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Well, I debate with kdbrich. I'm used to one-sentence replies to one-page posts...
You're correct, rifleman: at this point there is nothing more to say.
I'd kinda forgotten about good old kd. Thanks for the reminder, Rox!
So! kd! Does this poster impress you as a good Christian Scientist? (I'm no longer refering to him as The Good Doctor because, apparently, he's not, so much...)
He didn't answer the point by point questions that have been asked by several posters and that characterize rational philosophical debate.
He spent, oh, maybe 5 minutes simply dismissing polite inquiries that took, literally, hours of deliberate careful and respectful thought.
Interestingly, while I have always been able to find PhDs in Google searches on line, along with notes of their specialties, a Google of this guy produced nothing. So I politely asked him where, when, and a link to his Thesis. his response? Nada. Cereal Box Academia?
Even if he IS a theoretical physicist, his points, even to a non-scientific person, should be obviously facetious. Look at some of my and Roxolan's questions. They have nothing to do with science or religiopn, but were simply philosophical. Those specious, mis-leading statements by mb ared THE SOLE BASIS for his subsequent proclamation that, "thus, there is a God".
Sorry.. This surely isn't the "Proof" you guys are looking for.
Just as a last, again, strictly philosophical point, I'll ask you, kd, some basic point questions. Please... I'm not trying to corner or insult anyone:
1. Christian believers obviously need no new proof of God's existance, yes or no.
2. Any thread under such a title as this one is, ergo, an attempt, either honestly or as a baiting troll, to convince atheists that there IS, after all, a God, THE God. Yes or no. (I mean, that's OK with me).
3. From that perspective, you'd assume the original poster would want and be able to discuss, defend, even, possibly, revise the target audience's state of belief. Yes or no.
4. Given all that, all your honest answers should have been "yes", wouldn't you agree?
So. Would you call this one a success at any possible level then? Something that Christians should proudly point to?
I really would like to hear your answers to these questions, kd. And/or other Christians who have been reading along or commenting.
Remember, my questions are philosophical, not related to one's spiritual belief. I'd just like to know if you guys can see how badly Biagini represented his, or any, argument. Perhaps you thought it was a masterful presentation?
Last edited by rifleman; 01-22-2009 at 10:49 AM..
Reason: typos
We can pray for whatever we desire, yet it is up to God to honor those request. I have seen some real dramatic answers to prayer myself. Yet in recent days, it appears God is answering prayers not seen since the time of the Bible.
Here's something interesting I came across today. The Religious Tolerance site conducted a survey study (only about 80 or so people) asking people's opinions on same-sex marriage (Y or N), then asking them to pray to God about same-sex marriage to ask whether God approved or not. The questionnaire asked whether they had a response from God, what the response was and how certain they were that it was from God.
The survey also asked what the person's religion was and whether they considered themselves liberal, mainstream or conservative.
Interestingly, in almost EVERY case, the people reported that what God told them about same sex marriage was the same as their own opinions.
Most conservatives disagreed with same-sex marriage and reported that God told them when they prayed that he was against it.
Most liberals agreed with same-sex marriage and reported that God told them when they prayed that he agreed with same sex marriage.
Here's something interesting I came across today. The Religious Tolerance site conducted a survey study (only about 80 or so people) asking people's opinions on same-sex marriage (Y or N), then asking them to pray to God about same-sex marriage to ask whether God approved or not. The questionnaire asked whether they had a response from God, what the response was and how certain they were that it was from God.
The survey also asked what the person's religion was and whether they considered themselves liberal, mainstream or conservative.
Interestingly, in almost EVERY case, the people reported that what God told them about same sex marriage was the same as their own opinions.
Most conservatives disagreed with same-sex marriage and reported that God told them when they prayed that he was against it.
Most liberals agreed with same-sex marriage and reported that God told them when they prayed that he agreed with same sex marriage.
Well many years ago I came home after I failed a job interview, and was heading up the stairs to my bedroom. When I was about half way up the stairs I heard a clear voice speak to me and say. "Tom, you did everthing but pray about getting a job." So rather than go to my room, I went to my moms bedroom and I knelt down by the bed and said a short prayer. I just told Jesus I needed a job, and said what ever happens now Jesus will be because of you. And then I said Amen. As soon as I said the (A) of Amen, the phone next to me began to ring. When I pick up the phone the man on the other end asked me if my name was Tom Campbell, I said it was. He then stated that he had just picked up some paper work that I had left on his desk from two week before, and asked me if I could start work for their company the next monday morning at 8 A.M. I did. And I worked that job for a year, and I was able to buy a car and it helped me pay for a school I wanted to attend. I have seen God work like this on other occasions.
Well many years ago I came home after I failed a job interview, and was heading up the stairs to my bedroom. When I was about half way up the stairs I heard a clear voice speak to me and say. "Tom, you did everthing but pray about getting a job." So rather than go to my room, I went to my moms bedroom and I knelt down by the bed and said a short prayer. I just told Jesus I needed a job, and said what ever happens now Jesus will be because of you. And then I said Amen. As soon as I said the (A) of Amen, the phone next to me began to ring. When I pick up the phone the man on the other end asked me if my name was Tom Campbell, I said it was. He then stated that he had just picked up some paper work that I had left on his desk from two week before, and asked me if I could start work for their company the next monday morning at 8 A.M. I did. And I worked that job for a year, and I was able to buy a car and it helped me pay for a school I wanted to attend. I have seen God work like this on other occasions.
Draw your own conclusions.
The story you relate is quite common place to me. Events that were much more unlikely and had very positive outcomes have happened to me quite often. Some of the chains of events have been quite astounding. But I don't pray or believe in a god.
So either your God really loves this atheist lesbian mother, or it was the power of positive thinking that influenced lots of minor decisions that resulted in events occuring, or it was just coincidence.
So what did you think of the study above?
And what did you think of the idea of a study of 10,000 amputees all praying to God to regrow their limbs?
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So! In summary then, before we retire....
Something that Christians should proudly point to?
"Heeeeeerrrrzzzzzz....... DOC---TOR JAAAAAAYYYY!!!!"
