Universal Health Care ! CA (to live in, prices, internship)

[Perma Bear]

Originally Posted by expatCA

Watch businesses leave.

Maybe houses won't cost a million dollars then

[StanleysOwl]

Originally Posted by ringwise

Well, those folks are eating something, aren't they? You say they can't get to decent food, but they sure can get to crap food. And they can certainly order just about any food from Amazon. Might not be fresh veggies, but there are other healthy options that can be found if they are motivated to do so.

Partially so. Yes. Because the marketplace is changing recently to make delivery more a reality. But Mars" point was largely the case for a very long time. And over the many decades of the 20th century when food giant conglomerates executed a huge cultural conditioning to dependency on their products, habits took effect that could only be satisfied by s*8t food. To further exacerbate the crime, the ag and food corporations enlisted scientists to "study" diet and report to the public that they were now being offered solutions to both healthy and delightful living - when in fact they were being poisoned. More and more now the truths about addictive food conditioning to toxic choices is coming to light. But peoples' habits and addictions are hard to break. Change takes sacrifice and time. Suffering provides some motivation for change. But pharma and hi-tech-med now sell 'alternatives' to good habits ... they are daily advertising to convince the public that medications and proceedures are valid answers to all kinds of self-created maladies.

[RMESMH]

Originally Posted by StanleysOwl

There is a big difference, correct.

But Obamacare did not "absolutely" hurt those who pay for it. While it increased some costs for some payers, it overal reduced the rising trajectory of healthcare costs very significantly. It thus saved the payers money more often than not. It is a dismal reality of lesser evil. There have been numerous links to analysis of savings ypu are apparently overlooking, not sure why.

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by payutenyodagimas

as I posted previously, we don't pay any health insurance right now.

Of course you pay. Employees who receive health care insurance from their employer receive this benefit as part of your total compensation. If the benefit had never been there, your cash compensation would be much higher.

In fact, in different discussions, many people bemoan the paucity of raises in their compensation these past 20 years compared to the good ole' days. Most of that can be explained because the employer is funneling money that would have gone into raises instead into health care insurance premiums.

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

The government can hire all the soon to be unemployed health insurance employees.

Yes -- that's a possibility, and I'm sure some would be hired, but don't forget that governmental hiring is a very different kind of beast.

[JGC97]

Originally Posted by ringwise

Well, those folks are eating something, aren't they? You say they can't get to decent food, but they sure can get to crap food. And they can certainly order just about any food from Amazon. Might not be fresh veggies, but there are other healthy options that can be found if they are motivated to do so.

You think people who live in these depressed areas of the country are ordering food from Amazon?

But please, tell me about some of these healthy options one could find in a convenience store because I would love to know.

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by ringwise

Exactly. What we really need are people that have the guts to tell a patient "no, you cannot have that knee replacement, back surgery, etc. because the cause of your pain is that you are TOO FAT. Get back to me when you've lost the weight. But I'm guessing you won't be back because your pain will subside when you are not TOO FAT."

Many decades ago when I was in college living in the dorms and having a meal plan to use in the cafeteria, I often thought the cafeteria should have a scale as you enter. "Beep" it would say for many people. "Alarm, alarm, alarm" it would ring for people who are overweight.

Sorry, but you can't enter the cafeteria...

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by StanleysOwl

It did hurt many. But saved even more people from higher premiums and / or no coverage at all. The net result to the electorate overall has been increased coverage and savings vis slower rising costs than pre ACA.

False. ACA has little to do with it, according to the federal government.

[payutenyodagimas]

Originally Posted by SportyandMisty

Of course you pay. Employees who receive health care insurance from their employer receive this benefit in lieu of cash. If the benefit had never been there, your cash compensation would be much higher.

In fact, in different discussions, many people bemoan the paucity of raises in their compensation these past 20 years compared to the good ole' days. Most of that can be explained because the employer is funneling money that would have gone into raises instead into health care insurance premiums.

that's part of our pay/benefits. and whether we take it or not, its available for us, cant convert into cash.


that's why I also posted previously, we are paying already and cant understand how did they come out with the $400B estimate?


how about just get how much premiums the insurers collect right now then add how much the govt spends on Medicaid/obamacare?

[StanleysOwl]

Originally Posted by SportyandMisty

False. ACA has little to do with it, according to the federal government.

According to one analysis by one department study in the federal government. And contradicted by numerous other analyses by other departments and non-government studies. The drop in rise rate due to recession has been accounted for in various analyses. And noted that since the recession has ended the pre-recession rates of increase have not resumed except in specious cases of certain markets. Overall the result for national costs has improved. This is not to say the ACA is a great program. It clearly sucks and clearly is not producing the results hoped for.

One example:

You might not believe it's true, but more cost less after Obamacare began, a new analysis claims.

The average premiums in the nation's individual health insurance market "actually dropped significantly" in 2014, the year that the Affordable Care Act took effect, "even while consumers got better coverage," according to two health-care analysts whose findings challenge a popular narrative about Obamacare prices.

"In other words, people are getting more for less under the ACA," wrote Loren Adler and Paul Ginsburg in the article about their findings, published on the HealthAffairs Blog.

Adler and Ginsburg said their analysis shows that average premiums for a closely watched, important type of Obamacare plan — known as second-lowest cost silver plans — had average premiums in 2014 that "were between 10 and 21 percent lower than average individual market premiums in 2013, before the ACA." That's despite the fact that silver plans cover a larger percentage of customers' health costs than the average individual plan did before Obamacare.

The retail prices of the silver plans in each insurance market act as benchmarks for setting the federal subsidies that most Obamacare customers qualify for.

The authors say that prices of those benchmark plans are "still lower in 2016 than individual market premiums were in 2013, on average."

And even if Obamacare premiums jump by 10 to 15 percent next year, "they will still be far lower than premiums otherwise would have been in the absence of the law," the analysts say.

"That the ACA might have caused premiums to drop so precipitously when its marketplaces took effect may seem surprising at first — it was to us," they wrote.
"However, the premium reductions make more sense upon deeper analysis," said Adler, associate director of the Center for Health Policy at the Brookings Institution, and Ginsburg, who is a professor of the practice of health policy and management at the University of Southern California.Average health insurance premiums fell after Obamacare took effect, study says