Are some racial stereotypes or perceptions depicted in US media less pronounced in Canada than in the United States? (houses, employment)
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Ok so I read it. In Canada you can sponsor spouses and minor siblings or children. This is what a US permanent resident can sponsor.
In the USA a US citizen can also sponsor an adult sibling, and adult children, AND their spouses and minor children. These people will have to be admitted under the point system to get into Canada. Please note that I have relatives in Canada and I am familiar with how they got into Canada. Not only that but my father, a doctor, used to examine people who were applying for immigrant visas to migrate to Canada, so became very familiar with your point system.
Canada has tighter immigration rules than does the USA, and indeed there are those who suggest that the US moves to the Canadian system to reduce the % of relatives coming under the family unification system, as the USA has no way of determining whether these immigrants are the type which the country needs.
Canada also ferociously protects its borders against illegal immigrants, which is why you seem to think that Canada is more generous towards them. No illegal immigrant is going to be so bold as to indicate to the Canadian gov't that they should be allowed to stay. Only in the USA can some one who broke the laws regarding permanent residency can be so bold as to reveal who they are, and think that they can get away with it.
There are a few more links in the link I provided to you which state a Canadian citizen or perm resident can sponsor parents, grandparents and 'other' relatives..Which is very open ended wouldn't you say?
When I spoke of illegals I was referring to the fact that these people, 11 million as you say are not afforded the same equality as native citizens and make most likely much less than others yet they aren't part of labour stats, if they were they would pull things down.
All of the black mayors on that list represent a city with at least 10% of the population being black. You want to know how many cities in Canada have a population blacks making up 10% of its population? 5. In the whole country. They are: Shelburne, Ajax, Brampton, Pickering and North Preston. Of those, none, with the exception of North Preston, is more than 15% black. As a side, North Preston which is predominately black >70% has a higher average income than the average Nova Scotian. It is also one of the oldest black settlements in Canada.
I'm sure there are cities in the country with a black mayor. However, you won't see the same representation that you find in American cities.
The larger a group becomes in any country the more opportunities will come its way.. Canada has a much smaller percentage of blacks compared to the U.S so seems reasonable to me that there is more examples of success but as long as the situation remains as it is for soooooo many in that country it is hardly the time to go around bragging about racial equality being an example for the world. Same with Canada by the way - we have work to do. By 2030 67% of Toronto will be vis min so lets get to work making Canada a real star in equality for All groups.
If you read the articles ewara19 posted it actually paints a different picture.
There is not one group within the visible minority community in Canada that is properly represented in any facet of political or professional life. So my question is how do you know that once your black population grows, any level of success will follow?
Why hasn't the South and East Asian community equaled or surpassed whites in the country, even though they are viewed as the model immigrant group that values education and hard work? Asian's in the US have out-earned whites since the 2000 census, so over a decade now and have pulled away.
Are you saying that there are not enough Asians in Canada to break through? I think we both know that is not the case. So as a Black person I unfortunately don't have any reason to believe that it will be as simple as having "more" of us to really see any changes of significance.
If you read the articles ewara19 posted it actually paints a different picture.
There is not one group within the visible minority community in Canada that is properly represented in any facet of political or professional life. So my question is how do you know that once your black population grows, any level of success will follow?
Why hasn't the South and East Asian community equaled or surpassed whites in the country, even though they are viewed as the model immigrant group that values education and hard work? Asian's in the US have out-earned whites since the 2000 census, so over a decade now and have pulled away.
Are you saying that there are not enough Asians in Canada to break through? I think we both know that is not the case. So as a Black person I unfortunately don't have any reason to believe that it will be as simple as having "more" of us to really see any changes of significance.
I think that Asians and all the groups within are doing better than blacks in Canada..I believe East Asians in particular are not too far off from their white counterparts in income. 2006 stats would bear that out.. I think more recent stats would support even further closing of the gap.. Interestingly, I have read that vis mins born in Canada are no more likely to earn less than their white counterparts born in Canada as per a recent stats Can publication. What this suggests to me is that these vis mins who have no language or adjustment barriers to life in Canada have an equal chance at success as anyone else.
Asian immigrants doing better in the U.S over Canada can suggest multiple factors such as more higher income opportunities in the fields they are educated in(you are a good example of a person, ignore race or creed just a human being in an industry that has higher earning potential than in Canada), differing immigration policies between Canada and the U.S. etc. Id also like to compare median incomes between all groups vs per capita in both countries. For example, GDP per capita in the U.S is higher than Canada yet median incomes in Canada are slightly higher than the U.S so id like to see what the median income is for a black in Canada vs a black in the U.S, an Indian in the U.S vs an Indian in Canada etc... If 20 percent of Asians in the U.S are making loads of dough for instance what about the other 80 percent.
As for numbers - I think if you inflated the number of blacks in Canada to parallel relative number representation as in the U.S, than you definately would see more example of black success. Having said that, it would be small consolation if the majority of that larger representation were living in similar conditions as the majority of blacks are living in the U.S. Lets face it Edward, you are surely not representative of the majority of your black peers in the U.S.
You keep beating Canada over the head with a club about municipal politics and vis min representation, fair enough but what about Prov and Fed M.P.P and M.P representation of minorities in the GTA... How does that look?
Here is an interesting article - two surprising things of note is
1. Canada and the U.S dont have the same definitions for what contitutes a visible minority.
2. According to the African Canadian legal clinic "with the notable exception of African Canadian males, visible minorities who are native born are for the most part not disadvantaged"
I think that Asians and all the groups within are doing better than blacks in Canada..I believe East Asians in particular are not too far off from their white counterparts in income. 2006 stats would bear that out.. I think more recent stats would support even further closing of the gap.. Interestingly, I have read that vis mins born in Canada are no more likely to earn less than their white counterparts born in Canada as per a recent stats Can publication. What this suggests to me is that these vis mins who have no language or adjustment barriers to life in Canada have an equal chance at success as anyone else.
I would like to see those numbers, because according to this article Canadian Born VM members still are out-earned by their white counterparts.
As far as not being too far off from their white peers, as I said Asians in the US have been out-earning their white peers for over 14 years now. Possibly it has been even further, but I only looked up the stats from 2000 onward.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2
immigrants doing better in the U.S over Canada can suggest multiple factors such as more higher income opportunities in the fields they are educated in(you are a good example of a person, ignore race or creed just a human being in an industry that has higher earning potential than in Canada), differing immigration policies between Canada and the U.S. etc. Id also like to compare median incomes between all groups vs per capita in both countries. For example, GDP per capita in the U.S is higher than Canada yet median incomes in Canada are slightly higher than the U.S so id like to see what the median income is for a black in Canada vs a black in the U.S, an Indian in the U.S vs an Indian in Canada etc... If 20 percent of Asians in the U.S are making loads of dough for instance what about the other 80 percent.
Immigrants to the US and Canada face the same challenges as their originally land in a new country. It is never easy to compete when you are new, I know that first hand. Canada has a strict skill based point system in place, so many of these immigrants are coming into the country not only educated but skilled. So I am not sure what immigration policy has to do with this. The major difference is that their skills and foreign experience tends to be more accepted in the US vs. Canada.
The numbers for Asians out-earning whites in US are based on Median income btw.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2
for numbers - I think if you inflated the number of blacks in Canada to parallel relative number representation as in the U.S, than you definately would see more example of black success. Having said that, it would be small consolation if the majority of that larger representation were living in similar conditions as the majority of blacks are living in the U.S. Lets face it Edward, you are surely not representative of the majority of your black peers in the U.S.
The issue is that we are not expecting Canada to equal the US when it comes to total numbers, the black population in the US will always be larger than Canada. What we are expecting is for the black population to perform relative to the population in Canada, and that is not the case.
As far as me being an outlier, that really does not matter. I am not sure where you are getting your information from, but most blacks in the US are not living in poverty. As of 2010 this is how the black community is broken down, based on tax bracket/earnings:
1.2% - Upper class
8.1% - Upper Middle Class
38.4% - Middle Class
28.8% - Working Class
23.5% - Poverty
I am not going to disclose my household income, but yes I am not in the group with the majority of my peers. The tax bracket that represents the highest portion of my community is firmly middle class though. I am not quite sure why people think we are mostly on social assistance and getting shot at every day of our lives.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2
keep beating Canada over the head with a club about municipal politics and vis min representation, fair enough but what about Prov and Fed M.P.P and M.P representation of minorities in the GTA... How does that look?
Underrepresented. In the 41st Parliament Visible minorities made up 9.4%, while in Canada they represent 16.2% of the population. So the community is not adequately represented in Parliament.
Here is an interesting article - two surprising things of note is
1. Canada and the U.S dont have the same definitions for what contitutes a visible minority.
2. According to the African Canadian legal clinic "with the notable exception of African Canadian males, visible minorities who are native born are for the most part not disadvantaged"
I will give it a read in a bit. But I don't recall anyone suggesting that most Visible Minorities are disadvantaged. We are comparing two affluent G8 nations, thankfully even the poor are well off compared to much of the world.
It is troubling that they say except African Canadian males. How do they define "disadvantaged"? Last I read the highest poverty rate was 40% which was amongst males of African heritage. While high, it is still not "most" which would be >50%
Here's a university thesis on discrimination that looks interesting. I read a bit of it but my eyes are crossing from tiredness. http://www.sfu.ca/~pendakur/colour.pdf
Basically I gather it finds a certain amount of income disparity that cannot be explained by other factors. The gap is less for visible minority women - I guess because women are already discriminated against enough in terms of income, and there's a limit as to how much more it is possible to discriminate.
One interesting fact from the paper is that Greek and Balkan men have some of the highest income differences when compared to UK white men.
And one point that has not been brought up in this thread is culture and how that might play into income differences. By culture, I am not talking about generic black culture but country specific culture - ie, Jamaican culture versus West African culture. Or Greek culture versus Italian culture.
Anyway, for those who are more interested than the average person might be, I thought the link might be interesting.
the stats can publication I was referring to was actually 2004 not 2014, must have been tired when I read it lol. Anyway the wording used for native born vis mins is that they are were no more likely than others born in Canada to experience low income.. but yes white native born Canadians still make more than non white collectively - unfortunately but the disparity is highly variable.. I believe in the article I posted it stated that we need to examine each group closely because some are more disadvantaged than others. It would appear Japanese Canadians, based on the article are at parity with their white peers and east Asians are performing closer to parity than other vis mins like blacks and south asians.
As Netwit pointed out, even some Euro ethnic groups aren't at parity with their white British counterparts. Greeks and Balkans earn less than some vis min groups.
I stand by what I said about per capita and median incomes. Per capita Americans make more but median incomes are higher in Canada so it looks to me it is a fair assumption that per capita income numbers for any group don't tell the whole story about how the avg joe blow is doing.
As for levels of poverty and low income for blacks in the U.S a full half are not doing well - while this is not majority it is alot of people and clearly it is a problem....nuff said about that - I didn't ask u to disclose income but I know that you are not representative of most black peers. Having said that neither am I so thats ok - work hard and you get rewarded, makes sense to me.
What percentage of the U.S is black? If you take that percentage and apply to Canada I think we would absolutely have more prominent examples of black success stories.
As for vis min representation in politics, I didn't state that repesentation was reflective of numbers but that in Prov and Fed terms it is better than municipal and probably growing. By 2030 67 percent of the GT is going to be vis min so look for increasi g political representation.
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