Urban planning commentator gives photo tour of downtown Atlanta, and boy do we look like crap! (Boston: real estate, apartment)

[johnatl]

Originally Posted by blondandfun

Those aren't "tourists" sweetheart. Tourists don't go to cities for the lame shopping or lame museums of Atlanta... Most real tourists don't step off the plane and say "let's go to the mall!!!". What you are seeing is people who are stuck here on business and/or are just passing through. Generally they aren't here by choice or because Atlanta is greater than 30-50 other cities.

You must live under a rock or have never been to similar or SMALLER sized cities with active tourist industries.

Why haven't you left yet?

[PedestriAnne]

Originally Posted by blondandfun

Those aren't "tourists" sweetheart. Tourists don't go to cities for the lame shopping or lame museums of Atlanta... Most real tourists don't step off the plane and say "let's go to the mall!!!". What you are seeing is people who are stuck here on business and/or are just passing through. Generally they aren't here by choice or because Atlanta is greater than 30-50 other cities.

You must live under a rock or have never been to similar or SMALLER sized cities with active tourist industries.

"Sweetheart," huh? Oh, brother.

As a matter of fact, yes, I do live under a rock. The rent is low, it stays cool in the summer and there's no end of bugs to eat. I love it! After all, what else could my audacity to disagree with you possibly be but evidence of profound ignorance (and a subterranean lifestyle)?

Anyway...

Even if I don't count groups of adults who might well be here for business or on a really long layover, that leaves:

Families with children complete with strollers, fanny packs and gift-shop bags: Probably not just passing through or stuck here on business.

Clumps of college-age kids conversing in Russian, French, Spanish, German, Italian or Portuguese, then pooling their English to ask where the place they have circled on the map is: Could be passing through, very unlikely to be stuck here on business.

Couples with cameras and shopping bags: Probably not just passing through or stuck here on business.

Also, it's not as if you can't be here on business or just passing through and be a tourist at the very same time. If you're in an unfamiliar city, doing stuff, seeing things and going places just for the sake of doing it - even if you were in a meeting or conference two hours ago, or you're flying out four hours from now - what are you but a tourist right then?

You want to disqualify all those people as "real tourists" because they deviate from what you're sure is true, or because they go to things you wouldn't be interested in? Well...okay.

But if those aren't "real tourists," then I guess there really are "no true Scotsmen."

[PedestriAnne]

If you think the photo essay was harsh, you'll love the Kunstlercast he followed it up with. Much of what he says is true, but there are some glaring factual errors and quite a bit of dead-horse beating in the last few minutes.

You can tell that that the Peachtree Center area of downtown was designed following planning principles that were fashionable at a specific time, and that that time has long since passed.

I moved downtown a couple of months ago and one day I walked from Courtland and Ralph McGill to Courtland and Edgewood, then came back via Peachtree Center Ave. and nearly died of boredom. I'd never walked that stretch of street before, so I never realized how DEAD it is. I suspect the gerbil tubes (Am I the only one who's heard them called by another name?) are a direct cause of a lot of the lifelessness on those two streets. If hotel guests and office workers had to use the sidewalks, small stores and restaurants would want to be there. The sidewalks would be wider, the lighting would be better. It would be a whole different experience. But, as it stands it's nothing-nothing-nothing-HUGE HOTEL-nothing-nothing-parking lot-nothing-nothing-nothing-car rental place-nothing-nothing....

It would make a HUGE difference if the businesses in "The Mall at Peachtree Center" had been built either in the courtyard or in a ring around the perimeter of the buildings instead of underground. Staying open until seven or eight wouldn't hurt either.

I work downtown, south of Five Points, near where the 17th photo was taken. And it really is about as bad as the photo makes it look. It's so incredibly dead down there. When the Richard B Russell and Sam Nunn buildings opened and the federal agencies that used to occupy smaller buildings were consolidated there, that pretty much did the neighborhood in. I can't imagine what use all of those vacant buildings are ever going to be put to and I just wonder what the people who planned that and allowed it to happen were thinking?

[arjay57]

For all the criticism Peachtree Center gets, I can't see how it's worse (or as bad as) things like some of the Georgia State buildings and the Sam Nunn complex. Talk about fortresses.

It's also obvious that Kunstler's "photo tour" includes a lot of rear facades, parking garages and service entrances. You'll find those in every city. His essay is by no means representative of what's truly going on downtown.

Be that as it may, Atlanta does have a long way to go to restore its street life of 40 or 50 years ago. The business epicenter had clearly shifted north to Midtown, Buckhead and beyond by the 1980s and it won't be easy to reverse that. Fortunately (and I realize that depends on your point of view), state, federal, city and county governments have pumped billions into keeping downtown alive and that's likely to continue. So we'll see what the future holds.

Personally I'd love to see downtown get "wider" so that it's less centered around Peachtree. As PedistriAnne says, wouldn't it be great to see Peachtree Center Avenue lined with restaurants and retail?

[xavier132487]

Originally Posted by AcidSnake

If those concrete boxes and obnoxiously long gerbil chutes represented Atlanta's then approach to the "Space Age" construction concept, then it seems that some developer somewhere was inhaling too much of the carbon monoxide when he was driving down Georgia 400 on his way to conceiving another one of those cement monsters.

Seems more Gotham-like than "The Jetsons". Just sayin'...

Actually, if it was the 70s, GA 400 wouldn't have existed in its limited access form. Just saying.

[toll_booth]

Is the main opportunity for improving downtown, then, building architecture?

[blondandfun]

Originally Posted by toll_booth

Is the main opportunity for improving downtown, then, building architecture?

No, I think that the city is going to have to put some of its own money into a beautification program and clean it up, and make it more pedestrian friendly, safe, get rid of all those trashy street vendors.. stuff like that. Private developers have done enough. Time for the city to use its tax dollars they SHOULD have been making from all this growth to use... OH WAIT.

As much as I disdain Atlanta leave Portland alone, geez. The man practically brought this city up from the ashes.

[mike7586]

Originally Posted by blondandfun

No, I think that the city is going to have to put some of its own money into a beautification program and clean it up, and make it more pedestrian friendly, safe, get rid of all those trashy street vendors.. stuff like that. Private developers have done enough. Time for the city to use its tax dollars they SHOULD have been making from all this growth to use... OH WAIT.

Are you living under a rock?

City of Atlanta and General Growth Properties, Inc. kick off the new Atlanta Street Vending Program | Downtown Atlanta

http://www.atlantadowntown.com/initiatives/vending

[Iconographer]

Originally Posted by mike7586

Are you living under a rock?

City of Atlanta and General Growth Properties, Inc. kick off the new Atlanta Street Vending Program | Downtown Atlanta

Vending

No, honey; just in his parents' basement.

[Sikaranista]

He's complaining about so many parking facilities?

Good grief...Bostonians would give their left something-or-other to have good parking in the city.

And as far as the cement bunker-like buildings...they don't call it Hot-lanta for nothing, eh? Much easier to air condition when you have less heat load from windows.