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John Lennon was never the least bit humble. Being a great musician (like a great anything else), doesn’t necessarily mean you’re a great person. I can’t blame Julian the least bit for being resentful towards his father. IIRC, the other Beatles stepped in and were surrogate father figures to varying degrees. While I don’t know if I’d call the other Beatles humble (George probably comes closest), they seem like fairly decent people in their public and private lives. John Lennon was a narcissist.
bold above is putting ordinary flawed human beings on a pedestal.
and as such is a gushing overstatement by an apparent fan, and patently inaccurate.
"hypocrite" is the word that comes to mind. because abuse, violence, and drug addiction were the lived reality of John Lennon as a person. the above post is an example of idolizing, and as such conveniently ignores, well, the reality of how he lived his life.
"The gentle icon the hippies worshipped was actually a man with very serious psychological problems who often flew into uncontrollable fits of rage, which he took out on the women in his life." He was a heroin addict who multiple times was hospitalized and relapsed.
"The man who sang “imagine no possessions” lived a millionaire’s life in a posh New York hotel. The man who sang “imagine no religion” was obsessed with every spiritual and New Age fad that came his way, including Hindu meditation, the I-Ching, and astrology of all kinds. The man who sang “all you need is love” was a bitter, violent, and angry man who abused his family and friends. The man who praised having “nothing to kill or die for” helped finance and publicize radical groups who extolled the use of violence. Quite literally, everything his fans see personified in the icon of John Lennon represents the ideals the man himself either couldn’t or wouldn’t live up to."
this example of non-humbleness is one that is well known, When John Lennon’s ‘More Popular Than Jesus’ Controversy Turned Ugly: How an offhand remark led to protests, death threats and the end of the Beatles' touring career
"Christianity will go,” Lennon said. “It will vanish and shrink. I needn’t argue about that; I’m right and I will be proved right. We’re more popular than Jesus now; I don’t know which will go first—rock ’n’ roll or Christianity. Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. It’s them twisting it that ruins it for me.” As Cleave noted in the profile, Lennon had been using his time off from Beatles commitments to read about religion."
Lennon died a violent death at age 40.
Well of course the likes of John Lennon was a flawed human being.
Nobody has ever said he was a secular or religious Saint or something.
Many of his songs were about capturing the popular culture of the times.
His comments about “the Beatles being bigger than Jesus” were taken out of context.
Ironically the man that shot him, Mark Chapman, cited this comment and will probably never be released for this heinously violent and premeditated crime. (his next parole hearing is next year)
bold above is putting ordinary flawed human beings on a pedestal.
and as such is a gushing overstatement by an apparent fan, and patently inaccurate.
"hypocrite" is the word that comes to mind. because abuse, violence, and drug addiction were the lived reality of John Lennon as a person. the above post is an example of idolizing, and as such conveniently ignores, well, the reality of how he lived his life.
"The gentle icon the hippies worshipped was actually a man with very serious psychological problems who often flew into uncontrollable fits of rage, which he took out on the women in his life." He was a heroin addict who multiple times was hospitalized and relapsed.
"The man who sang “imagine no possessions” lived a millionaire’s life in a posh New York hotel. The man who sang “imagine no religion” was obsessed with every spiritual and New Age fad that came his way, including Hindu meditation, the I-Ching, and astrology of all kinds. The man who sang “all you need is love” was a bitter, violent, and angry man who abused his family and friends. The man who praised having “nothing to kill or die for” helped finance and publicize radical groups who extolled the use of violence. Quite literally, everything his fans see personified in the icon of John Lennon represents the ideals the man himself either couldn’t or wouldn’t live up to."
this example of non-humbleness is one that is well known, When John Lennon’s ‘More Popular Than Jesus’ Controversy Turned Ugly: How an offhand remark led to protests, death threats and the end of the Beatles' touring career
"Christianity will go,” Lennon said. “It will vanish and shrink. I needn’t argue about that; I’m right and I will be proved right. We’re more popular than Jesus now; I don’t know which will go first—rock ’n’ roll or Christianity. Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. It’s them twisting it that ruins it for me.” As Cleave noted in the profile, Lennon had been using his time off from Beatles commitments to read about religion."
Has any other group in the history of popular music ever had a religion built around them as did the Beatles? Even today. some 50 years after they disbanded, they still hold people under this religious spell. Lennon MAY have been taken out of context when he referred to the Beatles as being bigger than Jesus. But, from the fanatical response given to them (and this was BEFORE they had proven themselves as capable songwriters!) Lennon WAS correct.
All the Beatles had to do back in the day was to appear onstage where the screaming and the bedlam drowned out any actual musical ability they might possess. Few actually cared about 'the music'. The Beatles had become bigger than "just music". And all of this occurred within a very short span of time. That's all it took for the publicity and the marketing mill to work its magic on the gullible public. The Beatles had become gods. No doubt about it! And yet, they were just 4 average musicians who had been heavily influenced by American music and the vocal harmony styles of other popular singers of the day such as the Everly Brothers.
Yes, Lennon was correct. The Beatles WERE bigger than Jesus! Lennon was not only narcissistic. He was also smart and used sarcasm quite freely whenever he spoke. To him, the public were just mere plebs. He was basically mocking the gullibility of the masses that the designed Beatles publicity and marketing campaign had created. Even Lennon the narcissist was taken by surprise at the results of this campaign.
I watched all of this from afar and shook my head in disbelief. How COULD so many millions of people be so caught up in the hype and the resulting hysteria of a band who had, at the time, only 3 or 4 records under their belt? They hadn't even had to prove themselves worthy of attaining this status. Thousands and thousands and thousands of people in the U.S. lined up to cheer, to scream, to faint and to worship as these four guys were paraded through the streets as though having arrived from heaven. Again ...this adulation of the group by the masses at this time had NOTHING to do with MUSIC! 'The fans' were under the influence of mass hypnosis as created by the popular media ...just as intended!
Paul McCartney recently (on the Stephen Colbert Show) agreed with the term 'genius' that was applied to him by Colbert as the audience rose from their seats to pay homage to this man who had done nothing more than to write and record songs that became popular. Had not MANY previous songwriters and musicians done the very same thing but without all of the hype? Do we seriously believe that the Beatles* and they alone were the only musicians in the history of music worthy of such adulation for having written and recorded songs?
YES, many people DID and DO believe this!
Even interviews by the individual members of the Beatles, particularly those of Harrison, and especially, those by Lennon, are interpreted by their adoring fans as being pretty much comparable to "the Sermon on the Mount".
I realize that this thread has gone beyond a discussion on My Sweet Lord being a "Really Nice Song". However, the Beatles phenomenon probably does belong in the 'Religious forum' since it pretty much qualifies. People worshiped the Beatles as if gods. Some people still do.
*Actually the songwriting ability of the Beatles applied predominantly to Lennon and McCartney. Harrison for the most part contributed little. As for Ringo, well . . .?
Last edited by RomulusXXV; 04-08-2023 at 09:13 PM..
Has any other group in the history of popular music ever had a religion built around them as did the Beatles? Even today. some 50 years after they disbanded, they still hold people under this religious spell. Lennon MAY have been taken out of context when he referred to the Beatles as being bigger than Jesus. But, from the fanatical response given to them (and this was BEFORE they had proven themselves as capable songwriters!) Lennon WAS correct.
All the Beatles had to do back in the day was to appear onstage where the screaming and the bedlam drowned out any actual musical ability they might possess. Few actually cared about 'the music'. The Beatles had become bigger than "just music". And all of this occurred within a very short span of time. That's all it took for the publicity and the marketing mill to work its magic on the gullible public. The Beatles had become gods. No doubt about it! And yet, they were just 4 average musicians who had been heavily influenced by American music and the vocal harmony styles of other popular singers of the day such as the Everly Brothers.
Yes, Lennon was correct. The Beatles WERE bigger than Jesus! Lennon was not only narcissistic. He was also smart and used sarcasm quite freely whenever he spoke. To him, the public were just mere plebs. He was basically mocking the gullibility of the masses that the designed Beatles publicity and marketing campaign had created. Even Lennon the narcissist was taken by surprise at the results of this campaign.
I watched all of this from afar and shook my head in disbelief. How COULD so many millions of people be so caught up in the hype and the resulting hysteria of a band who had, at the time, only 3 or 4 records under their belt? They hadn't even had to prove themselves worthy of attaining this status. Thousands and thousands and thousands of people in the U.S. lined up to cheer, to scream, to faint and to worship as these four guys were paraded through the streets as though having arrived from heaven. Again ...this adulation of the group by the masses at this time had NOTHING to do with MUSIC! 'The fans' were under the influence of mass hypnosis as created by the popular media ...just as intended!
Paul McCartney recently (on the Stephen Colbert Show) agreed with the term 'genius' that was applied to him by Colbert as the audience rose from their seats to pay homage to this man who had done nothing more than to write and record songs that became popular. Had not MANY previous songwriters and musicians done the very same thing but without all of the hype? Do we seriously believe that the Beatles* and they alone were the only musicians in the history of music worthy of such adulation for having written and recorded songs?
YES, many people DID and DO believe this!
Even interviews by the individual members of the Beatles, particularly those of Harrison, and especially, those by Lennon, are interpreted by their adoring fans as being pretty much comparable to "the Sermon on the Mount".
I realize that this thread has gone beyond a discussion on My Sweet Lord being a "Really Nice Song". However, the Beatles phenomenon probably does belong in the 'Religious forum' since it pretty much qualifies. People worshiped the Beatles as if gods. Some people still do.
*Actually the songwriting ability of the Beatles applied predominantly to Lennon and McCartney. Harrison for the most part contributed little. As for Ringo, well . . .?
Yes some pretty good points about the Beatles and popular culture and music.
George Harrison didn’t come into his own as a songwriter and musician until late in the piece, but he was held back a bit by the Lennon-McCartney partnership being so prolific.
George’s later Beatles and solo work was and is as good as anyone as a musician , and he combined that with the influences of Eastern religion and music.
His work with Ravi Shankar and Indian instruments, shows this very deep and spiritual side to him and in his music.
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