is publicly available on the internet and is not from an LDS source. I may or may not agree with it in its entirety and I'm not a scholar who can vouch for its accuracy or criticize it. But it seems to be on topic here.

(Oops, red ink above, looks like I broke some laws. I highly recommend to trinity believers and non-believers alike that they click the link below and read the full article. It's not long and it's very easy to read and understand. After all, some of us may, according to one writer here, be going to hell to burn forever if we don't fully inform ourselves about that doctrine and make the right decision regarding it...)

By the way, I respect the right of anyone to believe whatever they will.


"Trinity" in the Bible?

A PROTESTANT publication states: "The word Trinity is not found in the Bible . . . It did not find a place formally in the theology of the church till the 4th century." (The Illustrated Bible Dictionary) And a Catholic authority says that the Trinity "is not . . . directly and immediately [the] word of God."—New Catholic Encyclopedia.

The Catholic Encyclopedia also comments: "In Scripture there is as yet no single term by which the Three Divine Persons are denoted together. The word [tri'as] (of which the Latin trinitas is a translation) is first found in Theophilus of Antioch about A. D. 180. . . . Shortly afterwards it appears in its Latin form of trinitas in Tertullian."

http://watchtower.org/e/ti/article_03.htm

[katjonjj]

Originally Posted by justamere10

I did a quick search and came up with the following comments about the 4th century trinity doctrine that many church leaders still insist that their followers accept. What follows is publicly available on the internet and is not from an LDS source. I may or may not agree with it in its entirety and I'm not a scholar who can vouch for its accuracy or criticize it. But it seems to be on topic here.

(Oops, red ink above, looks like I broke some laws. I highly recommend to trinity believers and non-believers alike that they click the link below and read the full article. It's not long and it's very easy to read and understand. After all, some of us may, according to one writer here, be going to hell to burn forever if we don't fully inform ourselves about that doctrine and make the right decision regarding it...)

By the way, I respect the right of anyone to believe whatever they will.


"Trinity" in the Bible?

A PROTESTANT publication states: "The word Trinity is not found in the Bible . . . It did not find a place formally in the theology of the church till the 4th century." (The Illustrated Bible Dictionary) And a Catholic authority says that the Trinity "is not . . . directly and immediately [the] word of God."—New Catholic Encyclopedia.

The Catholic Encyclopedia also comments: "In Scripture there is as yet no single term by which the Three Divine Persons are denoted together. The word [tri'as] (of which the Latin trinitas is a translation) is first found in Theophilus of Antioch about A. D. 180. . . . Shortly afterwards it appears in its Latin form of trinitas in Tertullian."

http://watchtower.org/e/ti/article_03.htm

Good article. It is true that the Jews who read and studied and lived the OT did not expect the Messiah to be God nor do they believe in the trinity. Some Jewish/Christian mixes will say that there is a two part God though but they are just saying that Jesus and God are two persons in one and the Holy Spirit is not a separate person... Seems like they have the same view of the Christians who value Jesus more than God. But that is just my opinion.

Thanks for the post.

[twin.spin]

Originally Posted by I_Feel_Fat_2

You've got a good point there. Where was Jesus in this trinity before he was actually born? Was his body up there floating around somewhere and then he magically turned into a spiritual sperm to be concieved? I'm not trying to be disrespectful. I really am trying to grasp this concept.

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
.
Those who deny the truth, change John 1:1 in one way, shape or form. Not getting to techicnal, Jesus was with God and at the same time God. The most common way and easiest is to re-word it to say in effect:

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was "a" god."


Why didn't Jesus prove himself as God....because that wasn't his main purpose for being here, that purpose is to come later.

However, he did prove he was God in terms that the Jews knew from OT scripture.

• Isaiah 45:22 "Turn to me and be saved, all you ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no other.
• Joel 2:32 And everyone who calls on the name of the LORD will be saved
• Jeremiah 31:34 No longer will a man teach his neighbor, or a man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' because they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest," declares the LORD. "For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more."
• Ecclesiastes 8:8 No man has power over the wind to contain it ; so no one has power over the day of his death

Points is:

• There is only One God - there is no other
• God only saves
• God only has the power to forgive sin
• God only has power over nature (i.e. the wind) or death

This is why the religious leaders accused Jesus. It wasn't about the existance of the triune of God, but that he was.

Mark 2:7
"Why does this fellow talk like that? He's blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?"



What does Jesus do:

• He raises the dead - unlike the prophets who invoke the name of God
• He raises himself from the dead - thus the request by those who are his enemies to have guards around the tomb
• He forgives sins - then proves it by make the lame walk
• He commands the storm to cease

It's the Jews who are connecting Jesus' word as the equivalent as blaspheming to God ..... John 10:33"We are not stoning you for any of these," replied the Jews, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."

What does Jesus say about blasphemy (or more like what he doesn't say)
He doesn't say in Matthew 12:31

• "blaspheming against God, and your sins will not be forgiven"
• "blaspheming against the Father, and your sins will not be forgiven"
• "blaspheming against Me because I claim to be God, and your sins will not be forgiven"

He says: blasphemy against the [Holy] Spirit will not be forgiven.

It was not a matter of if there was a triune God.

Part of Jesus' 2nd return will be to prove the trinity, which so many here are demanding for "prove to me".....be careful of what you wish. Do you think every knee will bow ... willingly?

[justamere10]

Originally Posted by twin.spin

Do you think every knee will bow ... willingly?

Yes, I do. As I understand it, although there will still be a variety of religious denominations at least at the beginning of the Millennium, those who survive His glorious "second" coming will have already seen with their own eyes that he is an exalted being. And they will know that he is king of kings, the living head of the theocracy that will rule the temporal affairs of this entire planet for one thousand years.

Who would not bow the knee to such a person descending from the sky in glory? Any who might will, again as I understand it, be unprepared, among the wicked, and physically destroyed by the brightness of his coming.