late fees in ca (real estate, apartment, rentals)

[shoskins]

I was charged a late fee of $25.00 because my rent was late about an hour late.....my rent is due anywhere from the 1st to the 5th of every month.I get paid the 1st and the 5th however the 5th fell on Sun so I paid it on the 6th about 10:00 am or so...I come home and there is a note on my door stating to pay $25.00 late fee...I called the office and ask why is there a late fee when the office is 1: closed on the weekends 2: banks don't open until 9:00am on a business day there is no reasonable way to make a 9:00 am deadline for rent to be paid before a late charge is ordered. there should be some kind of legal help when paydays fall on a weekend...with my job if a payday fall on a Sat then we get paid the Fri before and if it falls on a Sun then its the Mon after...isn't that legal? Please can someone advise me of the law about this.

Thanks

[Paula Lynn]

That does seem a bit excessive, but if rents are due on the 1st, they're due on the 1st. You may have a grace period of 3 to 5 days, but in actuality, if you don't pay on the 1st, you are delinquent afterwards. The grace period is a courtesy. My rents are due on the 1st, and I give my residents to the morning of the 4th without late fees.

If this is the first time you've been late and have a good history with them, they should waive that fee. I would, but I can't speak for other managers.

[GreenMachine]

It's a bit rude, but then again, it's only $25. I'd just pay it and move on. It's not worth getting worked up over.

greeny

[da jammer]

When in doubt check your rental agreement, your question should be answered right there. Whatever you agreed to and subsequently signed, that is what matters. This is not unique to CA, legally binding rental agreements are in effect all over the country. Many landlords would waive this fee the first time with a good tenant but I wouldn't bank on it. Talk to them and see what you can do.

[Mel2882]

You are given 5 days of grace...that's almost a whole week. If you don't have it by that cut-off, chances are you aren't going to get more grace, even if it's just an hour. Because then where should the landlord draw the line? In my opinion, plan to have it before the 5th, because when you get months when the 5th falls on a Sunday, well...your lease agreement probably never said "when the 5th is a Sunday you have until the 6th..." because my guess is that if the check would have been in on Sunday the 5th (even if they're closed, do they not have a drop box?), the landlord would have found it right away when they opened on Monday morning and it wouldn't have been late anyway.

[Mel2882]

I'm going to check that out. Every apartment I've ever lived in has had it inside the rental agreement that there is a fee for turning in late rent...some people need a consequence for being irresponsible!

[Paula Lynn]

I have to disagree with Angelav (to a point). You can charge late fees as long as they are not excessive. We charge $50.00 after the 3rd of the month, but I don't enforce it. Situations happen. I had a resident who paid on the 8th - she was out of town. I didn't charge her a late fee. Another resident paid late last month - her grandmother died and she also was out of town. Did I charge her a late fee?? NO. The only time I do enforce late fees is if I have a new resident - as I have to get them in the habit of paying on time; I do not want them to feel they can pay whenever, and I also charge when I receive an NSF. I'm pretty flexible.

[cheff100]

There's something that needs to be made very clear here, and some people aren't quite getting the point. In California, state law directly prohibits late fees for residential leases. The landlord doesn't get to arbitrarily decide not to follow the law, even if there's a signed rental agreement that "allows" late fees.

All of you people who are complaining that the tenants need to be "taught a lesson" need to remember one thing - people make mistakes. You have no idea why they might be late on their rent. You may think that they're irresponsible, but it could also be that they were late because the payroll company that issues their paychecks made a mistake an didn't get their paycheck to them on time. Or perhaps they had an unexpected medical bill (it happened to me - I had an minor accident after my employer got rid of our insurance benefits. Five stitches in my head cost me $1,600. I had to wait to pay my landlord until the 3rd, instead of the 1st.)

BUT, all of this is a moot point. The facts are these: landlords have a long history of taking excessive advantage of their position. That is why tenant laws were created in the first place. LATE FEES ARE ILLEGAL. IT DOESN'T MATTER IF THE LANDLORD PUTS IT IN A CONTRACT, OR IF YOU SIGN AND AGREE TO IT. IT'S ILLEGAL. PERIOD.

For those of you who still don't get it, here's a comparison: We have a minimum wage law. In California, the minimum wage is $7.50/hr. If you hire someone to work for $2/hr and they work for you for one 40-hour work week, you still legally owe them $300. Not $80. Even if they signed a contract.

For those landlords out there who are getting upset about those "terrible tenants" out there, you have a law protecting you, too - you get to initiate eviction if the tenant hasn't paid the rent. It's that simple. If that sounds like it's way too much trouble for you, then get out of the real estate business - that's the reality of being a landlord.

[Ultrarunner]

If the rent is due on the first it is delinquent if paid after the first... unless the first falls on a bank holiday and then legally it is due on next business day.

If the owner agrees to allow a grace period, the rent is still delinquent if paid during this period.

Perhaps cheff100 would prefer a strict interpretation of the law in which property owners automatically send out 3 day notices on the second to each delinquent tenant?

California law DOES NOT prevent an owner from recovering additional out of pocket expenses incurred by accepting rent after the grace period. Courts have held the charges must be actual expenses and not punitive in nature.

Most managers are required to close the rent roll on the 5th of each month, deposit rents collected and provide a statement to the owner.

No matter how you look at it... any rent received after the grace period creates additional paper work and lost time.

I have not collected a late fee in over 10 years... and I have on several occasions accepted a tenant's post-dated check and used my own money to cover a residents rent... but as a serious matter, the date you get paid has nothing to do with the rental agreement...

Just try to pay your mortgage late and see how long that lasts without repercussions.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by cheff100

For those landlords out there who are getting upset about those "terrible tenants" out there, you have a law protecting you, too - you get to initiate eviction if the tenant hasn't paid the rent. It's that simple. If that sounds like it's way too much trouble for you, then get out of the real estate business - that's the reality of being a landlord.

Interesting point and exactly what I mentioned in my previous post... you would prefer the owner initiate eviction if the tenant has not paid the rent when due as opposed to a reasonable charge to cover actual expenses incurred?

There is nothing wrong with the Real Estate Business, however, I know quite a few long time property owners who have left the residential rental business... Residential Rentals are fraught with risk and liability issues unimaginable only a few years ago and many mom and pop owners are being driven out as a result.

Proving actual damages is not as hard as you might believe. Court cases have allowed the owner to charge residents paying after the grace period the actual payroll cost for the time required for the property manager to bank late rent.