The Greyhound Bus Station In Atlanta Need to Close (subsidized, vs.)

[MattCW]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Just because people don't want to drive to a transit station does not mean they are not able to take transit.

You are thinking far too short term.

Uh, no, that's you, I'm taking the long-term well into consideration while you are not. I also understand reality and how people behave.

People not wanting to drive to/from a transit station is not a reason that cannot use transit. In the longer run many will have new jobs and homes.

It's not about "wanting" to drive to a transit station, it's about having to go miles and potentially hours out of the way. Most of the trips along N Decatur would have to do just that. People have lives other than commuting, literally no one wakes up, and wants to find ways to extend their commutes, no one.

The capacity of the road needs to be improved and putting dedicated transit in those traffic lanes ups the capacity. Sure, all that capacity is not going to be used day one, but it does not need to.

Except...it doesn't. I just told you why it doesn't. Total capacity is only improved when all, or at least the majority of the trips through the corridor are able to be taken on transit. Why can't you try and refute the two scenarios above directly?

And no, getting away from car dependency and moving towards walk-abilty & transit is how you grow the city, not shrink it.

Not if you're going to destroy the city first by preventing people from being able to get around in the pursuit of that goal. Literally none of my arguments are against transit, my only argument is for doing it right.

You may personally prefer driving, but that is not a viable solution to handle the transportation needs of a growing and densifying city.

Then build the dang transit already! I have said many times on here how I commute from south of Decatur to the Lenox area. I pass the Avondale and Buckhead MARTA stations. I drive, after being a daily MARTA rider for 8 months. On MARTA, it took me an hour, and by the time I gave up, there was a major (more than 20 minute) delay about every 5-6 days. Since I've been driving (3 years this past May), my personal OTP has been 100%, literally every. single. day. And it only takes me 20 minutes. You may be content to sit on transit for however long it takes, 3 hours one way if you want, and I actually respect that. I respect people who are dedicated to a cause and walk the walk instead of just talking the talk. But that's not remotely close to a majority of people, most just want to get from A to B as quickly as they can.

[jsvh]

Can you name a single city that has been "destroyed" / shrunk because of downsizing roads / more transit?

There are plenty of cities that overbuilt for cars and basically collapsed such as "motor city".

And yes, commute time matters (in addition to price). But we need to be thinking about the long-term here.

Your car commute will continue to get more and more traffic filled and slower as more and more people move here.

With transit more and more people mean faster commutes since they in turn support increased train frequency and routes.

The question is when to build that transit. How far in advance to we want to start working towards that transition.

We should not "build the dang transit already!" if people are not willing to give up the dedicated RoW. There is no point if that transit is going to have to sit in that same traffic. And there is simply not the money to dig massive tunnels and put it all underground. Let people sit in traffic and think about it a little longer if they are not ready to transition that corridor towards transit & walk-ability.

We need to be thinking long-term here and stop half-way doing transit mixed in traffic.

[MattCW]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Can you name a single city that has been "destroyed" / shrunk because of downsizing roads / more transit?

Again, it's not downsizing the roads, it'd downsizing them BEFORE the transit it in place. But go ahead, name your examples, we'll see just what they've done and where they've done it.

There are plenty of cities that overbuilt for cars and basically collapsed such as "motor city".

And yes, commute time matters (in addition to price). But we need to be thinking about the long-term here.

That's what I'm trying to do, but you just want to take from cars left and right without regard to current conditions and how they affect future conditions.

Your car commute will continue to get more and more traffic filled and slower as more and more people move here.

Which isn't being helped by people like you making "road diets" left and right on major thoroughfares before there's an alternative.

With transit more and more people mean faster commutes since they in turn support increased train frequency and routes.

The question is when to build that transit. How far in advance to we want to start working towards that transition.

We should not "build the dang transit already!" if people are not willing to give up the dedicated RoW. There is no point if that transit is going to have to sit in that same traffic. And there is simply not the money to dig massive tunnels and put it all underground. Let people sit in traffic and think about it a little longer if they are not ready to transition that corridor towards transit & walk-ability.

We need to be thinking long-term here and stop half-way doing transit mixed in traffic.

But each area is different which for some reason you refuse to acknowledge. I already stated in this thread, I think each highway could stand to lose a lane for high capacity transit. Also, I think they could convert Edgewood and Auburn to one-way and dedicate one lane to the streetcar. But that's for those areas specifically. You consitently refuse to see anything but as black and white which isn't reality.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by MattCW

But each area is different which for some reason you refuse to acknowledge. I already stated in this thread, I think each highway could stand to lose a lane for high capacity transit. Also, I think they could convert Edgewood and Auburn to one-way and dedicate one lane to the streetcar. But that's for those areas specifically. You consitently refuse to see anything but as black and white which isn't reality.

Glad we agree on those examples at least. Since we have already derailed this thread enough, I will just leave it there.

[Will Dockery]

Originally Posted by Atlwarrior

The one on International Blvd. was much better and the current ATL Station is way to busy to be operating like a third world nation facility. It’s a freakin huge trailer for crying out loud.
Furthermore who cares about other cities in this case. I’m talking about ATL.

Sad that the Greyhound Station I knew and remember from the early 1980s must be long gone by now... I used to catch the bus on Friday evenings after work in Columbus, ride the express to Atlanta, then catch the Marta up on Peachtree Street over to Ansley Mall area to visit family... then do the sameon Sunday evening to get back to work on Monday morning. It was a smooth, enjoyable ride... I haven't done anything like that in nearly forty years now.

[Will Dockery]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Can you name a single city that has been "destroyed" / shrunk because of downsizing roads / more transit?

There are plenty of cities that overbuilt for cars and basically collapsed such as "motor city".

And yes, commute time matters (in addition to price). But we need to be thinking about the long-term here.

Your car commute will continue to get more and more traffic filled and slower as more and more people move here.

With transit more and more people mean faster commutes since they in turn support increased train frequency and routes.

The question is when to build that transit. How far in advance to we want to start working towards that transition.

We should not "build the dang transit already!" if people are not willing to give up the dedicated RoW. There is no point if that transit is going to have to sit in that same traffic. And there is simply not the money to dig massive tunnels and put it all underground. Let people sit in traffic and think about it a little longer if they are not ready to transition that corridor towards transit & walk-ability.

We need to be thinking long-term here and stop half-way doing transit mixed in traffic.

Good points.

[1lifealex]

There currently building a new greyhound station if no one knew, it's actually almost complete

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by 1lifealex

There currently building a new greyhound station if no one knew, it's actually almost complete

Yep.

[Rendering] Greyhound To Build New Bus Terminal Downtown -
Across four phases a new bus station will rise from the ground up as existing terminal gets demolished, becomes parking. (What Now Atlanta)

Greyhound Downtown Atlanta Terminal — Niles Bolton Associates

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by Born 2 Roll

Yep.

[Rendering] Greyhound To Build New Bus Terminal Downtown -
Across four phases a new bus station will rise from the ground up as existing terminal gets demolished, becomes parking. (What Now Atlanta)

Greyhound Downtown Atlanta Terminal — Niles Bolton Associates

Thanks, B2R. That looks pretty durn nice!

[Atlwarrior]

Originally Posted by Born 2 Roll

Yep.

[Rendering] Greyhound To Build New Bus Terminal Downtown -
Across four phases a new bus station will rise from the ground up as existing terminal gets demolished, becomes parking. (What Now Atlanta)

Greyhound Downtown Atlanta Terminal — Niles Bolton Associates

Glad to see this; it looks like Megabus is moving from Civic Center and will use the facility as well. I sure do miss the old Greyhound bus station with the Burger King inside of the terminal. I love that connection to Garnett Station.

I'm not sure turning the old facility into a parking area is the best use. I would not feel comfortable leaving my car in that area overnight.