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How do you determine the flight miles on potential routes not currently flown? I use to fly Houston to Singapore a number of times and would love to have avoided the Tokyo stop. The short leg of Tokyo to Singapore is similar to the trip from Houston to London and made it feel short haul by comparison to the Tokyo leg.
Great Circle Mapping is one website that will determine the Great Circle distances for you
IAH - NRT is 6,643 mi and NRT - SIN is 3,324 mi = 9,967 miles
IAH - SIN nonstop = 9,930 miles
The extra 37 miles only adds (+0.4%) distance to the trip, but the time lost in landing and taking off is considerably longer. Although nonstops from Dallas to Sydney have been added, they are just resuming nonstops from California to Singapore. It is unlikely that nonstop to Texas will come before the newer generation of jets after 2020.
Last edited by PacoMartin; 08-31-2016 at 06:18 AM..
Reason: gREAT
Korean Airlines is discontinuing their flight from LAX to GRU. Big Let down...I flew a couple of times with them and loved it
I see that it ends 24 Sept. American Airlines also flies from LAX to São Paulo–Guarulhos
You would think Korean Air would have one of their Sky Team partners take over the route from LAX to GRU. But they don't have a Brazilian Airline in Sky Team, and I don't think Delta is going to fly there.
Delta flies from GRU to Atlanta, Detroit, New York–JFK, Orlando–International
Delta flies from LAX internationally to
Tokyo–Haneda,
Tokyo–Narita (ends October 28, 2016)
Beijing–Capital (begins December 16, 2016),
Shanghai–Pudong,
Sydney,
I'm probably repeating myself, but even when upgraded to First, for me the Atlantic crossing is about as long as I want to sit on an airplane at one go. I guess that means I won't make it to Australia, but, whatever.
I don't doubt the technical ability to make these long flights and I know the pilots anyway work in shifts. I'm not saying it's in any way unsafe. I'm just saying that I have flown a lot in my career and I'm personally not interested in taking these long-haul flights.
I think the historical record supports your theory. Ultra long flights are very expensive propositions mostly because you are expending so much fuel to simply carry fuel. In the 1970's it was possible to connect the East Coast with Asia, and the West Coast with Australia. Advancement above those core connections is relatively slow.
Even today British Airways' longest flight is London-Heathrow to Buenos Aires-Ezeiza (11,111 km). They certainly expect to finally fly to Sydney nonstop in the next 5-7 years, but other than that there is very little interest in setting new long distance records.
But a lot of foreign airlines have very specific reasons for pushing ultra long distance flights. The two current longest are:
14,203 km Auckland -Dubai : Emirates
13,804 km Dallas/Fort Worth - Sydney :Qantas
Right. The idea in the US is to make money, but in other places they want prestige and name recognition. American airlines are established and self-sustaining, they don't need glamorous routes for self promotion. It would be nice, though..
I loved the ATL-DXB flight because it was fun for me. I guess it wasn't fun (money-wise) for Delta.
I loved the ATL-DXB flight because it was fun for me. I guess it wasn't fun (money-wise) for Delta.
The CEO of Delta was taking on some bruising battles against the Middle East airlines and Emirates in particular. They say that the airlines are being unfairly subsidized by their governments. The airlines say that only the airport is subsidized, and it is open to any airline in the world. While that is probably true, the airlines that get the most benefit are the ones headquartered there.
I suspect that the political battle had a lot to do with Delta discontinuing that flight.
LAX - AKL = 6,504 mi (common refueling spot for New Zealanders on way to London)
LAX - SYD = 7,488 mi
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch
I'm probably repeating myself, but even when upgraded to First, for me the Atlantic crossing is about as long as I want to sit on an airplane at one go. I guess that means I won't make it to Australia, but, whatever.
Some TATL crossings are pretty long. Chicago to Rome is 4,823 mi, LAX to Rome is 6,354 mi.
Even the domestic flight ATL-HNL is 4,502 mi.
But you can stop in Honolulu and break up your flight to Australia
LAX - HNL = 2,556 mi
HNL -SYD = 5,066 mi
total = 7,622 mi (124 miles more than nonstop)
As I said earlier, the nonstops from California to Sydney were first flown in 1976. I take it as a given that there are quite a few of those passengers, and I think there are four or more airlines that fly that route today. We can safely define Ultra Long Haul as longer than this route.
The thread was primarily concerned with routes that are longer than LAX-SYD of which only 7 have survived to the present day (on USA airlines). Five are on United, and one apiece on Delta and American.
I think there are over 30 (or possibly 40) routes flown by foreign airlines that are that distance.
Quote:
Originally Posted by emcee squared
Right. The idea in the US is to make money, but in other places they want prestige and name recognition. American airlines are established and self-sustaining, they don't need glamorous routes for self promotion. It would be nice, though..
It's also more important for them to get their businessmen to USA than for USA airlines to feed those markets. Exceptions being Hong Kong, Sydney, Johannesburg, and Mumbai.
Looks like 737's are about to become more common on the Atlantic
We've been having some debate about how much this will actually change travel. Certainly Cork, Dublin, Shannon, Belfast , Glasgow, Edinburgh, and Manchester will benefit. I would expect that Luton and Stansted with train connections to London will also benefit. Bombardier is designing the CS100 with London City airport in mind, but only in a very limited manner to compete with the 32 seat A318 flown by BA.
But how many flights will go to France outside of Paris? Spain just seems to far from most airports, and Portugal is even less popular. I think the TATL narrowbody will only reallly affect Ireland and UK.
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