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Its funny miss shawn that you say you don't have any doctrinal bias in your studying the bible yet your conclusions are as far as I can tell 100% fundamental protestant nondenominational cartoon Christianity as if it were from the back of the same crackerjack box every other Fundamentalist Christian is eating from.
Don't you think it strange that the vast majority of Christians in the first 4 centuries believed in universal reconciliation or apocatastasis? Many of whom spoke koine Greek natively and Hebrew as well? Isn't it funny that in the 6th century when Rome legally gained power over Christianity all the sudden UR becomes heresy and Eternal torture becomes Gospel truth!? These facts mean nothing to you ... Why? Because you want eternal hell to be true, and that is all i am left to conclude from your words.
Its funny miss shawn that you say you don't have any doctrinal bias in your studying the bible yet your conclusions are as far as I can tell 100% fundamental protestant nondenominational cartoon Christianity as if it were from the back of the same crackerjack box every other Fundamentalist Christian is eating from.
Don't you think it strange that the vast majority of Christians in the first 4 centuries believed in universal reconciliation or apocatastasis? Many of whom spoke koine Greek natively and Hebrew as well? Isn't it funny that in the 6th century when Rome legally gained power over Christianity all the sudden UR becomes heresy and Eternal torture becomes Gospel truth!? These facts mean nothing to you ... Why? Because you want eternal hell to be true, and that is all i am left to conclude from your words.
Yea but can you prove this from the scriptures that the first 4 centuries the vast majority of believers believed in UR. ? Camps waits for slap on the back from funevangelicals for great question.
When I look at scripture, I don't look at it based on doctrine. I look at it for what it says. Confusion comes when people try to read between the lines instead of reading the scripture and taking it for what it says.
Well, now I do, because I don't see the scripture to prove your belief or your explanation either.
I don't focus my time or spend alot of time on how long hell will be. My only concern is knowing and understanding what scripture says.
Some univ. say that they believe that God will punish persons in hell for an age, ok, well, if He does, does it say that God will then bring them from hell into His presence? But if you flipped the question around on me, and said does it say that they want be with God? Well, it does because they are being destroyed, and it doesn't say that God is restoring them in His presence.
See, I don't see any prove in scripture. I only see that God will punish and destroy the wicked. So, I am just reading scripture. I'm not against univ. I just don't see any scripture to back it up.
Miss. Shawn ... I allowed myself to become frustrated with you and i want to apologize ... I forget how i felt when i believed in the doctrine of eternal hell ... I was born into Christianity and i believed in ET all my life until about 3 years ago.
Concerning your statement ...
Quote:
Some univ. say that they believe that God will punish persons in hell for an age, ok, well, if He does, does it say that God will then bring them from hell into His presence?
I want you to read this.
Rev 14:10
"The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:"
They are in Gods presence during the time that they are in the lake of fire.
Yea but can you prove this from the scriptures that the first 4 centuries the vast majority of believers believed in UR. ? Camps waits for slap on the back from funevangelicals for great question.
Yea but can you prove this from the scriptures that the first 4 centuries the vast majority of believers believed in UR. ? Camps waits for slap on the back from funevangelicals for great question.
Yeah, show me the scripture where it states that for the first 4 centuries the majority of believers were CU`s.
Was that in the OT? Maybe it was in Genesis!
Sorry,too late for that. The theology that you`ve been taught and now adhere to totally contradicts the bible, you just can`t see it.
So, they will FINALLY realize...meaning they didn`t realize before. Exactly!! God works through you when you don`t even realize it. Out of the mouth`s of babes. You are right, they don`t realize ..their eyes have not been opened to the truth. But there will come a day when they DO realize it. But let not your heart be troubled. God will not shut the door on them like you seem to want to do. Thank God he is in control and not you. Thank God he is more merciful than you seem to be.
Sorry but the theology stuff you are claiming is NOT Biblical and most definitely is the opposite of what the Bible, which is God's Word teaches. I hope someday you can see that.
Yes thank God that neither one of us in control! I'm sure He is more merciful.
I beileve that anyone that believes that hell ils eternal chooses to believe something other than the truth that being that God will accomplish His purposes in Jesus Christ, the reconciliation of all to Himself, the reuniting of all in Jesus Christ.
Ephesians 1: 5-10
"He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will, to the praise of the glory of His grace which He freely bestowed on us in the Beloved. In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace, which He lavished upon us. In all wisdom and insight He made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His kind intention which He purposed in Him with a view to an administration suitable to the fulness of the times, that is the *summing up of all things in Christ, things in the heavens, and things upon the earth."
*summing up=anakephalaioomai=to gather together again in one, to reunite under one head as in Eph. 1 (mid. voice) (Hebrew/Greek Key Word Study)
Psalm 81:15
15Those hating Jehovah feign obedience to Him, But their time is -- to the age. (YLT)
Matthew 25:46
46And these shall go away to punishment age-during, but the righteous to life age-during.' (YLT)
God bless
Last edited by ShanaBrown; 07-12-2009 at 12:25 AM..
Psalm 81:15
Those who hate the LORD would cringe before him, and their punishment would last forever
Matthew 25:46
"Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."
Anyone who really believes that hell is not eternal chooses to believe something other than the truth. There are only two outcomes...both are eternal.
The words you believe to amount to eterntiy do not mean what the translation into eglish proclaims. If you are so certain about eternal torture, provide a verse that doesn't employ aion, or its adjectives.
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